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znModeratorInside the Rams’ Trade for Jalen Ramsey
Los Angeles landed yet another big-ticket player in exchange for first-round draft picks. How did the deal go down? Rams GM Les Snead breaks down the trade.ALBERT BREER
On Tuesday afternoon, the Rams’ trade sending Marcus Peters to the Ravens was complete, and GM Les Snead gave the cornerback time to get up to the team’s facilities in Thousand Oaks, Calif. to say his goodbyes before the team moved forward with shaking up the NFL landscape.
But before Snead could push the groundwork he’d laid with the Jaguars to the next level, there were still a few things he wanted to do. First, Snead pulled director of pro scouting Ray Agnew in to his office to go over Agnew’s assessments of LB Kenny Young, coming from Baltimore in the Peters trade, and OL Austin Corbett, arriving from Cleveland in a separate trade.
“And at that point in time, , ‘Hey, I’m gonna go on a run here. When I get back, should I talk to the Jags about Jalen?’” Snead said. “You could tell by his body language and demeanor, it was a hell yes.”
The run cleared his mind. And Agnew’s assessment gave him peace—and if shipping off two first-round picks and a fourth-rounder didn’t say hell yes to how Los Angeles’ aggressive brass felt about the two-time Pro Bowler, nothing would.
Ramsey was about to be a Ram.
This kind of blockbuster trade is nothing new for this Rams regime, of course. Peters and Aqib Talib arrived less than two years ago via trade, as did receiver Brandin Cooks, and quarterback Jared Goff came with a pick, first overall in 2016, acquired as part of another big-ticket package going out of town.
And while there has been an assumption out there that, particularly with Goff now off his rookie deal, the Rams would eventually normalize, that’s just not how they operate. As one Rams official put it late Wednesday, “This is normal for us.”
Still, there’s risk. Goff, Cooks, Todd Gurley and Aaron Donald are on top-of-the-market deals, and Ramsey will likely get one soon. And barring a trade back into the first round, they’re about to go five years (2017-21) without making a single first-round pick, which robs the team of avenues to surround their superstars with high-end cost-controlled talent.
Can that be sustainable? We’re about to find out.
“You do want to assess the bet you’re making,” Snead said from his office on Wednesday afternoon. “You’re always assessing whether to take an unknown commodity, and just pick a player in the first round. You’re obviously making a bet there that a projection will come to fruition, but that’s still uncertain. … So what we’ve done recently—do we take a player where he’s a more certain commodity, still young, still in their prime?”
The answer for the Rams recently has often been yes.
With that established, here’s more on why each team pushed Tuesday’s blockbuster trade over the goal line and into the end zone.
The Rams had a hidden need at corner. The team already started working on this before the Ramsey deal was even on their radar, because Peters and Talib are in contract years. A slew of trades down (which started with a move out of Round 1) in April’s draft came in part because they liked the group of defensive backs that’d be available after the top front-seven players came off the board in the first two rounds. They drafted Michigan cornerback David Long in the third round.
In the summer, they resisted overtures from other teams on their back-end corners, and kept six on their roster because they wanted to be cognizant of 2020 and beyond.
In other words, Ramsey was no luxury item—he filled a need the Rams would need to address sooner or later. As for the cost, it is worth pointing out that the player they would have drafted at No. 31, Washington safety Taylor Rapp, they picked at 61. That underscores how the draft class typically flattens out around the end of the first round.
The deal for Peters went off smoothly. The Rams weren’t going to extend Peters, so it made sense for Los Angeles to offload him to create more financial flexibility. The Rams had about $2 million cap space entering the week. Trading Peters to Baltimore created another $5.9 million in breathing room, which simply opened the possibility of trading for Ramsey. It assured nothing.
“We took the approach that we had to approach Marcus separately,” Snead said. “Based on the proposal, it was the best thing for the Rams and Marcus to go down this path, so we could both start exploring our next chapter. And you couldn’t do it, with the certainty that you were gonna get Jalen Ramsey. You had to do it, knowing, ‘OK, we like the young players on our roster.’”
The Jaguars had to see what they had. Jacksonville set the price for Ramsey at two first-rounders soon after their star corner first asked for a trade on Sept. 16. But owner Shad Khan slowed the process down to see what the team had without Ramsey—and the corner’s three-game absence gave Jacksonville a good look at that.
“You want to balance what might be good for individual with what my job is, to consider what’s best for the Jaguars,” Khan said in a quiet moment at Wednesday’s league meeting. “Moving forward, we played the last three games without the player. We felt like we were competitive, we were good. And then we established a value, and if a team is able to meet it, you pull trigger and go.”
In particular, Khan and the Jags liked what they saw from A.J. Bouye, the team’s new No. 1 corner, and Tre Herndon, an undrafted second-year player who will see the biggest uptick in role as a result of the trade.
The teams’ relationship mattered. Snead and Jaguars GM Dave Caldwell were together for four years in Atlanta (2008-11) as Falcons GM Thomas Dimitroff’s top lieutenants, which made the communication easy. Caldwell reached out to Snead first, just after Ramsey had his sideline blowout with Jacksonville coach Doug Marrone during the team’s Week 2 loss to Houston. From there, both sides knew where the other stood.
That mutual understanding stood up as the Jaguars slow-played the process to ensure the team would be OK without him, and right into the final hours of negotiation, when both sides had good confidence there weren’t going to be stumbling blocks at the finish line.
“That is where the relationship comes in—we weren’t gonna go back and forth on small derivatives,” Snead said. “At that point, it was, ‘Hey, do you wanna do this? OK, let’s do it.’ The haggling is over, we’re either gonna do it or not do it.”
The Rams were flexible and creative. Jacksonville wanted a “clean” deal, according to Khan. They didn’t want to eat any of Ramsey’s salary like Houston had to in trading Jadeveon Clowney. And there wouldn’t be a complex pick-swap in play here, with the Jaguars giving back picks as part of the deal, which is something that the Raiders had to do as part of the 2018 deal that sent Khalil Mack to Chicago.
While the Rams weren’t certain they had Ramsey when the Peters deal went through (one source said the Ramsey deal was about half-done when Peters was traded), the Peters deal had to go through for the Ramsey deal to be possible. “Dave was well aware,” Snead said, “either we’d have to move someone and transfer salary and cap to another team, or to Dave, or we couldn’t do it.”
Since the Jaguars were unwilling to pay any of Ramsey’s salary on the way out, they were patient and allowed that part to work itself out. In return, the Rams, champions of pick-swap deals in the past, went ahead without that element to this one. And they threw in the fourth-rounder as protection for the Jaguars against the possibility that the two first-rounders they were getting might wind up being pretty low in the round.
The Rams loved Ramsey. Snead recalled pro scout Matt Waugh doing the advance scouting on the Jaguars two years ago. Ramsey was coming off a game against Pittsburgh, in which he had an interception and generated a pick-six for Barry Church with another pass breakup, while covering Antonio Brown.
“He said, ‘That might be one of the best performances of all-time,’” Snead said, before laughing and adding, “Or at least that he’d seen in his young career. What you do, when you study him, you see the reputation is he’s a lockdown corner, he covers the teams’ best receiver, and you did notice that a good bit, and you got to see him go against quality receivers and definitely limit those particular guys’ production, depending on the game.
“That was probably the epiphany. Like, ‘Wow, that’s a very stressful deal to do that week-in and week-out.’ And obviously he was doing it with poise, and less anxiety than most.”
It’s tough to find guys capable of taking that on, and it was illustrated vividly when Snead entered the defensive meeting room on Tuesday to break the news to Phillips and his position coaches that they’d landed Ramsey. Phillips simply cracked, “Well, I guess we can change the game plan now.”
When the trade was close to happening, Caldwell and Snead recalled the Julio Jones trade they were both a part of in Atlanta, and Caldwell joked that he was about to up his asking price, to which Snead said, “Hey, we can move, and figure this out from within.” From there, each GM retreated to his camp to get final sign-offs on the move, and one last call had to be made.
“The good news is we’re still friends,” Caldwell said to Snead.
“It’s debatable whether that’s good news,” Snead joked.
“Either way, you’ve got yourself a corner,” Caldwell responded.
And in a fitting twist, that corner is headed for Atlanta this weekend to help cover Jones, whose acquisition by Dimitroff and a couple young execs in 2011 left a lasting impression on everyone involved.
One that, evidently, is being felt to this day.
znModeratorGary Klein@LATimesklein
Jalen Ramsey on whether he will play Sunday: “We got a couple more days to figure it out. We’re going to do what’s smart for myself and the team but I hope so. I hope I can go help and contribute to a win somehow, someway whether its limited or whatever.”J.B. Long@JB_Long
For what it’s worth, the #LARams still have a roster spot to fill going into Week 7…Unfortunately, this losing streak has put a dent in my “Since McVay was hired” notes. The latest to fall?
#LARams had been 18-0 when Aaron Donald recorded a sack.
That streak ended with loss to 49ers (a day that started with an AD99 sack).
What a run. October of Year 3.
znModerator5x Pro Bowler, 2x Defensive Player of the Year and now… an actor?!
