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znModeratori don’t know if i can copy and paste the article. it’s a paysite.
I already posted it. It’s here: http://theramshuddle.com/topic/the-press-others-on-the-seattle-loss/#post-126069
znModerator
znModeratoryou’re missing the point. my point is there’s a spectrum.
Okay. I’m not sure the degrees of difference between qbs are big ones though. I think there’s guys who can often (not always) handle it (Brady, Wilson) and then everyone else–with maybe nuances of difference between and among everyone else.
But with minor differences I think we’re saying more or less the same thing, so, no board war. 😎 Of course if Ozone is right (post before mine) the scheme factors into this too. Right now the scheme looks like it’s easy for some defenses to shut down. Could be.
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znModeratorJourdan Rodrigue@JourdanRodrigue
Sean McVay: Jared Goff had surgery on his thumb today, decision was made late last night. We are optimistic we will get him back for the playoffs. John Wolford will start on Sunday.
znModeratorand it’s not just a does a qb get affected by pressure or not. it’s not a binary thing. you have some qbs who are pressure resistant. you have some qbs who completely fall apart under pressure. and then you have qbs who fall somewhere between those two points. i think goff is somewhere in between. where that is is debatable.
No qb is pressure resistant. We’ve seen the Rams demolish Wilson, who is one of the rare qbs who can play effectively behind a problem OL facing pressure…but (as just said) not always.
And it’s not a matter of “falling apart.” It’s timing and play execution. Seattle sat on the Rams short routes knowing full well that they would not be punished for it because the qb would not have enough time for anyone to get past the coverage. That just means fewer plays are there.
I’ve never seen anyone name qbs other than the “often but not always” examples of Wilson and Brady who are effective under heavy pressure. I have asked people to name examples going back to 2007 and debates about whether the Rams demolished OL was causing problems or if it was just all Bulger. Starting in 2007, I’ve been through all the “all teams have injuries” responses and the “he’s just playing scared” responses and the “he doesn’t care anymore since he signed his contract” responses and the “good quarterbacks elevate line play” responses and I always ask, give me examples, and never got any. (For the record I originally brought up Brady and Wilson myself in these discussions.)
Because remember the issue is not “pressure.” It’s a high degree of pressure because the OL is not holding up. That means you have to factor a faltering OL into this.
Nobody is unaffected by a situation where a faltering OL gives up 55.8% pressures. I have asked endlessly for examples.
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znModeratorAdam Schefter@AdamSchefter
Rams’ QB Jared Goff underwent surgery today on his broken right thumb in LA and is unlikely to play Sunday vs. Arizona, sources tell ESPN. If he can’t play Sunday, Goff could return for the playoffs if Rams advance there.John Wolford is Goff’s backup and now in line to start.
Wolford would be first QB to make his first start for a team in Week 17 with a playoff berth on the line since Kyle Orton for the 2013 Cowboys
The surgery that Rams QB Jared Goff had earlier today in Los Angeles gives him the best chance of an optimum result without a delay in return. The hope is he can be back for the postseason.
Jourdan Rodrigue@JourdanRodrigue
I can confirm the multiple reports that Jared Goff will have surgery on his right thumb. It’s likely – though not totally certain – that he’s out on Sunday, source said. And the hope is, should John Wolford start and help get Rams to the playoffs, that he can return for a push.Reminder, the Rams also are hoping to have LT Andrew Whitworth back in the case that they enter the postseason. That alignment, plus organization’s faith in Wolford’s prep, may have made decision for immediate surgery an easier one.
Andrew Siciliano@AndrewSiciliano
Trust me. You’re going to like John Wolford.
znModeratorKliff Kingsbury’s offense is sputtering out in the desert and the Cardinals are in danger of missing the playoffs
So who’s to blame?https://t.co/H7LKn01jzz
— Mike Renner (@PFF_Mike) December 28, 2020
znModeratorJets suddenly on 2-game winning streak after 0-13 start https://t.co/mAsfOsu7zr
— AP NFL (@AP_NFL) December 28, 2020
znModeratorWhere ya going buddy pic.twitter.com/CmqtTineTT
— Geoff Schwartz (@geoffschwartz) December 28, 2020
znModeratorMatt Bowen@MattBowen41
#Rams-#SeahawksSEA played single-high coverages…
Cover 3 — 54.9%
Cover 1 — 25.5%Limited explosive plays & boot concepts. Disciplined in zone coverage (depth, eyes).
