nittany ram wrote:

I see I’m the only one who ranks as “Revolutionary” on the Societal Axis. The rest of you are merely “Very Progressive”.

Ya know I don’t think I should be hanging out with the likes of you people anymore. As often happens in relationships, one person grows while the other stagnates. It’s no one’s fault but it happens. So I’m not sure a ‘very progressive’ board like this has anything left to offer a bonafide Revolutionary like myself.

I mean, look at it from my point of view. How would it look if some of the other Revolutionaries came by and saw me slumming it up with a bunch of ‘very progressives’?

Anyhow, it’s over. We can still be friends but if you see me with other Revolutionaries for gawd sakes act like you don’t know me.

Thanks and goodbye.

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Well, i want to know if you are an ‘elite’ revolutionary or
just a “No.1 Revolutionary”

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nittany ram wrote:

Well, I agree that abortion rights are an important component of a truly progressive platform and I am disappointed Sanders supported an anti-abortion candidate in OK, but to use that misdeed as evidence that the establishment (Clinton) wing of the Democratic Party has the true progressive platform is ridiculous. This is the wing of the party that deregulated Wall Street and promoted NAFTA under Bill Clinton. This is the wing that supports fracking and is against campaign finance reform. This is the wing that is against universal healthcare, free college education and the $15/hr minimum wage. There’s nothing progressive about the establishment democrats and as Zooey demonstrated in his epic takedown of a ‘party first’ democrat on Facebook, women would be better off under a Sanders presidency than they would be under Clinton.

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Ditto.

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nittany ram wrote:

<
And there would be no marches or protests if Hillary had won and all those protesters would be happily living their lives while the biosphere slowly died.

All that is true. But right now, to me, that does not matter.

That is tomorrow’s worry. Today we have to address the issues that are right in front of our face. That’s about all we can do.

====================

Well is it THAT bad of an idea to applaud their protest while at the same time pointing out to THEM that they sat on their asses while the Democrats were destroying the biosphere and the poor ? Is it really that bad of an idea to call them out on that fact?

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nittany ram wrote:

wv wrote:

My sister, wv-ewe, yelled at me for expressing this, but…and i dont mean to piss on protest whether its the womens march or the science march…but….wont these nice folks just go right back to their comfortable-sleep once a Dem gets into office? Where were they when Clinton and Obama were destroying the poor and handing over power to the banks and corporations who then turn around and destroy the biosphere?

Sorry, couldnt help it. Thats how i feel.

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v

I don’t know.

But the first order of business is to stop the hemorrhaging.

We can worry about long term patient outcomes later.

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Well, as i keep trying to tell the evil-liberal-ewe, the fact that i express my feelings about this on a little message board does not mean i have the power to shake up the Womens marchers or the Nerd Marchers. I mean, i cant DO ‘anything’ to help or hurt the marchers. So there’s that. I’m no threat to the ‘movements’ 🙂

The thing that infuriates me is — and you know damn well this is true — the nerds will go right back to sleep as soon as a Hillary or a Biden or whoever-Dem gets elected. They think Trump is the enemy. But Trump did not begin the destruction of the biosphere. Clinton, Obama, Bush, etc all had a hand in it. So where were they when the Dems were giving all this power to those wonderful Corporations and Banks ? And dont change the subject to talk about strategy and alliances and all that. Thats a separate thread and a separate topic and i would no doubt agree with you and zn on that topic — just stick to my narrow question — Where were they when the dems were destroying the biosphere?

…oh and where was Gondor when Rohan needed help?

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• This reply was modified 9 years ago by wv.

zn wrote:

wv wrote:

Sorry, couldnt help it. Thats how i feel.

Well, later, down the road, after we win, you can have them purged.

==================

Good. I’m keeping a purge-list. All the liberals have to go. And the conservatives. And the Alt-righters and the rightwing fringe folks. And any religious people. And the centrists, of course. And the new-agers. And the apathetic folks. And all the rich people. And the pro-corporatists. And anyone who likes malls.

So thats just a good start. The entire list is not complete yet.

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#marchforscience #March4Sociology best protest sign ever??? pic.twitter.com/myQr1H7EpV

— Steve G. Hoffman (@namffoh_evets) April 22, 2017

• This reply was modified 9 years ago by zn.

“It takes an army to get this thing right.”

“Support the Rams”

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PA Ram wrote:

wv wrote:

Now despite everything i just said, as humans we still have to live out our lives. So whether we are on the titanic or not, we still have to ‘do’ and ‘act’ — so, i still think we should “do what we can.” I’m not saying we are doomed so sit on your ass and watch tv. I’m saying we are doomed, make your own choice, but as for me, I’ll still “do what i can” because…i choose to. I mean Waterfield likes Viktor Frankl if i recall. Its a V.Frankl thing — even if you are in Auschwitz you can choose to “do what you can”.

Yes, I’ll still vote.

I’ll probably continue to be ignored by some people from time to time for pointing out political things. But I’m trying to become less invested emotionally in the whole thing. I’m trying to become more like a scientist examining an interesting bug. “That is a very deadly bug. But look how odd it flies. Hmmmm.”

I just can’t see the point of carrying the stress of it all when it seems beyond my ability to change the situation. I’ve cut back on some of the politics for my own sanity. I’m watching more movies, practicing more with sleight of hand, and just getting through life as best I can. I have spent so much energy over the years arguing with the Sally’s of the world and found that in the end I only got frustrated. I just kind of give up in a lot of ways.

