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znModeratorI just dont see how Prisco and others can ignore the
Seattle and Denver examples. Seems to me they are ignoring
the fact that there are many roads to the mountaintop.Oh I could not agree more. It’s just strange that these guys got this dogma in their heads to the point where reality doesn’t manage to squeak by.
Yes, there are many different roads up the big hill. And a play action offense complementing a top defense is one of those roads.
Now, they will have a play action offense with a top-picked qb, which makes it even better.
You know if you let me start everything from scratch and allowed me to put in what I like most, I am a longtime fan of Coryell style aggressive passing offenses. I even lived in both St. Louis and San Diego in their respective Coryell days.
BUT I don’t need things to be my favorite…and so I recognize the value of play-action + defense style teams.
It’s not better, it’s not worse, it;s just one choice among choices. It works too. Like every other approach you just need personnel and decent execution.
I am always baffled by this argument that there is only one modern offense and Fisher (plus Kubiak plus Carrol) don’t “get it.”
Bah humbug. It’s just another approach and it works too.
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znModeratorOdds on hitting a 3rd round qb? I will look at 20 years, 94 to 2013 (to 2013 cause that’s far enough back to know).
In that period, 24 qbs were taken in the 3rd round. Of those, I count only Schaub and Wilson as hits (Foles, I can’t bring myself to count…he fell apart too early in his career).
So that’s 2 out of 24. 8.3%.
How about qbs picked 1st in round 1? Going back 40 years, to 74.
I count 18 total picked. I count 4 misses out of 18 — Couch, Vick (though that one’s complicated), Carr, and Russel. So it’s 77.8% hits.
That’s 8.3% v. 77.8%
Another take on the same kinda thing.
==
from off the net
==
Ramsey…
For those of you who are upset that we sold the FARM for “THE ARM” , think upon this…
Since Terry Bradshaw was drafted #1 in 1970, 21 QB’s have been drafted with the first pick of the draft. Let’s take a quick peek at those 21 QB’s.
16 out 21 of these #1 drafted QB’s were ALL Pro. So, If the past predicts the future, then the odds of the Ram’s drafting a future ALL Pro QB are 76%! So many Superbowl appearances.
16 Superbowl Championships!
The odds of a pedestrian QB taking a team to the Superbowl are extremely low.
No matter what, the most expensive position ‘QB” will be CHEAP for 5 years, thus allowing the Rams to substitute free agency signings for our missed drafted picks. I’m not a big fan of free agency, but I got a feeling we will sign a major wide receiver within a year or two.
The majority of our young roster is on the fringe of their prime years, and now we will have a franchise QB to Our Rams into the playoffs and beyond.
April 14, 2016 at 6:42 pm in reply to: informal poll–for or against trading up? trading down? staying put? #41915znModeratorWell now it’s in the past tense.
Not, are you for or against them possibly trading up?
Now it;s do you approve or disapprove of the trade up?
znModeratorWV: he was drafted in the Third round. The seahawks
didnt give up a gazzilion premium picks for him.
They just chose wisely in the third round.Seattle knew the odds on a 3rd round pick at qb working out. That’s why they spent all that guaranteed money signing Flynn as a FA. So, same as Brady at 6, or Warner for nothing…it’s part luck with Wilson.
Odds on hitting a 3rd round qb? I will look at 20 years, 94 to 2013 (to 2013 cause that’s far enough back to know).
In that period, 24 qbs were taken in the 3rd round. Of those, I count only Schaub and Wilson as hits (Foles, I can’t bring myself to count…he fell apart too early in his career).
So that’s 2 out of 24. 8.3%.
How about qbs picked 1st in round 1? Going back 40 years, to 74.
I count 18 total picked. I count 4 misses out of 18 — Couch, Vick (though that one’s complicated), Carr, and Russel. So it’s 77.8% hits.
That’s 8.3% v. 77.8%.
I’ll take those odds.
znModeratorWhat if Mannion outplays the rookie QB
in preseason?It would be a best case scenario.
First, it would be no shock if a 1-year vet outplayed a rookie.
Second, a team with 2 viable young qbs? Dream come true. They let the rookie sit and learn, play the more experienced qb, then trade him in 2017.
What would be not to like?
znModeratorRams gave up a lot less than they got four years ago
Mike Florio
Rams gave up a lot less than they got four years ago
It would be fitting for Titans G.M. Jon Robinson to now scrawl on a whiteboard, “Build to dominate using Ram picks!” After all, that’s what Rams G.M. Les Snead did after fleecing Washington out of the No. 6 pick, two first-round picks, and a second-round selection in exchange for the deal that allowed Washington to draft its supposed franchise quarterback with the No. 2 overall pick.
But the Rams had now moved much farther — from No. 15 to No. 1 — to grab the team’s supposed franchise quarterback. And, relatively speaking, they gave up a lot less.
In addition to the 15th pick, the Rams gave up two second-round picks, a 2017 first-round pick, and a 2017 third-round pick. They also are receiving a fourth-round pick and a sixth-round pick from the Titans this year.