Didn’t allow Goff to throw on rhythm consistently + he struggled with ball location/accuracy.
znModerator.@seahawks having @Bwagz as the QB of the defense is just invaluable as they keep “breaking in” @JordynBrooks_ #JordynBrooks . No need to get to the sidelines to “FIX” something that can be done right on the field. #BaldysBreakdowns pic.twitter.com/p7RelzvDmE
— Brian Baldinger (@BaldyNFL) December 28, 2020
znModeratorAdam Schefter@AdamSchefter
Rams’ QB Jared Goff is meeting today with Dr. Steven Shin, who treated Drew Brees last year for his thumb injury, per source. Goff will need thumb surgery at some point; the question is when to get it. His status for Sunday remains uncertain.
znModeratorLindsey Thiry@LindseyThiry
For those wondering, high ankle sprains can typically take anywhere from two to more than six weeks for players to recover. Most fall in the 4-to-6 week range.Both Rams running backs Cam Akers and Darrell Henderson have high ankle sprains.
Sean McVay talks later tonight.
znModeratorRams fighting for their playoff lives heading into Week 17
L.A. misses postseason with loss to Cardinals, Bears win over PackersERIC D. WILLIAMS
https://www.si.com/nfl/rams/news/la-rams-fighting-for-playoff-lives-heading-into-week-17
It didn’t have to come to this.
If the Los Angeles Rams had taken care of business two weeks ago against the previously winless New York Jets, they would already be in the postseason and looking at this Sunday’s contest as more of a seeding game.
However, after losing a second straight contest against the Seattle Seahawks, the Rams at 9-6 can finally punch their ticket to the postseason with a win over the Arizona Cardinals at SoFi Stadium.
The Cardinals fell to the San Francisco 49ers 20-12 over the weekend, so they remain a game back of the Rams in the standings. It’s a must-win game for the Cardinals to reach the playoffs.
The Seahawks clinched their first NFC West division title since 2016 with a win over the Rams last weekend.
If the playoffs ended today, the Rams would be the No. 6 seed, traveling again to Seattle to face the No. 3 seed in the Seahawks.
NFC West division standings
Seahawks 11-4
Rams 9-6
Cardinals 8-7
Niners 6-9The No. 1 overall seed remains up for grabs in the NFC, which helps the Rams.
L.A. also could get into the playoffs if the Chicago Bears (8-7) lose or tie at home to the Green Bay Packers, who have yet to lock-up the No. 1 overall seed and a bye in the first week of the postseason.
The Packers take the No. 1 seed with a win over the Bears or a loss by Seattle on the road against San Francisco.
So, the Packers have something to play for and that game will take place at the same time as the Rams host the Cardinals.
New Orleans clinches the No. 1 seed with a win over Carolina, along with a Green Bay loss and a Seattle win.
Seattle needs to defeat the Niners, along with losses by the Packers and Saints to gain the No. 1 seed.
Overall, it’s a surprising turn of events for a team like the Rams, that looked like a Super Bowl contender after throttling the New England Patriots in a nationally televised Thursday night contest in Week 14.
If the Rams lose to the Cardinals and the Bears defeat the Packers, the Rams will miss the postseason after having a 96.2% chance to make the playoffs in Week 16, according to ESPN’s Football Power Index.
NFC playoff seeding
1. Packers 12-3
2. Saints 11-4
3. Seahawks 11-4
4. Washington 6-9
5. Buccaneers 10-5
6. Rams 9-6
7. Bears 8-7On the bubble
8. Cardinals 8-7
9. Cowboys 6-9
znModeratorThe latest on @JaredGoff16 and the @RamsNFL The Aftermath continues till 6 pm eastern/3 pacific on @nflnetwork @RapSheet @RhettNFL @wyche89 @MoveTheSticks pic.twitter.com/fzrwT7Rpe5
— Michael Silver (@MikeSilver) December 28, 2020
znModeratorHow many times was Wilson pressured yesterday?