Don’t miss @AaronDonald97 on @MagnumPICBS tonight at 9/8c on @CBS! 🎬 pic.twitter.com/cdl3fRkDWF
— Los Angeles Rams (@RamsNFL) October 19, 2019
znModeratorLindsey Thiry@LindseyThiry
Backup RB Malcolm Brown is doubtful, and McVay says if he’s unable to go that Darrell Henderson will assume the role.Adam Caplan@caplannfl
#Rams RB Todd Gurley (left quadriceps contusion) practiced today and has no injury status for the game. Jalen Ramsey (back) practiced fully again and has no injury status for the game. Looking forward to see him covering Julio Jones on Sunday.Official Friday injury report for Rams at Atlanta: RB Malcolm Brown doubtful, LB Clay Matthews III out, RB Todd Gurley and CB Jalen Ramsey full participants today. pic.twitter.com/mKH9Kfrh85
— Joe Curley (@vcsjoecurley) October 18, 2019
October 18, 2019 at 1:52 pm in reply to: non-Rams NFL tweets + some college FB too … 10/13 thru ? #106879
znModeratorAdam Schefter@AdamSchefter
Patrick Mahomes’ MRI was, in the words of a league source, “good” and it “turned out to be a best-case scenario.” Prior to MRI, team believed best-case scenario was Mahomes missing “about three games.”
znModerator"We have high hopes for him."
Prior to the 2018 NFL Draft, Aaron Kromer visited Austin Corbett for a private workout. A trade later, Kromer + @BigCorbs73 are ready to get to work together.
— Los Angeles Rams (@RamsNFL) October 18, 2019
znModeratorWhen I don’t get the Rams over the free airwaves, I go to “Reddit NFL stream.”
I have used a number of sites over the years. The quality has been sketchy. The reddit streams are typically high quality, and don’t lag. For the most part. I use a hdmi to connect to my tv.
The stream is a couple of plays behind Live, but…you know…it’s free.
Info on how to get that stuff is always posted in the game day “chat room access” thread. Here’s a link to the last one. Ag and Zooey always access this stuff jist fine.
link: http://theramshuddle.com/topic/rams-preseason-chat-room-schedule-includes-1-national-game/
znModeratorVincent Bonsignore@VinnyBonsignore
Jalen Ramsey, if playing is more conditioning or his back: “It’s a mixture of all that. To be able play this game at an elite level, like I want to play it, you’ve got to feel comfortable in all aspects. Not just physically – with my back, conditioning, but mentally as well.”Lindsey Thiry@LindseyThiry
I asked Rams C Brian Allen how the offensive line could clean up the pre-snap penalties. “Keep playing. I don’t want to make excuses… but any time you go silent at home, it’s a little different. But get used to that, if that’s the case we’ll be ready, better for it next time.”Gary Klein@LATimesklein
Jalen Ramsey on whether he will play Sunday: “We got a couple more days to figure it out. We’re going to do what’s smart for myself and the team but I hope so. I hope I can go help and contribute to a win somehow, someway whether its limited or whateverOctober 17, 2019 at 9:18 pm in reply to: non-Rams NFL tweets + some college FB too … 10/13 thru ? #106861
znModeratorRich Eisen@richeisen
Mahomes just got hammered on a QB sneak it appears. He is indeed hurt.Dr. Mark Adickes@jocktodoc
Patrick Mahomes with patella (knee cap) dislocation. Can be treated without surgery and brace. Could miss just a few weeks. Could also have season ending surgery. MRI will determine which course.
znModerator"The Rams now have TWO generational talents on defense." 💪😤
Howie Long has high praises for the Rams newest acquisition, @jalenramsey pic.twitter.com/rZUUwFc1kX
— FOX Sports: NFL (@NFLonFOX) October 17, 2019
October 17, 2019 at 7:54 pm in reply to: non-Rams NFL tweets + some college FB too … 10/13 thru ? #106859
znModeratorHerm Edwards and Arizona St had a fabulous showing on 24/7 last night. Like no one else can do, Herm breaks down the essence of football. You can’t cheat the game if you want to win. Listen in. pic.twitter.com/Xj1d7sdCxa
— Geoff Schwartz (@geoffschwartz) October 17, 2019
znModeratorfrom Week 7 PFF Preview – https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-week-7-pff-players-to-watch-predictions-betting-projections
Los Angeles Rams @ Atlanta Falcons
Players to Watch
The Falcons’ defense has been awful to start the season. Only the Miami Dolphins rank lower in EPA per play allowed, and Atlanta’s highest-graded defensive back in coverage is Desmond Trufant with his dismal 57.9 coverage grade. Deion Jones and Grady Jarrett have both earned high grades to start the year, but their efforts haven’t been enough to mask the woeful play in the secondary.
Cooper Kupp should have a field day against Atlanta if targeted early and often. He leads all Los Angeles receivers in yards per route run (2.20) and receiving grade (79.8) through Week 6.
In Week 1, the Rams had the fifth-highest time of possession (ignoring overtimes) in the league, at 33:16. That number has dropped literally every week since, down to a season-low 21:08 in Week 6 that was fourth-lowest. The team averaged the eighth-highest time of possession in 2018. Less time of possession generally means fewer plays, which means fewer chances at fantasy production. It lowers the ceiling of the entire offense.
Greenline Preview
Two teams that have underperformed and let bettors down face off in this potentially high-scoring matchup. The market seems to be buying into the Falcons, with the juice sliding toward them, or this spread dropping to +2.5. If +2.5 is available, Greenline thinks this is a good spot to fade the Falcons.
znModeratorfrom Week 7 PFF Preview – https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-week-7-pff-players-to-watch-predictions-betting-projections
Los Angeles Rams @ Atlanta Falcons
Players to Watch
The Falcons’ defense has been awful to start the season. Only the Miami Dolphins rank lower in EPA per play allowed, and Atlanta’s highest-graded defensive back in coverage is Desmond Trufant with his dismal 57.9 coverage grade. Deion Jones and Grady Jarrett have both earned high grades to start the year, but their efforts haven’t been enough to mask the woeful play in the secondary.
Cooper Kupp should have a field day against Atlanta if targeted early and often. He leads all Los Angeles receivers in yards per route run (2.20) and receiving grade (79.8) through Week 6.
In Week 1, the Rams had the fifth-highest time of possession (ignoring overtimes) in the league, at 33:16. That number has dropped literally every week since, down to a season-low 21:08 in Week 6 that was fourth-lowest. The team averaged the eighth-highest time of possession in 2018. Less time of possession generally means fewer plays, which means fewer chances at fantasy production. It lowers the ceiling of the entire offense.
Greenline Preview
Two teams that have underperformed and let bettors down face off in this potentially high-scoring matchup. The market seems to be buying into the Falcons, with the juice sliding toward them, or this spread dropping to +2.5. If +2.5 is available, Greenline thinks this is a good spot to fade the Falcons.
znModeratorfrom PFF: NFL defense rankings through Week 6 – https://www.pff.com/news/nfl-defense-rankings-through-week-6
10. LOS ANGELES RAMS
It’s hard to talk about the Rams defense and not begin with the absolute force in the middle of their defense that is Aaron Donald. Don’t fall for his pedestrian sack total of three. Donald has still proven to be one of the league’s best pass rushers with a pass-rushing grade of 90.3. The concern on the Rams defense is how their new-look cornerback unit will respond in the weeks to come. With Aqib Talib dealing with a serious rib injury and Marcus Peters being shipped to Baltimore, the cornerback room was dangerously thin for several hours, but those fears were quickly assuaged with the addition of Jalen Ramsey. Adding one of the top cornerbacks in the NFL can only help the Rams secondary, but will it be enough to propel them into top-five defense territory?
znModeratorI’m a sorta now-n-then user of Game Pass. I know of no way to get it on tv. Has to be the computer or phone, near as I know.
znModeratorVincent Bonsignore@VinnyBonsignore
Wade Phillips just came through the #Rams media room on his way to practice, took the podium to say he had one more thing to add: “Ramsey starts with Rams.” he said.And with that, Phillips was off to practice.
#Rams DC Wade Phillips complimented @jalenramsey on how smart he is and how quick he’s already been picking things up. As a result, if Jalen can play, it looks like there won’t be many scheme restrictions on him.