So the Rams got two first-rounders and a second-round pick to drop down four spots for Griffin, and they’re giving up a first-rounder, two second-rounders, a third-rounder — and getting back a four and a six — to move up from No. 15 to No. 1.
That’s a jump of 15 spots, from the middle of round one to the very top. For a package of picks that isn’t nearly as potent as what the Rams got for giving up the No. 2 pick in 2012, especially since the 2012 first-rounder they was nine spots higher than the pick the Titans will get.
The move underscores the importance of having a franchise quarterback, and the difficulty of finding one. The best way to even have a chance at getting one comes from picking at the top of the draft, and the Rams now have that power — courtesy of the franchise that Rams coach Jeff Fisher led for a generation.
Still, if quarterback Carson Wentz fails to pan out for Fisher, chances are he’ll be coaching the Rams for a lot less than a generation. If Wentz flat-out busts, Fisher may not be coaching the Rams by the time the last of the picks sent to Tennessee are even used
znModeratorHuge flop or not, Rams had to make this deal to try to get a franchise QB
Pete Prisco
Sustainable success in the NFL comes one of two ways: With a franchise quarterback who can carry a team on his back or with an all-time great defense made up of players who are young and cheap. But even that shelf life is limited before that unit is picked apart by the free agency vultures.
So long-term success comes mainly with a top-tier — dare we say elite? — quarterback.
That’s why the move by the Los Angeles Rams to trade up to the top spot in this year’s NFL Draft, with an eye on either North Dakota State quarterback Carson Wentz of Cal’s Jared Goff, isn’t as crazy as it seems.
The Rams sent their first-round pick this year, 15th overall, their first next year, two second-round picks this year, theirs and one they got from the Eagles, and a third-round pick in 2016 to the Tennessee Titans for the first overall pick. The Titans also threw in two picks this year, a fourth-round choice and one in the sixth round.
It might seem like a ransom for that No. 1 pick, and it’s a good move for the Titans, who already have what they think is a franchise passer in Marcus Mariota. But ask yourselves this question: Why have the Packers, Patriots and Steelers been mentioned as possible Super Bowl teams every year the past decade, no matter what? It’s the guys taking the snaps.
Tom Brady has won four rings and the Patriots are the favorites in Vegas heading into 2016. The Steelers and Packers are both legitimate contenders again because of Ben Roethlisberger and Aaron Rodgers, who have three rings between them.
The Super Bowl-champion Broncos have issues now. Why? Quarterback. They still have that dominant defense, but the quarterback uncertainty makes them look anything like a team that will repeat. PS: Their all-time great defense was picked apart in free agency.
That’s why this makes sense for the Rams. They have some nice pieces in place. They have a dominant runner in Todd Gurley, who they drafted in the first round last year. They have some stars on defense in end Robert Quinn and tackle Aaron Donald.
What the Rams don’t have is a legitimate NFL starter at quarterback. The Rams were 29th in total offense last year, and 32nd in passing. Somehow they went 7-9 in a league where passing is king and teams threw it more than they ever have last season.
That speaks to the talent of the defense in a physical division with two playoff teams in Arizona and Seattle.
Even if you or me or any Twitter draft expert might not think Goff or Wentz are worth the move, the Rams obviously do.
We know coach Jeff Fisher loves to run the football. I once debated him about the running game at a league meeting, and I asked him what a running team can do when they drive it 50 yards on the ground, then end up with a holding penalty.
“Run it harder,” Fisher said.
That’s his approach. It won’t change. But if he can run it, then drive the ball with play-action passes down the field, maybe it can work. To be honest, I think he needs an overhaul to his style of play. And if you make a deal like this to get a franchise passer, it has to become his team.
Like Brady. Like Rodgers. Like Roethlisberger.
Whoever the Rams draft, whether it’s Goff or Wentz, that player faces unreal scrutiny. The deal up makes it that way. The new city, the glitz and glamour of Los Angeles, will only enhance the pressure to be great.
B-movies don’t win Oscars in Hollywood.
B-quarterbacks won’t have sustainable success there either.
I asked some league personnel people around the league about their reactions to the trade Thursday, and some of the reactions were what I expected. Several of those I asked said it was a move that general manager Les Snead and Fisher had to make. They are 27-39-1 in their four seasons together. There was some talk they could be in trouble after last season. They haven’t won more than seven games in a season with the Rams.
“They are getting fired if they don’t make it, and they will get fired if Wentz sucks,” one personnel director said. “They had to go all-in.”
Another simply said they bought themselves four more years.
If you look at the quarterbacks drafted first overall since the AFL-NFL merger, there are a lot of stars on the list, but also some busts. The Rams actually took Sam Bradford first overall in 2010, and that didn’t work out in large part because of injuries. He’s now the Eagles quarterback.
Here are the other quarterbacks who have gone first overall since the merger: Terry Bradshaw, Jim Plunkett, Steve Bartkowski, John Elway, Vinny Testaverde, Troy Aikman, Jeff George, Drew Bledsoe, Peyton Manning, Tim Couch, Mike Vick, David Carr, Carson Palmer, Eli Manning, Alex Smith, JaMarcus Russell, Matthew Stafford, Cam Newton, Andrew Luck and Jameis Winston.