Comparatively:
Wilson 32 drop backs, sacked 5 times, hit 8 times = 2TDs and QBR of 93.9.
Goff 43 drop backs, sacked 3 times, hit 9 times = no TDs and a QBR of 61.6.First, your pressure numbers are off. PFR puts up pressure numbers on Wednesdays–the sacks and hits numbers are incomplete till then. Second, ESPN measures Goff’s pressures at 24. I have a tweet to that effect in this thread from the Rams ESPN writer.
Also, Wilson doesn’t matter. He is one of the rare exceptions to the line “all qbs are affected by heavy pressure.” Throughout the years when I bring up the OL and pressure issue I list Wilson and Brady as the 2 exceptions to the “heavy pressure prevails” rule (and have challenged people to name others and I never get any names).
And even Wilson and Brady have succumbed to pressure at times–Rams have done it to Wilson a couple of games, we’ve seen it.
ESPN’s 24 pressures number is the most for any McVay Rams team going back to the start. That means the OL is out of whack and unless the OL is fixed the qb will be compromised. Whoever it is.
znModeratorJourdan Rodrigue@JourdanRodrigue
If RB Xavier Jones is called upon Sunday considering Darrell Henderson’s injury, center Austin Blythe says the team is comfortable with him. “I knew since camp he was going to make the team. He flashed a lot in a team setting.”Adam Schefter@AdamSchefter
Cardinals’ backup QB: Chris Streveler.
Rams’ backup QB: John Wolford.Mina Kimes@minakimes
Guys I literally have pages and pages of notes on John Wolford. I’m like the random physicist who specializes in a rare event and gets the call in the science fiction movie. This is my moment.PFF@PFF
Trophy Week 16 NFL Team of the Week TrophyQB: Tom Brady
RB: Myles Gaskin
WR: Davante AdamsDI: Aaron Donald
EDGE: Chase Young
CB: Darius Phillips
znModeratorRams could face Cardinals Sunday without QB Jared Goff and playoff spot on the line. Read story from @MasonKernMedia: https://t.co/xFTTcTBz8s
— Howard Balzer (@HBalzer721) December 28, 2020
znModerator.@Seahawks it’s the official time that we take this #Seahawks defense seriously but it’s a good talented group that are playing well together. #BaldysBreakdowns pic.twitter.com/O4kN6aZI5P
— Brian Baldinger (@BaldyNFL) December 28, 2020
znModeratorNot surprised but if it was really about the “culture” it would’ve happened last week.
Haskins was never this staff’s choice as a QB1. He wasn’t a great fit from a playing standpoint or from a cultural fit. He made the decision easy for them w/his performance and immaturity https://t.co/iNYWE8j2EA
— Bucky Brooks (@BuckyBrooks) December 28, 2020
znModeratorI agree with that. He was pressing. And it didn’t cost the game. The failure to score from inside the 1-yard line on two tries is a more significant failure.
It was still a Terrible throw.
Yeah it was bad. I told him personally he owes the entire huddle board chat room crew pie because of that throw. He said fine, btw.
I hated the goal line thing though, just hated it.
znModeratorAnd…I agree Goff’s performance is affected by pressure. All QBs are affected by pressure.
But that interception was Terrible. He was not under duress when he threw that.
Two things.
1. One of the common mistakes I see when people talk about pressure is this idea that if there is no visible pressure on a particular play, then pressure wasn’t the issue. That is not how it works though. Constant pressure erodes timing, play design, general effectiveness, and confidence. It has an effect on playcalling.It means you’re in more disadvantageous situations more often (like 3rd and long). It usually also means you’re playing from behind, which just increases the pressure issue. In the Rams case it means this–teams like Seattle know they can sit on all those short routes without fear of punishment because the qb will never have time to find a receiver who gets deeper.