Stu Jackson@StuJRams
CB Jalen Ramsey participated in the Rams’ walkthrough this morning. HC Sean McVay said how he performs and recovers from this afternoon’s practice will provide better indication of whether he’ll play on Sunday against the Falcons.Lindsey Thiry@LindseyThiry
Sean McVay provided updates on Todd Gurley (Thigh contusion) and Malcolm Brown (Ankle): “Todd is making good progress. He participated in the walk through, he’s going to continue to do some stuff at practice and then with Malcolm, he’ll be day-to-day and we’ll just kind of keep our eye on that, but he won’t practice today.” When asked if Brown would play Sunday, McVay said: “It’s hard to say, he’s questionable for the game. I think you want to see some progress to be able to feel good about it.”Gary Klein@LATimesklein
Darious Williams said he was “absolutely” ready for opportunity. “That’s what you live for. You don’t come to the NFL just to sit back. You come to play against the best, and I feel like they did a good job preparing me. So either way I’m ready for it.”Stu Jackson@StuJRams
Q: What are the Rams getting out of Jalen Ramsey?A: “The best corner in the NFL for years and years and years to come. I’m going to be who I am and do what I got to do to go prove that statement is true.”
znModeratorJust gonna leave this here. Maybe my kids will see it. Maybe think I was pretty cool. Probably not. https://t.co/1Xk4HpxYkP
— Grant Wistrom (@GrantWistrom) October 16, 2019
znModeratorSosa K@QBsMVP
Atlanta’s pass defense is ranked 31st in DVOA, 30th in YPA at 8.5. They stink out loud. If Jared Goff and co. can’t get going in this one, break out the Bacardi 151.I’m not sure how you can quantify what the addition of Khalil Mack did for the Bears defense, but it was clearly insanely positive. The hope is Jalen Ramsey can do the same. Price was undoubtedly high, but I think back on whether I’d have paid what Mack cost, and it’s an easy yes
Lindsey Thiry@LindseyThiry
Jalen Ramsey, on Rams: “I’m a young guy still. Everybody around here’s kind of young. I feel like it’ll be like a little bit more understanding.”==
Rams third round rookie RB Darrell Henderson has some serious juice – pic.twitter.com/WATXOB69vl
— Michael Kist (@MichaelKistNFL) October 17, 2019
znModeratorGetting to know Jalen Ramsey with Jags Wire: What makes him so good?
Cameron DaSilva
Getting to know Jalen Ramsey with Jags Wire: What makes him so good?
As you may have heard, the Los Angeles Rams tweaked their secondary this week by trading Marcus Peters to the Ravens and then acquiring Jalen Ramsey from the Jacksonville Jaguars. The Rams gave up a lot to get Ramsey, sending the Jaguars two first-round picks and a fourth-rounder, so the expectations are high for him in Los Angeles.
To get to know Ramsey better, we talked to Jags Wire editor James Johnson. He shared some insight on the cornerback, what makes him so good and whether his back injury is legitimate.
Is Ramsey better in man or zone coverage?
I think he’s suited to be more of a man-to-man defender. However, the Jags used more zone than man during his tenure there. Last year, they were in man 36.9 percent of their snaps, which was good for 21st in the league. He’s voiced his displeasure for that at times and I can see why. A player with his athletic build and skills should be allowed more opportunities for one-on-ones because he’s pretty hard to beat off the line, but that’s not to say a coordinator should completely cater to his wishes because he’s solid in zone, too. I think a team with better balance would do him justice and Wade Phillips should enjoy having Ramsey on his unit.
What’s the deal with his “back injury?” Was that just a way to get out of Jacksonville?
In Wednesday’s presser, coach Doug Marrone told the media that Ramsey legitimately had a back injury. Additionally, he’s dealt with back issues behind the scenes in the past, so it’s possible he may have been dealing with an issue to some degree. However, in those instances, he played through it (and other issues) and that’s likely where Jags fans began to grow frustrated with him. That said, the bigger question might be whether or not the injury was bad enough to keep him out if his trade request wasn’t on the table.
What makes Ramsey one of the best CBs in the NFL?
Oh man, where do I start? His elite athleticism for starters. There aren’t many 6-foot-1, 210-pound players who can move like he can and compete with the wide receiver position like he can, and as we all know, the receiver position consists of some of the world’s best athletes. Simply put, he makes game-planning easier because he pretty much eliminates most of the opponents who line up in front of him with the exception of a few. He also has the ability to affect others psychologically, whether it’s his teammates or the opposition. In today’s game, this is helpful because you need every edge you can get.
Can he play in the slot as well as outside?
I can probably count on my hands the few times he’s played in the slot in Jacksonville because it’s been that rare. He did it more so in college and that led to many fans wanting to see him do it in the pros, but for the most part, he’s played on the outside. I believe he’s more than capable of handling the slot though and has the ability to play safety, too.
What’s something fans should know about Ramsey?
I know this might sound cliché, but he truly loves the game of football. However, I think he just expressed it in the wrong ways in Jacksonville. It seems he also wanted to love the game in a bigger market, as he’s hinted at that on occasions. We’ve seen this in the past with players like Deion Sanders, who bounced around throughout his career. Of course, if healthy he’ll have a Hall of Fame career, but he’s going to have to learn how to express himself better at times, especially in a media market like Los Angeles’. Hopefully, he doesn’t let anything steer him away from the game either, which again, is what he seems to truly love.
znModeratorRams Head Coach Sean McVay, Run Game Coordinator Aaron Kromer — October 16, 2019
***
Rams Head Coach Sean McVay
(On if he has an update regarding S John Johnson III)
“He’s (S John Johnson III) going to have surgery in a couple weeks – get his shoulder fixed. When you look at it and get the opinions, it’s something that we all felt like was the best thing. Most importantly, I think that’s what’s best for John over the longevity of his career and how much time he’s got left. Disappointed – that’s a big-time contribution that we’re going to miss out on. He’s had a great season up to this point, he’s really done a nice job continuing to develop. This is a temporary set-back for him and he’ll come back strong.”(On what he thinks CB Jalen Ramsey brings to the team and if he’s had a chance to speak with him)
“I spoke with him (CB Jalen Ramsey) yesterday. Excited to get him out here. He’s in the process of finalizing just getting out here and getting going. Very exciting thing for us. Obviously, you know the caliber of player that he is – the competitiveness, the toughness. Really, all the traits that you look for in a corner, and those are some of the things that are exciting about getting him in here. Looking forward to really just getting to know the player and figuring out how he’s going to help this football team.”(On if he thinks Ramsey will be available to play on Sunday)
“The goal is to be able to do that, but we’ll be smart about it. I think that we definitely want to have the intent to get him ready to go and we’ll always make smart decisions. But, yes, that’s the goal and we’ll figure out if that ends up coming to fruition or not.”(On who would start if Ramsey was not available to play)
“(CB) Darious Williams is a guy that we feel really good about. He’s had a really good camp, did a lot of good stuff in the preseason, so he would be the next guy up.”(On what Tuesday was like for him with losing CB Marcus Peters but bringing in Ramsey)
“That’s part of it and you’ve got to be able to adjust and adapt. I think the first thing is you want to say thank you to (former Rams CB) Marcus Peters for his contribution over the last year and a half or so. We’ve gotten a good relationship and I’ve really been very appreciative of how he’s been from day one. Even just yesterday when he’s leaving and going out to Baltimore, I thought it was a great reflection of just handling things the right way. I wish him nothing but the best and I’m a big fan of Marcus Peters and very appreciative of what he’s done for this team, for me and getting to know him. I love him and I’m looking forward to seeing him continue to succeed for the rest of his career. Getting Jalen in here – like I said – looking forward to getting to know him. I know he’s a really good football player, has a really unique skillset. But, it’s about us getting to know him, continuing to figure out what’s the best way to put him in the right spots and then, how does he fit with his 10 teammates? That’s something that we’re excited about getting going on.(On what LB Kenny Young and OL Austin Corbett’s roles will be)
“That’s to be determined. We just got them (LB Kenny Young and OL Austin Corbett) in here. These are guys that we were familiar with – being younger players when you evaluate them in the draft – and then they have had some experience that you can draw on in the NFL. It’s the same thing with Jalen even though he’s got more experience and he’s got more tape out there. But, really, with all three of these guys, let’s get them involved in this building, get them to know their teammates, their coaches and then ultimately try to put them in positions to succeed.”(On if he has updates on RB Todd Gurley II, RB Malcolm Brown and who will fill OL Joe Noteboom’s position on the offensive line)
“With (RB) Todd (Gurley II), he is going to go today. He’s going to do some individual things like that. He just took part in the walk-thru, so he’s definitely making good progress. (RB) Malcolm (Brown), we’re continuing to be day-to-day with him. We’ll rest him today, and then we’ll monitor that as the week progresses. It’s looking like we’re going to see (T) David Edwards at that guard spot.”(On if there is a conversation with the players telling them that Tuesday’s moves are about this season as much as they are about the future of the organization)
“Yeah. It’s a production business now, while you also want to have a big-picture perspective. That’s part of our job, that’s part of the role that we have. You just see how important it is to produce in the present, and that’s what we want to be able to do. Every move that we make is in the immediate future, but also with consideration of the long-term future as well. That’s part of what you have to do and what the balance is and kind of how you say, ‘All right, what does that look like in terms of right now and then four, five years down the line?’ Those are things that we always take into consideration and definitely are part of our decision-making process.”(On what T David Edwards has shown)
“Just good, steady progress. He’s got a comfort level with the fundamentals, the techniques. He’s played both those spots, he’s really played both tackle spots as well. I think just the production that we’ve seen from him, the way that he’s been able to grow, we’re very confident that he’ll be able to step in and do a nice job.”(On getting players in now instead of the draft and if the coach always err on the side of the now)
