bnw wrote:

They cheated and crapped on voters preference by anointing Hildabeast as the nominee. It was her turn. She waited and thus she deserved it. Except for the cheating it reminds me of the republican rationale for nominating Dole in ’96. His lackluster campaign will be repeated by Hildabeast.

Sounds about right.

But Dole had to run against Bill Clinton.

Hillary gets to run against Yosemite Sam.

I might go to a game in LA. My son suggested it. He is going to USC this year, and since that’s where the Rams are playing, he wants to go. Nice that he suggested “we” go, don’t you think? Nice son.

LOL.

You already posted it, huh? I don’t know how I missed it. Not like we’re producing 18 topics a day.

Good discussion, huh?

It proves the possible hypocrisy of a person or two which isn’t the same thing.

However, I have yet to see or hear anybody observe that although the Jew/atheist course of attack was brought up, they didn’t actually go through with it. In the free-wheeling brainstorming of ideas, several bad ones come up. People then look at all the ideas, and throw out the bad ones. So, evidently, this suggestion came out and the parties involved said, “Uh, nooooo. Let’s not run with that.”

Because it never was used.

Meanwhile, Trump used a 6-pointed star against a background of cash and Hillary, yet Trump supporters have argued forcefully that Trump isn’t racist.

Happy birthday. Belatedly.

Actually, now that I am thinking about it, I have something to contribute on this issue. Because, really, I have read a lot about narcissism due to my wife’s condition. So I recognized Trump as a narcissist way back in the first debate, and I have read other people calling him a narcissist, but I never stopped to think that people don’t actually know what that means.

Most people think of narcissism as simple self-absorption and vanity. But that isn’t what it is, really. It’s complicated. But, believe me, you want to stay away from narcissists. They are fucking bad news because they are fact-impervious, and they are NEVER wrong, and you ARE. They do not compromise. They have no empathy. They cannot understand other points of view. Just cannot.

And this is what we will get with Trump. A president that cannot understand the viewpoint of other nations, of the congress, of anybody. And has no interest in understanding other points of view. Whatever he thinks or feels – at the moment – will guide his decisions. I am telling you.

I could go on.

Here is a very brief introduction from the Mayo clinic:

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/narcissistic-personality-disorder/basics/symptoms/con-20025568

I take that back.

Trump is ignorant, but I retract the claim that he is proud of it. There is no evidence of that. There is evidence that he doesn’t care that he is ignorant, and that’s different. He is ignorant, and he doesn’t care enough to get informed. That is more accurate.

PA Ram wrote:

Bernie pretty much knew all of this while he was running. He blasted Wasserman-Shultz several times. She’s pathetic. I hope she loses her race to Tim Canova.

The two party system is unbelievably corrupt.

I feel sick about this election. Somehow the Republicans always nominates some nut and the Democrats nominate the status quo which is really becoming the old Republican party before it went batshit crazy.

So do I say screw it and just vote Jill Stein and hope enough people vote Green Party to give it a voice and perhaps at least start to build another option? The price of that is the unpredictable and possibly dangerous Donald Trump. I heard someone say–he’ll be less likely to start wars. And someone else said–unless you mean another Civil War here. And then there are the complications of world managing. Kick NATO aside? Do other countries suddenly scramble for nukes then? Does it become an even more unstable place? He already said he’d like Japan to have nukes.

And Hillary? Well–we know she won’t keep her hands clean. She’ll just talk like she knows what she’s doing. But the result is still more conflict and war.

Trump will tear up the Iran deal. What then?

Will Hillary’s wars be any more stable than Trump’s? Which will be worse? Will one be a lot worse? Or just a little? Or is there much difference at all?

What about Climate Change? Trump didn’t say one word about it. He does love coal apparently.

Hillary will almost certainly address it. But is there anything behind it–really? Anything significant?

Hillary picked Tim Kaine because, like Obama, she can’t change who she really is and what she believes. She can pretend for a primary. But after that she has to be Hillary. Of course she will make sure the TPP passes. If it looks any different at all, they may reword a paragraph or two. It won’t mean very much. They will tell you it does.

I was going to vote for her because–#NeverTrump.

But honestly, the big FU she just gave by picking Kaine does give me pause. Why shouldn’t she have to earn my vote?

If I lived in Utah, or New York, or California, or Alabama this would be a no-brainer. Those states are already decided. Trump or Clinton has already won them. I could easily make that 3rd party statement and sleep well.

Pennsylvania is a true battleground state. It could literally decide the election.

So I do take my one vote very seriously.

I truly may not know what I’ll do until I walk into the voting booth.

It’s a bitch, man. I have the good fortune of living in a state where my vote won’t matter, so I can vote my conscience.

I will say re: Trump…the one thing I learned about him in the convention is that he really doesn’t care. I mean…it looked that way in the primary season, but you would think he would get it together for the convention and actually do some homework. But he didn’t. He just doesn’t know a goddam thing, and he is not interested in learning. So he says these things about letting NATO countries hang out to dry…he has no idea of what that actually means. He acts on impulse.