I get the sense that this whole human experiment is winding down.

I might as well enjoy the ride.

—————–

I can totally relate to that, my friend.

A sense of humor helps, dont it.

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Yeah, right. Next you’ll be telling us pro Wrastling is fake.

I know exactly what Alex’s fans will think — he wont lose a single listener. They’ll think its fake news or a false-flag or somethin.

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zn wrote:

I’m sorry but that is just laughable imho. Asaad doesnt seem nearly that stupid to me.

UN personnel already tested victims. Gas was used. Which is why the Russians don’t deny it.

Assad has done it before and publicly made an agreement to cease manufacturing it. Apparently he went back on it. He actually uses chlorine gas regularly.

And I am doing my best to post international, non-USA gov’t sources on this. No one here (and probably not that many people in the world in general) knows more about Assad than Juan Cole, who is a longstanding standing middle east scholar who has long been on the shit lists of various american administrations for undermining their public takes on things. No one knows Assad better, and he is using middle eastern sources to point to the attack being the Syrians.

Assad is Hussein. There is nothing about him worth defending or admiring.

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Who has said there is anything worth admiring about Asaad??!
Find someone who said ‘that’ ? Heck back in the day, Asaad was cooperating with the american terrorist group (CIA) for rendition, etc.

And Juan Cole may be an ‘expert’ but he doesnt have any proof Asaad did this. Zero proof. Someone used some kind of gas. But we dont know who.

And citing pro-American sites that dont know who used the gas — does not prove who used the gas.

AND, there’s nothing worth admiring or defending about the CIA.

Well, BT, you dont have to post about politix but that doesnt get you off the hook as far as posting on the board. So, you’ll have to post on some other topic. Like Knitting. Or maybe cats. Its up to you.

I’m thinking about just posting on peanut butter, myself.

As far as being burned out, itz purty common among leftists. I’m not burned out, but i am…oh…monotonous. I mean, my inner dialogue is just so monotonous now. There’s a gazillion examples of the same basic blueprint that keep replaying over and over like groundhog day.
The elites oppress the bewildered herds, and the elite-owned-media propagandizes and distracts. That dynamic just plays out over and over and over. Its monotonous once you have the big picture figured out.

I really ‘dont need’ to ‘keep up’ with the news. It never really changes.

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I aint even reading that.

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Billy_T wrote:

Who knows who did it?

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I share that point of view. If this was a ‘crime’ in a criminal court, I’d say no-one has proved anything beyond a reasonable doubt.

I’m still in the fact-gathering stage though. Just beginning the fact gathering actually. Scratching the surface. I’m in no hurry.

But as of now, I am totally skeptical of the white house point of view. (and every other theory — the russian theory too) I’m skeptical of the WHPV because it makes ZERO sense to me that Assad would have any motivation at all to do this. I mean Trump had JUST said for the first time he was NOT interested in regime change. The whole world is watching Syria. Asaad was winning. Why fuck all that up ? Makes zero sense. And asaad is a very smart guy.

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• This reply was modified 9 years ago by wv.
• This reply was modified 9 years ago by wv.

Another Russian propagandist: Seymour Hersh 🙂

https://www.lrb.co.uk/v36/n08/seymour-m-hersh/the-red-line-and-the-rat-line

“…Why did Obama delay and then relent on Syria when he was not shy about rushing into Libya? The answer lies in a clash between those in the administration who were committed to enforcing the red line, and military leaders who thought that going to war was both unjustified and potentially disastrous.

Obama’s change of mind had its origins at Porton Down, the defence laboratory in Wiltshire. British intelligence had obtained a sample of the sarin used in the 21 August attack and analysis demonstrated that the gas used didn’t match the batches known to exist in the Syrian army’s chemical weapons arsenal. The message that the case against Syria wouldn’t hold up was quickly relayed to the US joint chiefs of staff. The British report heightened doubts inside the Pentagon; the j..”oint chiefs were already preparing to warn Obama that his plans for a far-reaching bomb and missile attack on Syria’s infrastructure could lead to a wider war in the Middle East. As a consequence the American officers delivered a last-minute caution to the president, which, in their view, eventually led to his cancelling the attack.

zn wrote:

wv wrote:

Cole said: “The use of chemical weapons by the Syrian Army in Idlib is an atrocity..”

But that has not been proven. Where is the clear and convincing evidence that the Syrian Army used chemical weapons?

The Russians and Assad say they didnt do it. The US says Assad did it. Where’s the proof?

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No, it;s the Russians that deny it. “Has not been proven” is the Russian line. I actually published within all that a local independent middle eastern news source that accepts the line that it was syria. I’ve been insisting on this point: take views from those who are echoing the Russians on this, and it’s no help…it actually just muddies things.

Cole is without equal the leading american commentator on the region. I would take his view over anyone who is just parroting the Russians—any day.

Cole was a godsend of neutral deep commentary and reporting when I was looking at sources on the run up to the iraq war.

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Nah. I strongly disagree. There’s all kinds of people out there saying it hasn’t been proven. Glenn Greenwald, lots of others. Its not been proven. You are simply wrong on this. You are accepting the Western mantra as proof.

For example the guy that wrote that article in the second link doesnt even LIKE Asaad. Anyway, i cant do much posting for a coupla days. No time. We can get into it later and i will dance circles around you logically.

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• This reply was modified 9 years, 1 month ago by wv.