“I would say this, as you continue to get experience, I think you’re really kind of developing your philosophy. You know what a point chart looks like and how that fits and measures up, but I think there is a kind of a gut instinct in terms of, all right, would this be something and there’s the money element that comes into play with the salary cap and different things like that. That’s why we’re so fortunate to have (Owner/Chairman) Mr. (E. Stanley) Kroenke be so committed to giving us the resources necessary and so appreciative of his leadership and guidance that he provides. All those things do come into play, but really you weigh the pros and cons. You have to make those decisions and usually those are easy to kind of look at right now. A few years down the line, you can really say, ‘Was it the right decision or was is it not?’ It’s always easy to kind of have an opinion, but then when you look back on it after the fact and you really get a chance to evaluate the player the way that that player fit in to the team. Did it work out over the longevity considering the fact what you gave up? I think that’s when you can really, truly evaluate it. We feel good about it, we wouldn’t have done anything that we didn’t feel good about and didn’t think that was in the best interest for the team.”(On if he has any concerns with Ramsey’s ability to fit in with the team)
“No, because I think you want guys with some swag, some personality, different things like that. As long as those guys love football, they love competing every single day, I think usually this is a building that I think will suit him well. We always do our due diligence in terms of the people that we value and trust that have been around him. Those are the things that have been consistent with what we’ve heard. You get really good reviews back on him, we’ve got a couple guys on this team that have played with him that speak very highly of him. When you do all those things, I think you feel confident to be able to make decisions that are really from educated opinions, as opposed to sometimes what the perception can be where they really know the human being day-in and day-out.”(On if T Bobby Evans will play more with the change at left guard)
“(Run Game Coordinator) Coach (Aaron) Kromer does a great job of continuing to develop those guys. I think what you do see is, you never know. It’s one thing if you’re really cemented in one of those starting five roles. Those guys are those backups and usually you’re carrying two backups on gameday. Then, you’ve got three on your roster with your 53 active. It’s about making sure that, okay, there’s a bunch of different situations that could arise. We can’t just have guys that are one position players. You want to be able to continue to develop their depth, but (T) Bobby (Evans) is a guy that we think has a bright future whether that be at the guard or the tackle position, remains to be seen, but I do think that he can do both.”(On what Ramsey’s week look like to make sure that he is up to speed to be able to play Sunday)
“The first thing is let’s get him in here. Let’s get him up to speed, mentally. Let’s see how he’s feeling physically. Then, it’ll be an incremental build. Really, we’ll do what’s in the best interest of Jalen and our team. If he can go, if he’s feeling good with all things considered, then I think you can expect him to play. If not, then we’ll make the right decision for him and the team. Those are things that until he gets in here, it’s hard to truly say. It’ll be about let’s get the mental and the physical on a slow, progressive build that’s smart for him as the week progresses.”(On winning three games in a row and losing three games in a row and if it’s hard to look within to do something different or not)
“I think in a low of instances, you try to keep consistent with whatever the result is. Lets still look back on what are the things within each individual’s role that we can all do better. I know that there’s an added sense of urgency when you don’t get the result that you want, but you try to be consistent with that. That’s the thing that you love so much is that whether you won or whether you lost, you go back to work and you’ve got another game to prepare for. I think that’s what helps you bounce back and then that’s where you can’t dwell on if you do have success too long because then the next week catches up with you and you’re not ready to go. I would say, I know for me and I think a lot of our players and coaches would agree, the exciting thing is, you can’t look back on what occurred already, but I’m excited about the opportunity we have against the Falcons in Atlanta this Sunday.***
Rams Run Game Coordinator Aaron Kromer
(Opening Remarks)
“I’d like to start first just by talking about (T) Joe Noteboom. The guy put in so much work, so much sacrifice, moved positions, played left guard instead of his left tackle (position) that he was brought here to do. Right when he was really starting to get it, these last two games, he had a lot of success and was really helping our offense move forward. For him to get hurt, man, I feel for him, the family, and it hurts all of us. Of course, we get close to these guys and that just stinks for him. The season is going to go on, and there is nothing we can do about that. We have to move on and I know (Rams Head Coach) Sean (McVay) had already said that (T) David Edwards will fill in that spot. We feel highly about how fast he’s learned football. Obviously playing at Wisconsin, he has a good upbringing in college, big time football. We feel like he’s going to do the job there and we feel like it’s the best bet for us. We’ve been inconsistent as an offensive line and as an offensive unit, in general. We’ve had spurts. If you look at that first drive running it all the way down the field last week, against a good defense. Same thing at Seattle, getting some good runs, having good protection. And then, you get behind the chains or you get in a bad situation that’s never good for an offensive lineman or a quarterback. If we can keep more efficiency and get back to the Rams offense that we know, as far as be a little bit more consistent on first down. If you don’t, then be able to make up half or so on the second down if we get in a second-and-long situation. We’ve just been in disadvantage situations. Whether it’s one guy or 11 guys, whatever, it doesn’t matter what it is. We are not quite there at this point.. But, we do believe we are getting there. We are excited about the opportunity to give David in there, and continue to work with this line, we’ll have another couple of young backups ready for the game. We will see who it is later in the week as it goes on and we make the best decision there. All and all, obviously, we’d like the season or the offensive line, the offense to be playing better at this time. When it all comes down to it, I’m sure Sean has already said it, it’s fundamentals and technique. It’s everybody doing it together. Can we get the fundamentals and techniques of 11 guys, five guys in my department, to do it right at the same time in order to have success. We’ve had that, but not consistent enough to be the powerful offense that we want to be. Our daily job right now as a coach, is really, ‘Hey, what can I do to change it?’ Each person in the building, what can we do to get better?’ It’s being hard on each other, them being hard on me, me being hard on them, meaning demanding the right things. Which we do from day one, but have we done it hard enough? I don’t know. We know this, we are going to continue to do it, we are going to make sure that we get better at fundamentals and techniques as a group and as a unit. Individually we haven’t, but you need 11 guys to do it at one time to have success. We look forward to that opportunity, we look forward to the challenge. We haven’t been in this situation, you all know that, since we been here at the Rams. As coaches or as players, we’ve all been in this in the past and the best way to get out of it is to make sure you understand what you need to do, how you that need to do it, and how it helps the team.”(On T Rob Havenstein and T Andrew Whitworth’s performance over the last few games)
“Like I said prior, we’ve been in situations that we haven’t been in, in prior years. We haven’t been down at the end of the game and have to come back as many times as we have. We haven’t been down in games and had to throw the ball as many times as we did in Tampa, just to get back in the game. We didn’t get in situations like San Francisco where the last drive we are trying to score twice, as opposed to once to win the game. We haven’t been in these situations. It’s a mental test for all of us, a physical test for all of us. This where the techniques in those departments, you think about is there too much pressure in those situations? And I say no. It’s football, you do what you are supposed to do, you do it how you’re supposed to do it. And if guys do that, you go down and score. If one guy of the 11 doesn’t, could be receiver, could be a quarterback, could be a half back, could be left tackle, could be left guard, could be anybody. There is a chance you make a play, but not a good chance.”(On what the plan is to integrate OL Austin Corbett into the offense)
“That’s a good question. Coming out of college Austin, we thought was a good athlete a good college player. For whatever happened in Cleveland where he hasn’t had the production that you thought, we’re excited about having him. We think he’s a big athletic guy and we’re going to try to wean him into the offense and see where he can fit and see if his athleticism fits us better than it did the Cleveland Browns. We have high hopes for him, but at this point being new and they really don’t use the techniques that we do, so it will take a little bit of time I believe. Hopefully we can get him helping us sooner than later.”(On if he sees Corbett more as a guard or a center)
“I think both. I think obviously he’s athletic to play guard, but he bends well enough to play center. When we worked him out, we had him at center up at the college. He really moved down the line of scrimmage really well, he was athletic to the second level. I don’t know, we’ll see. We haven’t had a chance to get our hands on him yet, and really had much time with him. As soon as we do, we’re going to be excited about it I’m sure.”(On Falcons Head Coach Dan Quinn saying when you have been to the Super Bowl you get studied more and if he feels like that’s happening)
“Anytime you’re the lead dog, people are going to be hunting you and that’s where we’ve been and everybody is hunting us. So, they are putting a lot of time into trying to stop us and our style of offense. You see the McVay descendants, if you want to call them, getting head coaching jobs around the league. They know that around the league there’s going to be three or four of our offenses out there and they need to be able to stop them if they want to win their division or make it to the Super Bowl or whatever it is for them. There are a lot of people studying us. I still say that there’s answers. There’s answers within our offense that we have and we just haven’t coached or executed them well enough this year.”(On what else stood out to him about Corbett when evaluating him)
“Well, there’s two things other than his athleticism and ability to play in college. One was his intelligence. I believe he graduated in law and he is mature. A guy that’s married and is beyond his years maturity wise. Both of those things go well if you’re going to have a chance for success, you’re going to be focused enough to be able to do that.”October 17, 2019 at 1:22 am in reply to: Rams traded Marcus Peters to Ravens for LB Kenny Young #106828
znModeratorDeadpool
Young. I went back into my draft notes from 2018 and found the Rams had him in for a private visit. You only get 30, so they must have had some interest at some point in early 2018.
That led me to dig into Wade’s defense a little more, and what I found was (according to articles) is that his defense is softest in the short middle of the field. He resolved this issue by using Danny Trevathan, a 6′-0″ 235 lb. athletic LBer that can move and cover, and Brandon Marshall a 6′-1″ 242 lb linebacker with enough athletic ability to make plays sideline to sideline.
My thinking is Littleton could team up with Young in base situations and solidify the softest part of the scheme. Esp. considering the addition of Ramsey should finally let Phillips unleash his type of defense.