With Goff, what pressure does is get him to press–he tries to make plays when they’re not there, and usually his mechanics are off too. No qb gets the time to go “am I pressured this play or not, let’s see….” They go yikes I am running, the play’s not there, but I need to do something (which is pressing). That was the INT.
The pressing can be cured. Run out of bounds, don’t make a blind bad throw just to make a play. Used to be this season it led to strip sacks where instead of taking the sack while pressure closed in he would hang in to make a play. Notice that stopped. Now he’s taking sacks, or when he can, bailing for those short runs (which is what led to the INT).
2. I don’t care about one INT. Warner threw 3 INTs in the 99 championship game against Tampa. It’s not negligible and it’s obviously not desirable, but you can throw one INT–no matter how embarrassing it looks to frustrated fans–and still win.
What you CANNOT do is win with an OL that gives up 24 pressures at a 55.8% rate, which is massive and has never happened before to the McVay Rams. And it does not matter who the qb is if you give up a pressure rate like that and it makes no difference if they did not throw an INT that game.
The pressure issue FAR outweighs any other issue on offense. If the OL is not fixed the offense will not be right until it is fixed.
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znModeratorHow many of you could pop your broken/dislocated thumb back into place haha? Looks like it might be John Wolford time in Los Angeles. @NFL @RamsNFL #JaredGoff #NFL #NFLPlayoffs pic.twitter.com/AL0aLDYIwn
— Olsen Fantasy Football (@FantasyOlsen) December 28, 2020
znModeratorAndrew Siciliano@AndrewSiciliano
Rams lead @NFL in total defense for first time since 1978, allowing 285.6 total YPG in 2020. No other team allows fewer than 300.
znModeratorHighest-graded defenders this season:
💪Aaron Donald – 94.2
💪Khalil Mack – 92.4
💪T.J. Watt – 91.6
💪Jessie Bates III – 90.6
💪Chris Jones – 90.3 pic.twitter.com/wKy7iUPlap— PFF (@PFF) December 28, 2020
znModeratorThe Rams defense has been dominant in 2020 and Leonard Floyd has played himself into position to earn a sizable contract this offseason. Floyd has a career-high 9.5 sacks. https://t.co/yqtztoPNfq
— Lindsey Thiry (@LindseyThiry) December 28, 2020
znModeratorAaron Rodgers’ season stats…
• 353 for 502 (70.3%)
• 4,059 passing yards
• 8.8 YPA, 270.6 YPG
• 44 pass TDs – 5 INTs
• 119.4 passer rating
• 145 rush yards, 3 rush TDs pic.twitter.com/IYUZ6yWK0s— NFL Stats (@NFL_Stats) December 28, 2020
znModeratorAndrew Siciliano@AndrewSiciliano
AFC is guaranteed to have a 10+ win team miss the @NFL Playoffs.NFC could have a 6-win team AND an 8-win team make the playoffs.
znModeratorHis consistency, with turning over the ball, spans two seasons not just one game. So OL, yeah I would say that’s an area of improvement, especially yesterday, but its a second place for me.
The OL IS the problem. And it was a problem through all of 2019. It only recently became a problem in 2020–last 2 games.
You can throw an INT and win a game. Warner threw 3 in the 99 championship game against Tampa. What you cannot do is win a game against a MASSIVE 55.8% pressure rate. As I said the league’s leader in pressure percentage, Pittsburgh, averages just under 32%.
The turnovers this year cluster in 2 games. Outside of that they are livable IMO though not desirable.
What they cannot win with is an OL that gets dominated the way they did against the Jets and Seattle. Then it simply will not matter who the qb is.
When the OL holds up, the Rams win. In the Tampa and Arizona games they could not run the ball and combined threw it 98 times–for a 78.6% completion rate. 2 wins.
But if the recent OL regression continues, again, it will not matter who the qb is. NO qb plays well under those conditions.
And if qb pressure did not make that much of a difference the Rams wasted money signing Donald.
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znModeratorJared Goff could put off surgery on thumb, adamant about playing vs. Cardinals https://t.co/61pFPzghN8
— Rams Wire (@TheRamsWire) December 28, 2020
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