There are 15 Super Bowl victories in that group and four who would be considered busts (George, Carr, Russell and Couch). Yes, guys like Smith and Testaverde played some of their best football with teams that didn’t draft them, but you get the point.
The risk is worth it.
If Wentz or Goff becomes Aikman or either of the Mannings or Elway or one of the greats, the deal is a damn good one for the Rams — and could be great for both, depending on how the Titans do with their haul.
If the passer they pick is a bust, then it will be the Robert Griffin III deal all over again — only this time, the Rams will be on the bad side of a mega-trade. When Griffin flopped in Washington, after the Redskins gave the Rams a haul to move up, the Rams could gloat.
In three years, it might be the Titans gloating.
Or, if the quarterback is the real deal, Snead and Fisher might be the ones smirking as they look at their reflection in their Lombardi Trophy.
It’s a passers and pass-rushers league. The Rams have their pass rushers. Now they might have their franchise passer too.
znModeratorTitans win big, 49ers hurt in blockbuster deal for top pick
John Clayton
To win over the Los Angeles market, the Rams made the bold move to trade for the No. 1 pick to take a quarterback.
Moves this big create winners and losers. Let’s go to the scoreboard:
Winners
Tennessee Titans: The Titans were in an uncomfortable position at No. 1 because they didn’t need to draft a left tackle, quarterback or pass-rusher, and it might have been tough to take defensive back Jalen Ramsey there. They now have six picks in the first three rounds — four in the first two — plus a No. 1 and a No. 3 next year. They got a huge haul.
Jared Goff: Even if the Rams take Carson Wentz with the top pick, Goff has a great chance to go to the Cleveland Browns at No. 2. The trade reminds teams the value of a quarterback and might eliminate any second thoughts of Cleveland passing on a QB with the second pick.
San Diego Chargers and Dallas Cowboys: With two quarterbacks almost certainly going in the first two picks, the Chargers and Cowboys, who own the third and fourth overall picks, know they have their choice of the top non-QBs in the draft.
Denver Broncos: Although this pretty well ends the Colin Kaepernick trade option, it could allow Paxton Lynch to become more of an option for Denver. Had the Rams stayed at the No. 15 pick, they might have taken Lynch there. It’s possible he could drop to the Broncos at No. 31 or be close enough to acquire in a trade. The trade also could put Nick Foles on John Elway’s radar if the Rams cut him.
Philadelphia Eagles QB Sam Bradford: At least he doesn’t have to worry about the Eagles trading up to take a quarterback. Owner Jeff Lurie went along with the front office, which has evaluated the top quarterbacks in the draft. Bradford would be in a one-and-done situation if the Eagles draft a quarterback in the first round. Now he might have some stability.
Titans LT Taylor Lewan: With the Titans no longer in position to take Laremy Tunsil, Lewan doesn’t have to move to right tackle. If the Titans go for an offensive lineman in the draft, they can target a right tackle.
Losers
San Francisco 49ers and QB Colin Kaepernick: If Wentz and Goff go in the first two picks, the option of drafting a quarterback ends, unless the Niners reach to take Lynch at No. 7. That’s unlikely. Whether it’s uncomfortable or not, Kaepernick looks like he’s staying in San Francisco now that the second QB in the draft likely won’t fall to the seventh pick. If he really wants out, the 49ers now aren’t in a position to accommodate a trade, unless they can somehow get a second-round choice. They need to keep Kaepernick and Blaine Gabbert, which should please new coach Chip Kelly.
QB Nick Foles: With a rookie quarterback coming in and Case Keenum already ahead of him, Foles’ days with the Rams are near an end.
QB Paxton Lynch: With the Rams no longer at No. 15, Lynch doesn’t have a guarantee he would be drafted by the middle of the first round. At least he knows he’s the next quarterback teams will be targeting.
LT Laremy Tunsil: The Ole Miss star probably would have gone to the Titans with the first pick. Now he might fall to No. 6 unless the Chargers take him at No. 3. The Cowboys and Jaguars, who have the fourth and five picks, aren’t looking for a left tackle in the draft.
Rams draft junkies: What will they do in between Los Angeles’ picks? The Rams have the No. 1 pick, and then their next selection is in the fourth round, No. 110 overall. They’ll have to sit out Day 2 completely, though it will be worth it if they can hit on a quarterback at the top of the draft.
April 14, 2016 at 5:42 pm in reply to: Goff or Wentz? Wentz or Goff? Der Wentz oder Goff entscheidung #41905znModeratorConflicting reports on whether Rams prefer Goff or Wentz
Michael David Smith
Conflicting reports on whether Rams prefer Goff or Wentz
The Rams are doing everything they can to make the NFL draft suspenseful.
After trading up to the first overall pick today, different sources within the Rams are saying different things to different reporters about whether they plan to draft North Dakota State quarterback Carson Wentz or Cal quarterback Jared Goff.
The initial reports said the Rams were leaning toward Wentz, but Adam Schefter of ESPN is now reporting that the Rams are leaning toward Goff.