Ramsey should allow Wade to finally play press man and to get aggressive with his front seven, combine that with the addition of Young to be able to cover more ground then Reeder or Hager in the base defense and Rapp to continue to play that big nickel backer in passing downs and Wade’s defense might finally start clicking this year.
znModeratorThe Rams’ trade for Jalen Ramsey was the opposite of a short-sighted move
Vincent Bonsignore
THOUSAND OAKS, Calif. — Not long after completing the first of three trades that reset the Rams’ present and future — which culminated with the arrival of Jalen Ramsey, arguably the best cornerback in football — general manager Les Snead took a moment Tuesday to gather himself before reaching for his cell phone.
The call he was about to make was obligatory, one he’s had to make more times than he cares to remember. But no matter how procedural it is, or how many times he’s closed his eyes and delivered life-altering words to a player he’s come to admire and respect, the task never gets easier.
And this call was particularly difficult, to tell Marcus Peters he was being sent to the Baltimore Ravens in a mid-season trade that materialized almost out of thin air. Peters become an organization favorite after arriving from the Kansas City Chiefs in February 2018.
“There’s a moment where you go, ‘OK, I wish I would’ve never taken this job,’ because that’s not a call you want to make,” Snead said.
It was, however, a call he had to make. And not just to personally deliver the news to Peters.
This was about putting the Rams in a better position for the long haul. That element got lost in the shuffle when people wondered if the Rams, by trading Peters and giving up two first-round picks for Ramsey — were making a short-sighted grab for an immediate reward at the expense of the future.
It was anything but that, actually. In fact, when the Rams executed the Peters trade they had no guarantee the Ramsey trade would come to fruition. They were fully prepared to move forward with young cornerbacks Troy Hill, Darious Williams and David Long Jr. filling in for Peters and injured veteran Aqib Talib.
Trading Peters certainly put the Rams in position to be real players for Ramsey. But it also created salary-cap space to address other positions. The Rams acquired linebacker Kenny Young in the Peters deal, and traded with Cleveland on Tuesday to get offensive linemen Austin Corbett, who will compete for the left guard opening created by Joe Noteboom’s season-ending knee injury. Both were tied into the Peters move.
The moves also created $3.5 million in cap room, to be used either this year or rolled over to the offseason, when the Rams expect to be players in the free-agent market. They also added a 2020 fifth-round draft pick.
The cap room, Young and that fifth-round pick were valued higher by the Rams than the 2021 compensation pick they would have received if Peters left via free agency after this season, which seemed likely.
As someone with the Rams pointed out Wednesday, if the Rams were thinking only about the short term, they would have kept Peters and simply traded for Ramsey. But they chose the future assets instead. And now they get a chance to get a long look at Williams and Long, one or both of whom likely will figure prominently in the team’s future. There’s value there, a point solidified by the numerous times opposing general managers asked Snead if he’d be willing to part with either young cornerback in a trade.
By trading Peters instead, the Rams thought about the long term rather than the short term. And as hard it was emotionally for Snead to make that call, it was the right decision for the health of the organization.
“Instead of unloading maybe one of our unproven, younger corners, with interest in Marcus it might be time and best for us to move him so that he can start his next chapter and we can start ours,” is how Snead explained it.
As for Ramsey, Snead and the Rams thought far beyond just this year by sending their 2020 and 2021 first-round picks and a 2021 fourth-round pick to the Jaguars for him.
The Rams haven’t lost sight of this year’s goals, and still believe they can find the necessary remedies and make a run at the playoffs after losing three straight games to fall into third place in the NFC West. But their vision and thinking has expanded beyond the borders of this season. Taken it totality, the additions of Ramsey — the Rams have a high comfort level about signing him to a long-term contract before his current deal expires after the 2020 season — Young, Corbett, an additional draft pick and salary-cap space broaden that border.
And while two first-round picks seem like a steep price, play it out and the cost is far less than it appears. Ramsey essentially becomes the Rams’ 2020 first-round pick, so in reality they gave up one first-round pick and a fourth-rounder to secure him. That is not a prohibitive cost.
Think of it this way: A player of Ramsey’s caliber is rarely available where the Rams hope to be drafting — late in the first round — and trading up into the top five to draft a player of his stature would cost even more than what they paid Tuesday. Another difference is, the Rams already know what they are getting in Ramsey: The best cover corner in the NFL and a perfect fit for Wade Phillips’ 3-4 defense. No one they could have drafted in 2020 or 2021 provides that level of certainty.
“Not saying that there are not a lot of good corners out there, but since he’s been in the league, he’s shown the ability to be able to get on an island,” Snead said. “If you look at some of the receivers he’s played against, whether it was in Pittsburgh a couple of years in the playoff run, whether it was against (Texans receiver) DeAndre Hopkins, things like that, you’ve got a good subset of case studies to go watch and it was actually fun studying him. You come away very impressed with how he approaches the game in pass and in the run, tackling and covering and you’re very impressed with mom, dad and God and what they gave this kid.”
As the Rams head into the next phase of the season and beyond, they already know they will build their defense around Ramsey and lineman Aaron Donald, the best players at their respective positions in the NFL.
There is a risk, as there is no guarantee Ramsey and the Rams will come to agreement on a long-term extension. Ramsey can be under team control through the 2022 season when you factor in the franchise-tag option, which the team could utilize in 2021 and 2022. But it’s doubtful it ever gets to that point, as Ramsey now becomes a priority to re-sign to a long-term contract.
Any concern was mitigated when Snead checked in with Ramsey’s agent to articulate his vision for where he hopes the 24-year-old All-Pro fits in long-range, and to gauge interest in making this a long-term relationship. Snead made it clear that after that conversation, he was comfortable pulling the trigger on the trade.
Anything is possible, but it sure seems like this is headed toward a long, happy union.
And with the Oct. 29 NFL trade deadline still a ways off, you get the sense Snead and the Rams might not be done re-tooling.
For the future and for the present.
“It is some interesting ideas being floated,” he said, smiling. “You always have to assess those.”
October 17, 2019 at 12:53 am in reply to: Falcons game TV Map + question: how will the Rams do this time? #106826
znModeratorFalcons defense is inexplicably bad though they could rebound. Whether it does or not this game represents a chance for the beat-up Rams to get back on track.
znModeratorStu Jackson@StuJRams
CB Jalen Ramsey said he’s “super, super excited” to be here.“I heard the culture here is dope. Can’t wait to be a part of it, honestly. Can’t wait to be able to be myself on and off the field, just help the organization in every way that I can.”
Joe Curley@vcsjoecurley
“I know Aaron Donald is on this defense, the best player in the NFL.” — Jalen Ramseyjosinaanderson@JosinaAnderson
#Eagles player to me on Jalen Ramsey going to the #Rams: “We dropped the ball. I don’t even want to talk about that (!@#^). Everybody knew what it was going to take to get him. I could’ve told you that.”==
Tony Dungy@TonyDungy
We can’t blame it all on the refs. Lack of practice time & the idea that coaching is all schemes & plays has led to a breakdown in fundamentals. Lots of procedural penalties, jerseys being grabbed & bad technique. You don’t see Patriots with huge penalty numbers. Coaching mattersOctober 16, 2019 at 9:45 pm in reply to: Grading the Rams' 3 trades + NFL execs (via Sando) eval the Ramsey trade #106822
znModeratorPanic move? Brilliant gambit? Neither? NFL execs weigh in on the Rams’ Jalen Ramsey trade
Mike Sando
https://theathletic.com/1298733/2019/10/16/jalen-ramsey-trade-rams-jaguars-nfl-execs/
The Los Angeles Rams could have conceded that their Super Bowl window had closed enough to justify turning their attention to restocking their team with young depth. How fun would that have been? Instead, they doubled down in spectacular fashion by sending two first-round picks and a fourth-rounder to the Jacksonville Jaguars for aggrieved cornerback Jalen Ramsey.
Was it a panic move? A brilliant gambit? Both? Neither?
“I’m more interested in how it’s going to work and for how long,” an NFL team exec said, “because sitting there and saying he’s a No. 1 corner and they can play more man coverage and put an ‘x’ over the No. 1 receiver, everyone knows that.”
NFL insiders offered a range of opinions and insights on the deal as the league buzzed over the trade Tuesday night. We’ll unpack the six most compelling takes here.
Take No. 1: The Rams’ trust in Wade Phillips is captivating
Marcus Peters and Aqib Talib were first. Now, Ramsey. All three corners clashed with previous teams at various points for various reasons. The Rams delivered every one of them to defensive coordinator Wade Phillips, who seems uniquely suited for handling players who have not fit as well in other places.
“Everyone can afford to trade those picks (for Ramsey), and no one else does,” a personnel director said. “These guys (the Rams) have an affinity for the super-high-end corner with a super-high-end set of luggage. This guy’s got Samsonites, Tumis, he’s got it all. He’s the guy who talks in GQ Magazine in the offseason and tells you who the good quarterbacks are and he’s been in the league for 15 minutes.”
It’s actually three-plus seasons and two Pro Bowls for Ramsey at this point. There has been no shortage of Ramsey headlines since Jacksonville picked him fifth overall in the 2016 draft.
