zn wrote:

————

Lol. I’ll say one thing for Trump — he has spawned some great signs and posters over the last year.

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Zooey wrote:

I don’t have access to Putin’s head, but I have read that “Democracy is weak and ineffectual and vulnerable and undesirable” is a pretty constant theme on Russian television. Which I do not watch myself.

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Interesting. I have never read anything like that. The ‘undesirable’ part I mean. I shall have to google a bit and see what i can find. I know that on RT that is certainly not what the message is — the message is America’s ‘democracy’ has been wiped out by a corporotacracy.’ At least thats the message “I” see constantly on RT. I mean Chris Hedges regularly appears on RT.

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Well teams must have figured them out after that, cause
it got Old-Testament-Ugly after that.

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Zooey wrote:

waterfield wrote:

wv wrote:

Looks like Trump has a 38 percent approval rating this month. Fwiw.
http://www.gallup.com/poll/203198/presidential-approval-ratings-donald-trump.aspx

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Yeah I know. But not “approving” of him is different than not “supporting” him. Which is my point. I know several who can’t stand the guy and don’t “approve” of his conduct other than his efforts to make their financial interests more secure. Sad. But these are family run businesses and their concern is focused on just that.To a man and woman they are totally convinced that had Clinton won their business would have been adversely affected.

That is right, and it’s an important distinction.

At the same time his approval ratings drop, polls also show that he would win again if the election were held today. In spite of all this shit.

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Well, i assume he’d beat Hillary again, but I dunno about Biden or Gore or Bernie etc. I dunno. I think it’d be REAL close again. Could go either way, I’d think.

Trump will always have his Racist-Nationalist Faction. And his White Evangelical Christian Faction. And his Wealthy White Country Club faction. And his white working-class Faction. Thats a pretty good base. Hardly unbeatable though.

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I think this para-graph right here iz pregnant
with meanings:

“…“He’s shown he can track the ball down the field,” McVay said from the Rams’ rookie minicamp on Friday. “Really, as far as establishing him as a deep threat, I think we’re just looking for all our receivers to be complete. You want to be able to have a short, intermediate and deep-route tree. And I think it gives you a little bit more route versatility so people can’t squat on you. You certainly want to be cognizant of accentuating guys’ skill set, but also not being regulated in terms of, ‘This is what they do.’ That’s the thing that he’s really embraced, and we’re looking to do that with Tavon.”

• This reply was modified 9 years, 2 months ago by wv.

zn wrote:

. There’s a part of me that smiles about it. I wish it was Bernie doing it. But its Trump. Which means its like Saluman pissing off Sauron.

I’m afraid it’s not that simple.

First, in the run-up to the Iraq war, on this very board, or its earlier incarnation, we came up with a ton of info questioning the president’s interpretation of things. Many of those sources were active or former members of the intel community, who were appalled at what was happening.

2nd, when challenged about sources, I kept reiterating—the mainstream media as an entire whole, from top to bottom, is not complicit. If you know how to you can sift through it and spot useful info.

This is why I never get into slogan-ized simple sides taking. Being on the left has taught me not to be categorical that way.

For example, american resistance to ISIS is unquestionably a GOOD thing and we are better with it than without it, as are millions of others who live in the region.

At the same time yes, you have to sort through and point to the actually damaging policy ideas and actions. But that’s not this unified entity acting, it’s a huge self-divided thing.

An oligarchy is just not going to be as sealed and uniform and airtight as a straight-up dictatorship.

It doesn’t lend itself to simple slogan ideas. IMO one has to be more nimble than that.

.

===============

Yeah, fighting Isis is a good thing. But on the whole, I think the biggest threat to all humanity and the biosphere is not Isis. I think its the deep-state. The corporotacracy. And the CIA/NSA is the dagger of the corporotacracy.

I dont think it has anything to do with ‘nimbleness’ or lack of nimbleness. Overall i think the CIA/NSA is about as evil as it gets. The subsystem. Not the people. Not the individuals. I’m sure ‘they’ all think they are patriots of the highest order, and all that.

I know we disagree on this. I’ve only come to this particular view in the last year or so. I have no ‘heat’ here. Not trying to convince anyone of anything. Just sharing.

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Billy_T wrote:

Good article. I especially liked the mention of William Morris, a personal favorite of mine. His visionary left-libertarianism was pragmatic as well.

Which reminds me: I think the emergence of the Sanders/Clinton split has brought something into focus, that, of course, was always there, but not so apparent . . . From left to right, one’s idea of “pragmatism,” “extremism,” “reality,” “purity tests,” and so on is almost entirely subject to one’s own place along the spectrum and the greater context of one’s life. As in, I’ve had too many recent, futile discussions with Dems who bash, insult and blast Sanders and persons left of Sanders for their “extremism” and inability to deal with “reality.” From my vantage point, it’s those centrist, corporatist Dems who have that problem, and I see their clinging to the capitalism system as “extremist.” Even among leftists, this same suspicion of other views obtains, and most of it likely stems from stereotypes and assumptions about others that really don’t have basis in fact.

We all fall for it. We all bring to the table our own biases, and no one is above that.

To me, the best way out of that rut is to gather, crowd-source, hash out end-goals and horizons and try to agree upon general paths, without insulting each other for being too this or too that. Work back from First Principles, once we’ve established them, and avoid mocking end-goals for their potential as “unrealistic.” The point of those goals isn’t, and never has been, their relative connection to what is currently possible. The point of those end-goals has always been to push us to do better, and better, and better. If we don’t shoot for the moon, we’re only going to reach some ledge on a little hill. If we shoot for the moon and fall short, we’re far more likely to reach the Rockies.

===============
I think that all makes pretty good sense.

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I thought it was a good little article. I agree with the general thrust of it.

I think a lot of far-leftists are not able to even ‘consider’ important tinkering and ‘reforms’ of real-actual policies. They have there heads in the clouds and they tend to be ‘purity police’.
On the other hand there’s leftists who dont seem to have much of ‘vision’.

So, i like the notion of pragmatism/utopianism mixed together. I mean, i have my ‘anarchist/socialist’ vision or goal, but in the real world we have to deal with eons of history and we got to go policy by policy.

Thus, even though i despise corporate-imperial-capitalism (are there other kinds?)
I still think its a good idea to work for single-payer in this corporate-imperial-capitalist system we are stuck in.

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• This reply was modified 9 years, 2 months ago by wv.
• This reply was modified 9 years, 2 months ago by wv.

nittany ram wrote:

Who do you think would win a fight between Jamie Lanister (before he lost his sword hand) and Aragorn? How about between The Mountain and Legolas? Arya and Samwise?

I know the correct answers. I just wanna see if you know them.

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Aragorn.
Legolas.
Arya.

Now, what about Ginger vs Mary-Anne ?

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TSRF wrote:

At some point, the Earth’s core will solidify. When that happens, the magnetic field will collapse. Charged particles from the sun will cleanse the surface of all multi-cellular organisms.
That should give hope to the rest of the universe, unless, somehow, some way, we find a way to establish a foothold off of this planet. In that case, watch out universe!

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Look, we are going to explore strange new worlds,
and we are GOING to make the Universe GREAT AGAIN.

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I see you have a Palantír.

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