It seems unlikely that the Rams would trade up to the first overall pick before deciding which quarterback they want to take. It’s more likely that the Rams know who they’re taking but have decided to wait until draft day to announce it.
znModeratorRams betting big that top pick will become franchise QB
Nick Wagoner
There’s no such thing as a sure thing when it comes to the NFL draft, especially when it comes to picking quarterbacks. So the Los Angeles Rams move from No. 15 to No. 1 doesn’t come with any sort of money or draft pick back guarantee.
If the Tennessee Titans had been willing to throw in such a warranty, the Rams would have been wise to jump. Alas, the Rams now must spend the next two weeks trying to figure out whether North Dakota State’s Carson Wentz or Cal’s Jared Goff can become the quarterback they mortgaged so much of their future to acquire.
Unlike in 2012 when Andrew Luck was a safe bet for the Indianapolis Colts with the top pick or even last year when Jameis Winston and Marcus Mariota came with major NFL pedigrees and reputations as franchise building blocks, both Goff and Wentz head toward this draft with their share of question marks.
Carson Wentz and Jared Goff
The Rams’ move up to No. 1 indicates they believe Carson Wentz or Jared Goff can be a franchise quarterback.
Wentz played at FCS North Dakota State, leaving some to wonder if his performance will decline when facing top competition. Goff is a little smaller but comes from an “Air Raid” offense that didn’t ask him to handle NFL progressions.For frame of reference — though it’s not a hard-and-fast evaluation shared by all NFL teams — ESPN draft analyst Mel Kiper Jr. had Luck ranked first in 2012 with Winston and Mariota rated Nos. 4 and 5 on his final 2015 big board. Todd McShay also had Luck at No. 1 overall and had Winston first and Mariota fifth on his list of the top 32 players.
This year, Kiper has Goff ranked seventh and Wentz eighth, while McShay puts Wentz at No. 10 and Goff at No. 11. Even among other draft pundits and teams, there doesn’t seem be a consensus on whether Wentz or Goff is the better player, let alone the best player in this draft. Moments after the trade was announced, some draftniks reported the Rams were zeroed in on Goff at the same time others were saying the same thing about Wentz.
It’s hard to believe the Rams would make such a bold move all the way up to No. 1 and give up their first four picks this year and first- and third-rounders next year without already knowing which quarterback they prefer. At the very least, the Rams have to be convinced that both Goff and Wentz are worth the price.
Former NFL coach Rick Venturi, who knows a thing or two about big draft trades, believes the Rams have two good options even if neither is as complete as Winston or Mariota or among the five best players overall in the draft.
“There’s five freaks in the draft when you get into the Myles Jacks, the [Jalen] Ramseys, some of those guys, I think they’re freaks,” Venturi said. “But I will say that you can’t go anywhere without a quarterback. You can have a really good team but really you can’t go anywhere. And the Rams are competitive enough week in and week out with their defense and their running game, their running back is tremendous, that if they were to get a guy who can win behind the center then you are going to solidify for a real long time.”
Venturi has been on both sides of big draft trades, working for the Colts when they traded away the rights to quarterback John Elway in 1983 and then for the Saints when they gave up their entire draft and premium picks the following year to move up for running back Ricky Williams in 1999.
“Honestly, you are going to have to invest to get that guy,” Venturi said. “Now, that’s a tremendous investment, I have to get my grips on that, that’s maybe even more than we gave up for Ricky Williams, I think, I know it’s a hell of a lot more than we got for Elway in ’83. But like I said, you are not going to go anywhere without a quarterback so whether a guy is a freak or not, in that sense, I don’t think those freaks are also graded all that much higher than those two guys either.”
Neither Wentz nor Goff comes with the same hype as Elway or Williams, but they still could become the long-term answer at quarterback the Rams need. In fact, Venturi is a believer in both players.
“I really like both of these kids,” Venturi said. “I don’t think you can go wrong with either one. I like Wentz a little bit better. Both of them are great kids. Goff has a great release. Goff, people can say whatever they want but he took a terrible team and made it competitive. Wentz has won, I give him a little advantage too, that’s a real pro-style offense at North Dakota State. But if you said to me, that you will take one and I take the other guy, I’d be OK with that, too. But I really like these two guys. I think you’ve got two guys you can win with and build with, honestly.”
That could turn out to be the case but for their sake, it’s now imperative that the Rams do whatever is necessary to make sure they get the right one.
znModerator.There is no one on Fisher’s staff that can up-coach this kid and have him ready to play in Game one, or build a game plan where he can succeed right away, in my opinion.
Disagree strongly with that one.
I don’t buy into the arguments that this is some retrograde, backwards coaching staff.
I think the fact they went 7-9 with a young plus injured up OL and a melted down qb is testimony to how much better this staff is than many seem to think.
znModeratorThe Play for No. 1: Inside the Titans-Rams Trade
Peter King
http://mmqb.si.com/mmqb/2016/04/14/titans-rams-draft-trade-number-1-pick
A major move at the top of the draft, as the Titans trade the No. 1 pick to the Rams, who are surely lined up to take a potential franchise quarterback for their first season back in Los Angeles
Did the Rams overpay for the No. 1 overall pick in the NFL Draft?