Beyond criticizing quarterbacks, Ramsey has clashed with officials, reporters, opposing players, his head coach and the front office. He once suggested a “homer” field judge was “kin” of Houston Texans receiver DeAndre Hopkins. Another time, Ramsey threatened “war” on reporters and was suspended by the team for a week as a result. Ramsey has called tight end Rob Gronkoswki overrated. He was once ejected along with Cincinnati Bengals receiver A.J. Green for an in-game fight. This season, a sideline confrontation with Jaguars coach Doug Marrone made waves. Ramsey later indicated the Jaguars’ front office, headed by Tom Coughlin, had disrespected him during a meeting.
In other words, nothing the 72-year-old Phillips hasn’t seen in his four decades of NFL coaching.
“The Rams are probably thinking, ‘We have a decent offense, a young head coach, we are going to have this nucleus of players together for a while,’” the personnel director said. “They like to leverage Wade, who creates a melting pot over there. He did it in Denver, where he just takes a big blend of veterans and gets those guys to play together.”
In most cases, the Broncos and Rams had easy escape routes if they wanted to terminate relationships with players perceived as carrying elevated risks. This time, Phillips’ team traded away two first-round picks and a fourth-rounder. The Rams are all-in on Ramsey. They were not all-in on veteran rentals such as Peters (whom they traded to Baltimore in exchange for second-year linebacker Kenny Young and a 2020 fifth-round pick), Ndamukong Suh, Talib, etc.
“Wade is good when he has the good players, just like everybody, but mixing together all the veterans, that takes a special skill,” the director said. “Other guys can’t do that.”
Take No. 2: Problem is, the Rams are not a corner away
Most would agree that the Rams are better after trading Peters to Baltimore earlier Tuesday and then adding Ramsey from the Jaguars.
“Taking away half the field is a good way of beating anybody,” an exec said, “but the teams they have to beat in their division (Seattle and San Francisco) want to run the ball. And when your opponents are built to run the ball, I don’t know that trading two first-round picks for a corner is the right move.”
OK, but collecting great draft picks is easier than collecting great players. Also, veterans are easier to prepare for prominent roles than rookies in this era of fewer practices. Because few appealing veterans reach free agency, trades can provide a valuable alternative.
“The Rams are not a corner short,” this exec replied. “Teams are not throwing the ball all over the yard on them, by and large. They have a depth problem. Why do they have a depth problem? They trade away their picks.”
The Rams did not select in the first rounds of the 2017, 2018 or 2019 drafts, instead using those picks primarily for acquiring quarterback Jared Goff in 2016 and receiver Brandin Cooks via trade with the Patriots in 2018. They traded back from the 31st overall slot in the most recent draft, but still managed to select four players over the first three rounds, an effort to address depth. They rank among the NFL’s top 10 in home-grown draft choices under contract.
Can they restock their offensive line and other areas after trading away premium picks?
Take No. 3: Is this a panic move by the Rams?
The Rams paid running back Todd Gurley at the top of the market when they did not have to do so. They were also aggressive in paying Goff. Neither player is performing to that level at this point. Will they in the future? Most think Ramsey is a slam dunk from a performance standpoint, but the Rams didn’t just trade for him. They paid the highest price, straight up, that any team has paid for a corner in a long time, maybe ever.
“I think it was a panic move that falls in line with some of the out-of-the-box moves they have made in the past, starting with doing Gurley two years early and resetting the market, and then continuing with $33.5 million for Goff,” an exec said. “If this was done two weeks ago when they were 3-1, it would have made more sense, because I think there would have been more confidence in, they will get it together, they will be in the playoffs, their picks are going to be in the late 20s.”
This exec also noted that Ramsey’s agent is in “no hurry” to get a deal done. The price could be $18 million a year or more when the time comes.
“What if all of a sudden he decides he wants $22-23 million and you are in camp next year and he doesn’t show up?” the exec said. “Even if you are willing to pay, you need to get that taken care of so you know you’ve got this guy. Right now, the Rams and Bears do not fear Aaron Donald and Khalil Mack holding out. You can’t say that about Ramsey.”
This exec thought any objective analysis would concede that San Francisco and Seattle appear likely to reach the playoffs, which could leave the Rams competing with five or six relatively strong NFC teams for a wild-card spot.
“They are looking at their team with glass half full, with some slightly rose-colored glasses, with regard to Goff and the offense, and thinking that they are going to end up winning the division when they have already lost to San Francisco and Seattle,” this exec said. “They were not realistic, in my opinion, about the uncertainty relating to Goff. Sean McVay is still a great coach, but for whatever reason, that offense is not nearly the same as the high-flying one it has been the last two years. Ramsey doesn’t change that.”
Take No. 4: The Ramsey trade differs from the Khalil Mack trade in important ways
Acquiring Mack from Oakland was relatively safe and straightforward for the Bears. They had a long-term contract worked out, and Mack had earned a reputation as an excellent teammate. Ramsey does not check those boxes as neatly, if at all.
“I want to see them get the contract done before we say too much, because I don’t know if this kid is going to be happy unless you make him the highest-paid corner,” an evaluator said. “You could have another headache coming up. Two, I don’t mind trading away a couple firsts if you feel like your picks are going to be late and you get a superstar. The scary part of this trade is, you don’t always hear the best stuff about Ramsey as a teammate.”
This evaluator thought the Mack trade worked out well for both the Raiders and Bears. Oakland got to rebuild under a new coach armed with long-term security. Chicago got an elite player in his prime as the Bears sought to win right away.
Ramsey’s contract situation bears watching. A fifth-year option for 2020 and up to three years of franchise tags could give the Rams longer-term control, depending on what happens with the next collective bargaining agreement, but there is a risk in giving up high draft choices for a player without a long-term deal. Top corners currently earn $15 million a year. Ramsey could have the leverage to push for much more.
“That is not necessarily the smartest move when you are trading first-round picks,” the evaluator said, “but when you are trying to win a Super Bowl, sometimes you have to compromise the values.”
Take No. 5: The Jaguars should come out OK, with a caveat
The Jaguars and Ramsey ideally would have entered into a long-term contract and lived happily ever after. That wasn’t going to happen. Jacksonville could have done worse than getting two first-round picks and a fourth-rounder in return for player who had, by all appearances, checked out mentally and emotionally.
“Jacksonville is going to make out pretty good on this thing as far as the picks go, assuming the Rams do not win a bunch of games, which I assume they will not do,” an exec said, “but Jacksonville is going to have a culture problem going forward. Any player who wants out of there can get out of there. It won’t be hard.”
Adding the two first-round picks gives the Jaguars options as they continue to evaluate quarterbacks Gardner Minshew and Nick Foles.
“I’d trade Ramsey for two ones and a four if he didn’t want to be there, wouldn’t you?” another exec said. “You might have a quarterback you like, which is important. You are starting to make progress. Four ones in the next two years, that’s pretty sweet. If you wind up really liking the kid (Minshew), maybe you trade Foles next year.”
Take No. 6: Ramsey is a great talent, but is he a great corner?
There have been Ramsey skeptics over the years. A general manager consulted before the 2016 draft said he thought Ramsey’s combine workout was more impressive than his actual cornerback play. Another GM consulted at that time questioned whether Ramsey took away the ball frequently enough to merit a top-five selection (Ramsey has 10 interceptions in 54 NFL games, counting playoffs).
A majority of evaluators consulted in recent months thought Ramsey was the NFL’s top corner, with Stephon Gilmore and Marshon Lattimore also receiving mention. But an evaluator who rated Ramsey as the NFL’s best corner two years ago called the Rams’ acquisition of him a mistake at the price required to get the deal done.
“He can only play press or man,” this evaluator said. “Any type of combo coverage or zone, he seems to struggle with the concepts. Deion Sanders, he did not tackle, he made business decisions, but he knew coverages and how to play corner. This kid (Ramsey) is extremely talented but doesn’t know how to play corner in that way.”
Even so, a GM consulted last week called Ramsey “the best corner in the league when he is on and playing.” A longtime exec thought the New England Patriots’ signing of Gilmore two years ago showed the value an elite corner offers when used correctly.
Nineteen months have passed since the Rams acquired Peters and a sixth-round pick from Kansas City for second- and fourth-round choices. Peters, a veteran of 74 regular-season and playoff games, was known for a ball-hawking style predicated on off-coverage. He intercepted 14 passes in his first 25 games, eight in his next 25 games and four over his 24 most recent games. Those diminishing returns could have precipitated his departure Tuesday.