I believe he is more ignorant and lazy than George Bush was. This guy is going to want shit explained in half a page, and I’m going to guess he won’t even read that half the time. He is going to come into the Oval Office at 8, and leave at 10, and our real president is going to be Mike Pence.

I honestly don’t think Trump really even wanted to be president. He never ran a serious campaign, and I don’t think he wants to do any more than he has been doing. He wants to do the photo ops, the press conferences, and all that stuff, but he doesn’t actually want to do the work. He will beat Bush for vacation days. He wanted the attention, and to make money on the Trump brand. While I think he semi-believes the stuff he says, I think he just wanted to make some noise and some money – which he did – but never thought he would really win. But his massive ego is in it, and the thing is in reach, so he wants it now, but just not if it’s going to cost him money or effort.

So what he’s done is made a business deal with the Kochs.

https://www.facebook.com/actdottv/videos/498188527038385/

Edit…uh that’s supposed to be a link to a NYTimes article.

• This reply was modified 9 years, 7 months ago by Zooey.

Yeah, “Make America Work Again” was the stated theme, but they never got around to it. Most everybody just talked about how awful Hillary is. The audience seemed bored, and it’s hard to blame them. Mitch McConnell was uninspiring to say the least, and Ben Carson….

So far the convention has been a fender bender, but it won’t matter unless it gets far worse.

bnw wrote:

Was for TPP and “free” trade. I don’t like it but better than Gingrich.

A dead turtle would be better than Gingrich.

Mackeyser wrote:

waterfield wrote:

Curious: what does Jill Stein offer that my dry cleaner does not? They both have the exact same views on policies; Neither has held an elected office;and try as they might they have lost every election they’ve been in.

There is a point here.

She got recruited to run for office because as a Harvard trained physician, she kept getting asked by various governmental agencies or people who wanted someone with health credentials to speak to the damage certain environmental policies were having on constituents.

So, unlike your dry cleaner, Jill Stein has been working with various government agencies for and against for YEARS, specifically with respect to the environment and the health effects of environmental policy.

I dunno why, waterfield, I’m sure it’s not on purpose, but I’d be less offended if you were openly misogynistic towards Dr Jill Stein than dismissive as so many liberals are toward those not part of the party apparatus. What’s complete horse manure, is that if your dry cleaner was running, you’d be defending their small business experience and community ties rather than using them as an example of how to dismiss an alternative candidate…

The “experience” argument (one of the only 3 pro-Hillary arguments we ever hear), is one of those Partisan Arguments. I am pretty sure “experience” wasn’t really a factor for Clinton supporters back when, say, George HW Bush was running against Bill Clinton. It’s an argument of convenience, nothing more.

And I must say that I find it appalling that Clinton has been running for a year, and neither she nor her supporters ever point to her accomplishments as a reason to support her, or her policies. Where is the “She’ll be great for education, or health care, or working class jobs?”

Nope. She has experience, she has a uterus, and she’s not Trump. Those are the only arguments I have heard for her.

And Jill Stein has two of those things. And unlike Hillary, she actually has clearly defined principles rather than a political windsock and PR handlers.

bnw wrote:

BS. Show me anywhere Trump has disavowed what he has campaigned on to the extent that Sanders has by endorsing Hildabeast. Nothing partisan about it. It is fact. A partisan refuses to acknowledge factual information. That is exactly what Sanders supporters have done in this thread. Again regarding Sanders,

You mean he now believes Hildabeast has the judgement to be president?
He now believes she is progressive while being owned by Wall Street?
He now believes she won’t support the TPP?

My friend those are the facts. If Trump flaunts such hypocrisy I’ll unload on him for it too.

No, what it means is that he – regardless of his own political positions – has the same choice everyone else does: Clinton or Trump.

And in his estimation, Trump will be more regressive than Clinton.

bnw wrote:

Zooey wrote:

Well, his options were to 1) do nothing, 2) run with Stein, 3) endorse Hillary.

None of those are good options, but #1 accomplishes nothing but makes him appear spineless,

No it doesn’t. It would show he stands on principle. But he doesn’t. He supports Hildabeast like a typical political hack.

He IS standing on principle.

You just don’t like what that principle IS.

Well, his options were to 1) do nothing, 2) run with Stein, 3) endorse Hillary.

None of those are good options, but #1 accomplishes nothing but makes him appear spineless, #2 at best pulls the DNC to the left in 2020 but probably at the expense of a Trump presidencty, and #3 lives to fight another day. And he was going to have to fight another day even if he was elected president because none of his proposals were going to become reality without continuous fighting. It was a pragmatic choice, however tough to swallow.

I saw about 3 minutes of Hillary’s speech, and she sounded a lot like Bernie.

What becomes of all of that after the election is uncertain, of course. And given Hillary’s track record, she ain’t likely to fight hard for any of it. But Bernie at least has some status within the senate now to the point other politicians will have to listen to what he says.

And that’s the upshot. That’s what he won. And as insufficient as it is, it is a higher waterline than we have seen in 50 years in this country.

So…thanks, Bernie.

wv wrote:

—————–

Oh yeah, well if Shakespeare did a movie trilogy today,
it’d be largely ignored.

w
v

Hmm. You do know that Shakespeare has more movies to his credit than anyone else in the world?