Peter King breaks down the historic trade between the Rams and Titans that resulted in Los Angeles moving up to No. 1 in the upcoming 2016 NFL Draft.Conversations between Rams GM Les Snead and his rookie Tennessee counterpart, Jon Robinson, began March 28 at the Ole Miss pro day, with Robinson there to eyeball the Titans’ presumptive top pick in the 2016 NFL draft, tackle Laremy Tunsil. Snead wanted to know what it would take for the Rams to move up from their No. 15 spot in the first round to get the first pick overall.
Robinson knew a couple of things in assessing his chance to move. He knew the Titans needed a slew of help all over the roster. And he knew Snead, who has been the boldest trader in and around draft day in his four drafts running the Rams, would do something bold. The Rams totaled an astonishing eight trades in the top 50 picks of the previous four drafts.
Talks heated up during the day Wednesday, when the Rams sent the final proposal, and when Robinson and Snead agreed on the terms of one of the biggest draft trades in NFL history: The Rams get the first pick overall in the April 28 draft, plus Tennessee’s fourth- and sixth-round picks. The Titans get the Rams’ top four picks this year (a first, two seconds and a third), plus Los Angeles’s first- and third-round picks in 2017.
Rams GM Snead (center) gave up plenty but now can choose between Wentz (left) and Goff (right) for L.A.’s new quarterback.
Photo: Getty Images (3)
Rams GM Snead (center) gave up plenty but now can choose between Wentz (left) and Goff (right) for L.A.’s new quarterback.The other day, one prominent GM in the league told me why he thought the Rams would move way up to pick a quarterback. He said they can’t compete in the NFC West (with Russell Wilson and Carson Palmer in place in Seattle and Arizona, respectively) without getting a quarterback. This was the text-message from this GM Thursday morning, upon hearing of the deal:
“Just like we said … Bravo, Rams.”The upshot of the trade that radically remade the 2016 NFL draft.
• The Titans own the next two drafts. Tennessee now has six picks in the top 76 of the 2016 draft—numbers 15, 33, 43, 45, 64 and 76. With many evaluators saying the meat of this draft is between 20 and 70,
Tennessee, depending on its board, could draft six players this year whom Robinson would consider starting-caliber. And the Titans set themselves up nicely for 2017—they’re the only team right now with two picks in the first round next year.• The Rams will take a quarterback No. 1. I can tell you a final decision has not been made as to which quarterback that will be. But they obviously felt that either Carson Wentz of North Dakota State or Jared Goff of Cal was capable of being the franchise quarterback the Rams have lacked during the Jeff Fisher era. The Rams did the precise opposite of what they did in in 2012, when they traded down four spots, allowing Washington to pick Robert Griffin III number two overall and capturing four high picks in return. The Rams moved up 14 spots his year to get a quarterback.
• To a much lesser degree, the two players who’d been in play at No. 1 for Tennessee, Tunsil and cornerback Jalen Ramsey of Florida State, now muck up the very top of the draft. One or both of them could be in play beyond the top two picks—and before this trade, no one could have said that.
It’s clear why Tennessee made this trade. Very clear, in fact. Robinson saw a team that needs help on the offensive line, in the secondary and on the pass-rush, and that needs a versatile playmaking linebacker … and he thought that subtracting one single player, a franchise tackle or corner, was worth the value of getting six choices in the first three rounds of the next two drafts. Who can blame him? Smart move for Robinson and the Titans.
• QUARTERBACK CAMP WITH CARSON WENTZ: Emily Kaplan went behind the scenes for the ND State passer’s session with Jon Gruden
But the Rams, the youngest team in football over the last four seasons and a team with many defensive pieces in place, knew they’d never catch quarterback-rich Seattle or Arizona in the NFC West with Case Keenum, Nick Foles or Sean Mannion atop their quarterback depth chart. In some ways, the price was the price. It’s ridiculously exorbitant, to be sure, but without a quarterback the Rams would face another season of fighting for third in a stacked division and putting off the inevitable search for a passer.This is a league with a greater emphasis on quarterback than ever. Teams threw the ball more often last year, and for more yardage, than in any previous season in the NFL’s 96-year history. That’s why I don’t think it was especially hard for Snead and Fisher and COO Kevin Demoff to pull the trigger on this deal. Brock Osweiler, with seven career starts and a lot of question marks, just got $18 million a year in Houston. That shows how desperate teams are to get fixed at quarterback. This trade shows that the Rams believe they’re a quarterback away—and when you watch their swarming defense some Sundays, it’s hard to argue with that logic.
Why now? Why not wait to try to get a better deal and give away less value to Tennessee? I think it’s because the Rams wanted two full weeks to investigate Goff and Wentz—to find out everything they can about each guy, on and off the field. The Rams are on the clock, and they two weeks of investigative time to spare.
znModeratorIt’s way too much.
But then…maybe they trade down again. There’s 3 qbs they could take, presumably, and maybe they trade down and take their guy after giving someone else a different guy.
znModeratorRams trade up to acquire No. 1 pick from Titans
Conor Orr NFL.com
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000652822/article/titans-have-traded-the-no1-pick-to-the-rams
The Tennessee Titans have agreed to terms to trade the No. 1 overall pick in the 2016 NFL Draft to the Los Angeles Rams.