The Rams are now betting they can get much more from a different kind of corner in Ramsey. This time, the stakes are much higher.
znModeratorJoe Curley@vcsjoecurley
Jared Goff on Jalen Ramsey calling him “average to above average” in his famous GQ interview last year. “In relation to what he was calling a lot of people, that wasn’t half bad… That’s part of Jalen’s attitude and it doesn’t bother me one bit.”Vincent Bonsignore@VinnyBonsignore
#Rams Todd Gurley was officially listed as “limited” for Wednesday’s practice.Joe Curley@vcsjoecurley
Rams CB Troy Hill on potentially playing alongside Jalen Ramsey: “It’s going to be exciting. That’s a lock-down corner, so you’ve got to expect to get a lot of action on the other side.”—
The @Jaguars boasted one of the best pass defense in the #NFL with @jalenramsey. How will his trade to the @RamsNFL impact both teams?#LARams #DUUUVAL @gregcosell | @MattBowen41 pic.twitter.com/I41uydiwHb
— NFL Matchup on ESPN (@NFLMatchup) October 16, 2019
October 16, 2019 at 8:44 pm in reply to: Grading the Rams' 3 trades + NFL execs (via Sando) eval the Ramsey trade #106817
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znModeratorRams General Manager Les Snead – October 16, 2019
(Opening Remarks)
“I’ll start with our first trade that we made with Cleveland in (OL) Austin Corbett. It starts with our draft prep in the 2018 draft. We liked him coming out, I know we sent (Run Game Coordinator) Aaron Kromer to go work him out, visit with him privately. Then he goes through his rookie season and there’s a regime change there where (Browns General Manager) John (Dorsey) is still there and (Browns Head Coach) Freddie (Kitchens) gets promoted from offensive coordinator to head coach, but a new offensive line coach comes in. I’m actually just discussing some things with John that have nothing to do with Austin. But, he did mention – because of our (T Joe) Noteboom injury – ‘Hey, would you have an interest in Austin?’ So that’s how some of those things come into fruition. We were going to put ‘Note’ (T Joe Noteboom) on ‘IR’ (injured reserve), unfortunately, and we had a spot at ‘OL.’ That’s someone we appreciated the versatility coming out and said, ‘Hey, let’s try to work something out.’ It takes a little bit of 2018 draft prep, it takes an unfortunate injury to ‘Note’ and it leads to that.Let’s get to the two other trades that – poor Austin Corbett, nobody’s here to probably talk about Austin, even though he was the No. 33rd in that ’18 draft. I’ll go back to the ’19 draft of where – if we go again, a telescopic view of how this happens and some context. We did know coming into that draft that, from our corner situation, we had two unrestricted free agents. We didn’t know in that draft there was a subset of corners that were quality players that we liked, subjectively. Again, you always say time will tell. There’s a projection element and then there’s a development element. Then, you’ve got to live up to the projection, per se. We were predicting that where we were drafting, based probably a lot on the quality of some of the front seven players in last year’s draft – again, that’s the right appeal. But, you felt like when we went to pick, at some point, there was going to be a corner available that we liked and might be wise to, again, add young, youth based on the uncertainty of going into the season with two players that are unrestricted free agents. Then, interestingly, we get to preseason – a lot of these calls begin occurring even in the preseason because we had, again, three proven players, three players that we ended up keeping that had really good preseasons. One player that we cut, actually, was claimed, so we ended up keeping six – let’s call it – younger players, with little less proven because of, again, that uncertainty with this corner situation. The calls probably began at the preseason, ‘Hey, would you release one of those or trade one of those younger players?’ Again, this is all building up to where it ended yesterday. Those teams have always felt like our corner situation was somewhat strong – or at least deep – whether it was an unproven player or a veteran player.
Here’s how it unfolded again with (former Rams CB) Marcus (Peters). I’ll start with this with Marcus – any time you’re a ‘GM’ (general manager) and you call a player like him and tell him that you’re trading him, you actually walk down the hall and there’s a moment where you go, ‘Okay, I wish I would’ve never taken this job’ because that’s not a call you want to make. Unbelievable how Marcus handled it – extreme professionalism. He was in downtown L.A. and I said, ‘Hey, I know a lot of people here would like to say goodbye, starting with (Head Coach) Sean (McVay) and your coaches. I understand and respect your emotions. If you’d like to maybe just get on a plane and move on to the next chapter.’ He said, ‘You know what, I’m going to get up there a little bit later and say goodbye.’ I can tell you this about Marcus Peters – he’s one of the most authentic human beings I’ve ever met. He’s going to continue making impacts both on the field and off the field. Nothing but respect for that human being. It’s always tough and I’m pulling for him. In this whole determination as you go through – again, starting with last year’s draft, all the things that we have to do from a telescopic standpoint of figuring out the present and the future – was that we might not be able to give him a second contract. Instead of unloading maybe one of our unproven, younger corners, with interest in Marcus it might be time and best for us to move him so that he can start his next chapter and we can start ours.
Somewhere even before this all started, obviously, (Rams CB) Jalen Ramsey’s situation became apparent that he didn’t want to be a Jaguar. If you have teenagers in the room – I remember when it first came out. My teenagers kind of like to get into that type of scenario. I remember watching the Thursday night game and they were all in there. I believe it was against Tennessee and he had this really good game and I told the kids, ‘Well, not getting Jalen Ramsey.’ But, they were taking it like, ‘Wait I minute, he played really good – that’s pretty cool.’ The narrative after that game is no way the Jags should trade Jalen Ramsey and things like that. I knew (Jaguars General Manager) Dave (Caldwell) and I – any time an opportunity presents itself, as an organization, you’ve got to determine, ‘Hey, should we seize that opportunity? Is it the right time for us? Is it a better time for someone else?’ You always reach out and keep tabs. Dave and I have a long working relationship, so that always helps. Ultimately, when we were able to move Marcus and, let’s call it, increase our salary cap room because of that move, it did actually make us a viable player in trading for Jalen Ramsey. So that’s a little bit how the day started. It didn’t just happen yesterday morning, it probably started in the 2019 draft and probably even in ’18, that led in to 2019. We liked (Rams CB) Darious Williams in the draft. Didn’t draft him, tried to get him as a college free agent, failed there. He was cut sometime early into the ’19 season and we claimed him and added him for depth because you’re always trying to add players. It’s a combination of what they did in college and what they’re doing in the NFL. With that being said, that’s a telescopic context, not made for TV explanation of how yesterday went and how it ended.”
(On if this season opened his eyes and made him look further down the line to start thinking about the future)
“As a general manager, it’s different, right. Sean and I have two very different jobs. He’s dialed in on the microscopic right now, he’s dialed in on preparing for the Atlanta Falcons. I think, as a general manager, you’re always trying to analyze, figure out, along with collaboration with many staff members. Okay, here’s what tomorrow looks like and that’s as simple as an injury to Joesph Noteboom, an injury to John Johnson that is unexpected, but expected in that you always know that any team, not just us, is going to get bad luck. And then, there is that element of telescopic look of, okay, here’s what’s coming, are we going to address situations by resigning players that are on their last contract? Or if we don’t resign, are we going to fill that need from within or hole from within? Can it be addressed in the trade, free agency? All of that takes preparation in August, September, October, November. The difference is, you can’t necessarily look at just one game, let’s call it a negative result of one game and now that’s the reason you make a decision. That’s what we do in probably in front offices, but is more of a cumulative approach.”(On what goes into calculating if a trade is worth giving up a first-round pick)
“That’s a really good question, interesting formula. If you look at how we’re done it in the past. What we try to do here is, how to maximize, how to utilize the methods to acquire the best players for the Rams at a specific moment, in a specific situation. By that I mean, there is a difference in a first rounder and a fourth rounder, or even a fourth rounder and a seventh rounder. You’ve got be realistic, there is even a difference right whether you claim someone at the cutdown because you’re claiming someone who actually didn’t make a 53 (man roster) versus claiming someone during the season because they’ve actually made a 53 (man roster). How do you maximize the methods that we are able to acquire the best players? Obviously, draft picks being a very key component in that. We look at our formulas as this, we’ve done it in the past. Depending on the phase of where you’re at, how many core players you have and things like that. Are we building? Are we close to breaking through? Have we broken through? Are we contending? If we are contending, how do we keep contending? Consistency is the most important thing. I think those stages come in to play and you’re always going to ask yourself the question of, is it best to utilize draft picks to either move up and get who you actually, you obviously would assume would be a player with high potential or a higher projection, but again it’s still a projection, or are you going to use your picks to move back, acquire more picks to again, continue to acquiring players that still has a projection element to them and you’ve got to develop them or are you going to use them with players who’ve either proven their projection, more know commodities? Really good calculus formula, that’s really the basis of how we go about doing it.”(On if he had a chance to talk to Ramsey and his agent before the trade)
“We actually did do that once. Once we came to a handshake agreement, we did let Jacksonville know we would like to, not necessarily talk to Jalen, again that’s all part of the process, but to talk to his representatives and give our long-term view and get his that’s definitely part of the conversation, these type of moves.”(On if everyone liked Ramsey)
“Yes, Definitely.”(On if he anticipates Ramsey will get a contract extension next season and if there is a timeline on it)
“No, no timeline on that. We did put a timeline a little bit in place with it. I don’t want to give to many details on that. Again, we are just meeting Jalen today. Obviously. He to date, has earned a chance to probably giet a nice contract for the job he does and the position he plays.”(On how it’s different than when trading for Peters and decided not to extend him)
“I think the biggest difference is two different players, that would be the biggest difference. Ultimately, there is going to be similarities in that situation as we finish this season and go through the next season, see where we are at as a team, how the defense is playing, things like that. What pieces do we need, I call, make pillars for, a little bit longer haul?”(On if Ramsey will play this Sunday’s matchup against the Falcons)
“Here’s what’s interesting, don’t know how much he has been doing. our athletic performance group has talked with the Jacksonville Jaguars. He is interesting. We’ve got to get him here and assess and analyze, okay, wait a minute, he’s flying from. Jacksonville to L.A. today, flying back to Atlanta on Friday. Then we will spend time in Atlanta and fly to London on Thursday. We’ve got to be very intentional on how we utilize him. Atlanta and then what that does for the London game with Cincinnati, especially considering the travel. That’s to be determined. Again, that’s another calculus equation. We’ll let (Rams Senior Director, Sports Medicine and Performance) Reggie (Scott) and (Rams Director of Strength Training and Performance) Ted (Rath), and their crew. I told them today, ‘Hey, I’m sure you will give us a very intelligent and wise assessment.”’(On never shying away from getting outspoken players with big personalities as long as they are of the caliber and how comfortable he is with Ramsey being able to fit to the Rams’ framework)
“Very comfortable. One of the assessments of that is when you do research on them, you realize – first thing I want to know is do the love football? Is this the chapter they are focused on and do they love winning? Ultimately, we’re all going to go through some situations that you’re going to have some outbursts, but a lot of times with the research, it was maybe because of a loss or a bad play or things like that. These are young kids, so they don’t have the emotional intelligence that I’ve acquired, but didn’t have probably at Jalen’s age.(On if he anticipates OL Austin Corbett taking over a starting role or if he will be in more of a backup role)
“Right now, we will fill our starting role from within. I’ll let Sean discuss that. I know there’s definitely a plan there and Austin doesn’t know the system. I think right now, he’s a player we would have potentially drafted and I think we would look at him as getting that player a year later. At that point, it’s on us and himself to learn the system and teach the system and develop more.”(On what makes Ramsey unique as a cornerback in this league to invest that much in him)
“It’s been probably well said since we did the trade. His positives is he has a skillset. My teenagers asked me, there’s an element of mom, dad, God gave him length, right. So, when you have length, you can get your hands on people at the line of scrimmage that some people can’t just because mom, dad, God didn’t give them the length of other players. He can run, mom, dad, God gifted him with agility and then short-air quickness. I’m pretty sure, a level of confidence that, yeah, put me over there on the best player and I’ll do my best to slow him down for the day. There’s only a few players like that. He happens to be one of them. Not saying that there are not a lot of good corners out there, but since he’s been in the league, he’s shown the ability to be able to get on an island. If you look at some of the receivers he’s played against, whether it was in Pittsburgh a couple of years in the playoff run, whether it was against (Texans WR) DeAndre Hopkins, things like that. You’ve got a good subset of case studies to go watch and it was actually fun studying him. You come away very impressed with how he approaches the game in pass and in the run, tackling and covering and you’re very impressed with mom, dad and God and what they gave this kid.”(On what gave them the motivation to pull the trades off yesterday)
“Yesterday, Austin Corbett was the injury to Joseph and then, teams have been connecting with me on corners for a while now. Again, it was really, probably attacking some of the guys who weren’t playing. And then, there was an element of would you ever do this guy? We probably had some stipulations on Marcus because (he was) very influential in our building. We liked him. If I gave the details, which I normally don’t, would be some teams said, ‘Well, would you take on some of his salary?’ It was an easy no in that. We respect Marcus so much that there’s no way we’re going to make a phone call and say, ‘Hey, we’re trading you, but oh by the way, we’d like for you to renegotiate our contract, so you can help us go out the door.’ Couple of teams eventually with needs said that they would do it. Then, it became okay do we do this? You have to sit down and again, self-assess, think about the now, think about the future. Once we came to conclusion that it could be the best thing for Marcus and the Rams and I always say the Rams first and Marcus because that’s the way it goes unfortunately sometimes. Then, that did open the door for our ability to acquire Jalen. The course said that it was probably really good timing. This might not have been able to happen had he had a bad Thursday night game and they traded him the next day.”(On if Young was also a player that he liked)
“Yeah, he was right down the street. With we’re pretty thin at linebacker and we knew that he can run. It was interesting as your talking through (CB) Marcus (Peters) thing that they brought him up and how you act is that as I’m talking to (Ravens General Manager) Eric (DeCosta), their general manager, I knew we had liked him in college. We had some affinity for what he could do in college because he was right down the road. I knew he had started a good bit of games, so we call it ‘blue man.’ I can punch blue man and filter out his plays and I got (Director, Pro Scouting) Ray Agnew, ‘Hey, run down and see if (Special Teams Coordinator) Coach (John) Fassel would appreciate him.’ Again, because of the (LB) Bryce Hager injury a couple of weeks ago, we had been talking about, ‘What if he can’t go, do we need to get a linebacker?’ It was nice timing on Kenny as well.”(On if there was a risk when trading Peters and not yet having secured Ramsey or if he had a good sense that Ramsey would be coming to the Rams)
“Obviously, Sean and I talk a lot more about these big picture, telescopic situations more than with the assistant coaches, but I do know that I sat down with (Defensive Coordinator) Coach (Wade) Phillips, with (Cornerbacks Coach) Aubrey (Pleasant), with (Safeties) Coach ‘E’ (Ejiro Evero) – defensive backs staff and we talked through the scenarios. You did have to talk through playing the rest of the season, playing (Falcons WR) Julio Jones and (Falcons WR Calvin) Ridly without Marcus and with who we have if this couldn’t happen because nothing’s certain. Especially in situations like that.”(On getting to the point where he liked what he heard from the questions he asked)
“Well, the neat thing is we’ve got a backup quarterback that you can just walk right down the hall and have a conversation with him, so that helps. It’s more than that. It goes back to what we did on him coming out, and you do that on every player even though that year is when we traded up for (QB) Jared (Goff), so you know you’re not getting a Jalen Ramsey or you really would have thought we were nuts if we did all that and picked a corner. You still do your do diligence then. You still have people that are connected to him that started back then and you continue doing the vetting process.”(On getting LB Dante Fowler in addition to Blake Bortles)
“We got Dante, we have Jacque McClendon director of player engagement. There’s a lot of Jacksonville ties here.”(On the stage of the CB Marcus Peters deal and where he was with CB Jalen Ramsey and if it was a gamble)
“You have to take those separately, you have to discuss Marcus Peters without the insurance of Jalen. That had to be done, that’s the only way to do it because there’s no certainty.”(On there not being certainty, but was he confident that he would be able to get Jalen Ramsey)
“What I did know is the intel that I had from Dave was it could be time for them to move, versus a week or two ago they were holding pat and were going to keep him. That’s what I knew is there was a possibility to do that. That was the only piece of evidence. I’m well aware there were a few other teams involved and again it’s a market and it’s competitive. So, can you actually beat those teams? If they were willing to trade. I did have enough discussions with Dave that the timing could be right to make the move.”(On Owner Stan Kroenke’s feedback during these discussion)
“You definitely got to take these to him. They were at the owners meeting him and (COO) Kevin (Demoff). You talk through very similar how I opened it. He’s been aware of some of this from the beginning in terms of it’s not just a one-day discussion. It’s okay we do have uncertainty there, are we going to re-sign anyone that we have? If not, how are we going to approach not necessarily ’19 but at that point we’re at ’20 is it via the draft, is it via the trade, via free agency? If you didn’t re-sign anyone you knew you’re either going to go from within or figure it out from there. It wasn’t like we just sprung it on him.”(On the decision to trade first round pick and related to confidence in the teams young offensive linemen)
“I think the answer’s yes. Anytime you draft a player whether it was ’19,’18, ’17 or even next year’s draft and they don’t have experience at whatever position they are there is going to be an element where you have to get the individual experience and obviously the collective group, position group that they’re a part of experience playing together. Anytime you draft someone that is the goal. Like we acquired (OL) Austin Corbett, going back to the original paradigm, there’s methods to acquire players and you try to acquire the best players for the Rams. Specific positions at specific times.”(On how this effects how aggressive they might be going into the trade deadline)
“You’re asking a lot (laughs). I do think it does affect okay there’s not a lot more we could probably do. I think when you get a reputation that you’re willing to make moves… two people do make cold calls, right? It is some interesting ideas being floated. You always have to assess those.”(On his overall assessment of where the team is now)
“I think I answer it – we won three straight, we lost three straight. Because of regency bias, three straight losses you kind of feel those more than the three straight wins. Ultimately, that’s the past, it’s occurred, it’s our reality, it happened. Depending on what record you had in the first six games it shouldn’t affect the next 10 – it’s up to us. Let’s call it ‘make the math work in our favor or where you want it to be’. It’s not happening today. We can’t increase a win or get another win in that category today. We can’t do it at 1 pm on Sunday, probably going to happen around 4 pm on Sunday. The key being this there’s a lot of things we can do, that we can control, to prepare to play a role against the Falcons and then go from there.”
znModeratorJoe Curley@vcsjoecurley
Sean McVay says “the goal” is to get Jalen Ramsey ready to play on Sunday in Atlanta, “but well be smart about it.” Says Darious Williams would start if Ramsey is not able to go. @CVRamsClub @DowntownRams @usatodaynflLindsey Thiry@LindseyThiry
Jalen Ramsey will wear No. 20 for the Rams. Troy Hill will go from No. 20 to No. 22.
znModeratorJalen Ramsey is "overjoyed" to have been dealt to the Rams https://t.co/cy6tbgE9nC
— The MMQB (@theMMQB) October 16, 2019
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