In a stunning development that shakes up the top of the leaderboard and almost definitely gives the Rams their next quarterback of the future, the Titans ended the day with an impressive stable of picks. The Rams came up farther (No. 15) than any team in NFL history to acquire the No. 1 pick and that came at a steep price.
Tennessee gets: Rams first-round pick (2016), two second-round picks (2016) third-round pick (2016), first-round pick (2017), third-round pick (2017).
Rams get: Titans first overall pick (2016), Titans fourth-round pick (2016), Titans sixth-round pick (2016).
Around The NFL will have much more on the development shortly.
April 14, 2016 at 9:07 am in reply to: Goff or Wentz? Wentz or Goff? Der Wentz oder Goff entscheidung #41851znModeratorIan Rapoport @RapSheet
A few weeks ago, the #Rams worked out #NDSU QB Carson Wentz, source said. LA doing research on the top QBs, as well.znModerator–
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znModeratorApril 13, 2016 at 11:47 pm in reply to: Jon Gruden's QB Camp w/ Case Keenum 2012 (has morphed into "the keenum thread") #41846znModeratorfrom A look back at why Case Keenum went undrafted
Dane Brugler
October 18, 2013
Why did Keenum go undrafted? Below average size (6-1, 208), average-at-best arm strength and limited mobility to do much with his legs. His ball appears to flutter, especially when he doesn’t have a chance to wind up and step into his throws. Keenum holds several NCAA passing records, but those numbers came in an offense that inflated his statistics and allowed him to take advantage of a quick passing attack where he didn’t need to make extensive pocket reads. He wasn’t asked to consistently make NFL throws as the Cougars quarterback and at the end of the day, his lack of ideal physical tools were enough for teams to pass.
So why should Texans’ fans be encouraged with Keenum at the helm of the offense? He’s resilient, tough and very smart — all qualities that cannot be measured by a scale or 40 time. Keenum makes quick decisions with astute pre-snap reads to have a clear understanding of what the defense is doing and where to distribute the football. He has a natural feel for the field and pocket with good passing vision despite his stature that is a shade under 6-foot-1. A mature, determined individual, Keenum is the son of a coach and has battled through multiple injuries, including an ACL tear in 2010 that ended his season.
If you compare Keenum to other quarterbacks in the NFL, he won’t match-up because his physical tools just aren’t up-to-par. But his resolve and heart are why he’s still collecting a NFL paycheck and why he will start and play in his first professional game on Sunday.
———
from Case Keenum
Gil Brandt
Nov. 6, 2013
. The elder Keenum — a longtime coach himself — describes his son as a competitive football junkie who has been a quick learner from an early age. While he might not look the part of an NFL quarterback — he’s not thick like Drew Brees or Steve Young — Keenum has the skills and football know-how to succeed as a pro.
Keenum is a system-type quarterback who is perfect for the play-action passes and rollouts that the Texans like to use. He’s athletic, has great ball-handling skills and really knows how to execute the play-fake. Thus, it’s easy to see him being successful in Houston. After all, his head coach, Gary Kubiak, put together a solid nine-year career as John Elway’s backup in Denver, and he had many of the same traits.
I’ve always valued a player’s ability to produce, plain and simple. Keenum definitely has a history of production, from high school (he led Wylie High in Abilene, Texas, to the state quarterfinals) to college (at the University of Houston, he threw for 19,217 yards and recorded a touchdown-to-interception ratio of 48:5 as a senior). He has good feet and a quick release, and he is very accurate, completing more than 70 percent of his passes in two different collegiate campaigns with the Cougars.
In September 2011, I went with Highland Park (Dallas) coach Randy Allen, who has worked with Keenum’s father, to watch Keenum play against North Texas, and the youngster did something that caught my attention during pregame warmups. While most quarterbacks start off throwing with the wind at their back, Keenum went the other way, throwing into the wind. In that game, Keenum showed that, while he might not have Matthew Stafford-type arm strength, he is strong enough to get the ball 55 yards downfield.
Keenum made good on that ability Sunday night against the Indianapolis Colts. On the third offensive play of the game, Keenum connected with Andre Johnson on a 62-yard scoring strike. By the end of the first half, Keenum had racked up 208 yards and three touchdown passes.
If Keenum had to play in a different system (say, one that does not lean as heavily on the play-action pass) or in a different setting (like outdoors in Cleveland, where inclement weather can make it tricky for a guy like him to spin the ball well), he might not be as effective. But he doesn’t have to worry about that, because he’s in exactly the right place with the exact right team.
In fact, given Keenum’s suitability for Houston’s offense and sharp football sense, I think the second-year pro gives the Texans a better chance to win than Schaub. Keenum just knows when and where to throw it and when to hold on to the ball. He’s more of a “win the game for you” quarterback than Schaub. I’d also imagine that, as an underdog who’s had to scrap to get to where he is, Keenum has gained the respect of the locker room.
April 13, 2016 at 11:32 pm in reply to: Gordon & Manziel…& more Manziel…the official staring at the car wreck thread #41845znModeratorDrew Rosenhaus terminates contract with Johnny Manziel, will reconsider if QB gets treatment
Johnny Manziel’s second agent this offseason, Drew Rosenhaus, has informed the former Cleveland Browns quarterback that either he gets treatment or Rosenhaus no longer will represent him.
“I have terminated the standard representation with Johnny Manziel in the hopes of helping him get the treatment I believe he needs,” Rosenhaus told ESPN’s Adam Schefter. “I have informed him that if he takes the immediate steps I have outlined for him that I will rescind the termination and continue to represent him. Otherwise the termination will become permanent. There is a five-day window for me to rescind the termination. I’m hoping he takes the necessary steps to get his life back on track.”
Rosenhaus said from the beginning his agreement with Manziel was contingent upon the QB entering a treatment facility, which he has persistently refused to do.
“I wasn’t walking into an easy situation, but it has descended,” Rosenhaus told SiriusXM NFL Radio on Wednesday night. “It has consistently gotten worse. Quite honestly, one of things I talked to him about from Day 1 … was to get back to getting help, so that the reasons he was released by the Browns would be in the past and that he could move forward with his life as positive member of society and take advantage of all the gifts that he has. … The world can be his. But obviously in many respects he needs guidance right now, he needs help, and needs to gain control of his life again. And obviously before he can even think about football, he’s got to do those things.
“Right now I believe for him to have chance to have a successful life — forget football for a moment — I think it’s imperative for him to get help. I’m taking a stand here purely to help this man. I got involved with the idea that I’d be able to make a difference and l’m really grasping at straws. This is the last thing I can do.”
Rosenhaus never has fired a player in 27 years as an NFL agent, according to ESPN’s Ed Werder.
Manziel told TMZ last week that he had been out in West Hollywood five to six nights in a row and said he doesn’t think NFL teams have a problem with his partying.
“I don’t think there’s anything wrong with partying, bro,” Manziel said to TMZ. “There’s a difference between partying and being out of control.”
Manziel was the 22nd overall selection by the Browns in 2014, their second of two first-round draft picks that year. But his two seasons in Cleveland were marred by off-the-field struggles and limited on-the-field success, and he was waived by the team March 11.
Manziel spent 10 weeks in rehab after his rookie season and is the subject of a grand jury investigation in Dallas into whether he assaulted his former girlfriend. The NFL is investigating whether Manziel violated the personal conduct policy in that incident.
Since he spent the weekend of the Browns’ season finale in Las Vegas, Manziel has made regular appearances on social media from locales that include Miami, Las Vegas and Los Angeles.
“This is a life-or-death situation,” Rosenhaus said on SiriusXM. “I’m not talking about football anymore. I’m talking about a young man who is in trouble., And at end of day, I have a responsibility. I’m not going to see him go down in flames with me as his agent. He’s either going to have to take necessary steps to get his life back o track or he’s going to have to find someone else to stand by and watch him injure himself. It won’t be me.”
Information from ESPN’s Pat McManamon was used in this report.
April 13, 2016 at 10:16 pm in reply to: Gordon & Manziel…& more Manziel…the official staring at the car wreck thread #41844znModeratorfrom off the net
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bubbaramfan
(no link in original)
More bad news for “Party Johnny”, his agent, Drew Rosenhaus, fired him today. That’s the second agent to let him go.
source, ESPN.com
April 13, 2016 at 8:44 pm in reply to: informal poll–for or against trading up? trading down? staying put? #41842znModeratorfrom off the net
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Rampage2K-
Browns set on taking Goff at Two
Just heard that on Sirius… This the season of misinformation and I think that’s exactly what it is…trying to pump up their trade market.
znModeratorIn fact, the new work confirms that the mass of the stuff around us is due only in very small part to the masses of quarks themselves. Most of it comes from the way they interact inside baryons. “Ninety-nine per cent of the mass of the proton and neutron, and therefore the visible Universe, is QCD binding energy,” says Davies. “The Higgs then just explains the 1% of it that comes from quark masses.” All the same, she adds, where that last per cent comes from is still “a very important fundamental question”.
http://www.nature.com/news/2008/081120/full/news.2008.1246.html
znModeratorThere is a bit of uncertainty as to who is running the offense in LA. Rob Boras was promoted to having a bigger role in the offense, but there is no clear cut “guy” running the offense.
Not true. Boras is running the offense.
Having a “passing coordinator” who is subordinate to a full-fledged offensive coordinator is not a rare thing in the league.
znModeratorWHY PAXTON LYNCH IS THE PERFECT INGREDIENT FOR THE RAMS REBUILDING OFFENSE
Eric Galko
Eric Galko is the owner and director of scouting at Optimum Scouting and OptimumScouting.com, as well as a Sporting News contributor. Follow him on Twitter: @OptimumScouting
Big media and a number of NFL teams have fallen in love with the likes of Jared Goff and Carson Wentz. There is reason to believe both of them are quality quarterbacks, but the best quarterback in the class is Paxton Lynch. For whatever reason, he is not getting the same attention as the other two “top” quarterbacks in the class.
The Los Angeles Rams just settled in their new city and are in dire need of a full rebuild. Head coach Jeff Fisher was given an extension and a shining opportunity to turn the team around. The problem, for now, is that they lack a quarterback. The Nick Foles signing from a year ago turned out to be a disaster. Lynch, albeit the top passer in the class, may take a bit of a tumble through the first round because of the infatuation with other quarterbacks. For the Rams, this would be a godsend.
There is a bit of uncertainty as to who is running the offense in LA. Rob Boras was promoted to having a bigger role in the offense, but there is no clear cut “guy” running the offense. With that being said, Lynch’s projection as a Ram has to be more about how this staff could use Lynch based on what he did at Memphis, not necessarily based on what the Rams did last season.
Many are concerned with how well he will handle the transition from Memphis’s spread attack to a more nuanced pro game, but there is little reason to fret. After all, Marcus Mariota had a very good rookie season with the Tennessee Titans. Robert Griffin III had an outstanding rookie season a few years prior, as well. There are plenty of success stories for spread quarterbacks and there is a blueprint on how to make an offense work for them.
Of course, the Rams can not entirely replicate what Lynch did at Memphis, but there are a handful of concepts they can sprinkle in or adjust to make Lynch comfortable. At Memphis, Lynch threw a lot of quick screens, slants and go-routes. The Oakland Raiders ran a lot of these concepts during Derek Carr’s rookie year to help him adjust from a similar offense to Memphis’, and Carr has shown that he is progressing into a good pro quarterback. The offense may largely consist of these concepts for Lynch, too, but there is one major difference between he and Carr that will allow the Rams to open up the playbook earlier.
Carr was not necessarily scared of pressure, per say, but he was used to playing being a horrendous line at Fresno State. Memphis did not have an outstanding line, but they gave Lynch more freedom than Carr had and Lynch consistently showed that he was not phased by pressure. With Lynch’s poise to add on top of his acute mental ability (he only threw 4 interceptions his final year), the Rams would have more freedom to open up the playbook and let him “figure it out” because he has all the ability to do.
Lynch falls more into the archetype that likes to feel when a play is open and make the adjustment on the fly to complete the pass, but has no qualms working through the construct of the system. He can hit timing routes well over any area of the field just as well as he can break the pocket and make a play.
The key for Lynch is opening up the field. There are a lot of ways to do this. Lynch is an athlete and that helps open up two things: run concepts with the quarterback involved and rollouts.
The Rams have to use Lynch’s athleticism to their advantage and these are two prime examples of how to do so. The first of two plays is a read-option look. There is not much to decipher there on than that Lynch has the intelligence to know when to keep versus pull the ball and run himself, as well as his ability as a runner.
The second of the two plays, however, showcases a lot of Lynch’s talents. For one, he is very comfortable rolling either way and it is even more impressive that he rolled left on this play. The play breaks down a little bit, though. Lynch was looking for a front side throw, as he should have been, but saw that those options were covered. Without any hesitation or panic, Lynch resets his body to throw back the other way and rifles in a throw that his receiver ended up converting into a first down. The play is not only a testament to his ability to operate well on the move, but also a testament to his ability to adjust quickly and make a play.
Lynch needs to be allowed to attack down the field, too. He has a good arm that can find that sweet blend between velocity and arc, especially when throwing down the sideline. Though, Lynch’s ability as a deep passer stretches beyond simply his placement. He has a great understanding of when to attack and when to look for a different option. He is not passive, but he is also not reckless. There has been only a handful of passers in the past few draft classes that have the same grasp on calculated risks that Lynch does.
It’s hard to pin any quarterback as a definite fit for the Rams because of the uncertainty of the offense. Paxton Lynch does not have many glaring flaws, though, leaving the offense to be moldable. The concepts above are what fit him best, but he is largely without flaw. That is not to say he is an elite prospect, but considering he can do everything at least at a baseline level, it’s hard to imagine any offense hindering him. Lynch would give the Rams a lot of freedom with their offense- a perfect ingredient for rebuilding an offense.
znModeratorSiriusXM NFL Radio
Les Snead: QB Case Keenum is our starter right now.znModeratorTMZ is reporting the Rams’ backup running back has had a warrant issued after failing to appear in court for a March incident.
What the hell has gotten into this kid?
.
znModeratorI am in charge of tasering tsars and tapirs
Is that an elected position, or inherited for life?
If elected, what are the primaries like?
Brutal, I would imagine.
Its an elected position. And I’ve lost
fifty-two primaries in a row.
But I have all the Super-Delegates
so I am in like flynn.w
vSo…given that, it’s inherited for life.
.
znModeratorI am not a sherlock holmes fan (dont like mysteries
in general) but i have enjoyed Cumberbatch
in his bbc Holmes series. He’s got
some sort of “it” factor i cant quite
articulate.w
vHe;s good in The Imitation Game.
.
znModeratorI am in charge of tasering tsars and tapirs
Is that an elected position, or inherited for life?
If elected, what are the primaries like?
Brutal, I would imagine.
znModeratorI can’t believe that Snead just declared Keenum as the Rams starting QB for the next 15 years.
I assume you’re joking?
Cause there are some who did take the initial announcement that way.
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