Yale Study Says Medicare for All Would Save U.S. $450 Billion, Prevent Nearly 70,000 Deaths a Year https://t.co/NQPPbtSpfd

— Katalin Pota 🌹 (@katalin_pota) October 7, 2020

Biden and Harris have not done very well in the debates and it's partly BECAUSE they're centrists, and centrists end up getting into fights with the right over "who will cut taxes more," a fight the right will always win because it presumes their premises are correct.

— Nathan J Robinson (@NathanJRobinson) October 8, 2020

It annoys me, that so many things happen around the world,
that i know nuthin about. I mean who the hell is the Golden Dawn?
=============

Here’s the moment thousands of people in Athens hear the verdict declaring the fascist Golden Dawn party a criminal organization pic.twitter.com/dOKf4yndxz

— Noah Hurowitz (@NoahHurowitz) October 7, 2020

Unions:https://inthesetimes.com/article/union-density-workers-organizing-staff-experts-public-enthusiasm
A Bunch of Union Organizers Explain What’s Wrong with Unions
We asked the real experts about the gap between public enthusiasm for unions and the lack of actual union members.

“……The edu­ca­tion­al polar­iza­tion we see on right to left stuff has become a huge fac­tor in whether young, work­ing-class peo­ple want to union­ize. Indus­tries pop­u­lat­ed with poor, younger adults who are gen­er­al­ly overe­d­u­cat­ed like (ahem) dig­i­tal media or high­er edu­ca­tion, are super ripe slam dunks where you can trans­form an indus­try with hot-shop orga­niz­ing. Ones with most­ly poor­er, younger adults who are not edu­cat­ed, and are not most­ly based in urban areas, like retail and sup­ply chain logis­tics, have had cold work­ers that are not respon­sive enough to union dri­ves to make win­ning a pos­si­bil­i­ty. (Part of the equa­tion hold­ing them back, of course, is how that gen­er­a­tion of big-box retail and its sup­ply chain were built from scratch in such a way that unions could be kept out com­plete­ly and any rare com­po­nent that got infect­ed could be eas­i­ly shut down and dis­solved. But there’s an atti­tu­di­nal dif­fer­ence in the con­stituen­cies as well.)

A bright spot excep­tion to this has been fast food…..”

zn wrote:

waterfield wrote:

Biden is like a gatekeeper. If he wins he will open the gate extremely wide and many different views will be allowed into the arena. If Trump wins the gate will only be open for those who pass his loyalty test.

Trump is bad and we all know it.

Biden on the other hand has never opened and most likely will never open the gate to many different views.

He’s not as bad as Trump and we’ll have to settle for that.

==============

Yes. There is zero reason to think Biden will be anything but what he has ALWAYS been. He will certainly not move to the Left.

At any rate, he is kinda irrelevant. If the left is to ever become anything, it will have to start from the ground up. Smaller elections. One by one.
If the Left cant win those, then the rest is just smoke and dreams, etc.

w
v

Trump may have to start a War, to get back in this thing. Or ramp up the vote-suppression.

=====================

Trump is getting destroyed LMAO https://t.co/n57l0wZhYm

— Good Morning, Sunday Morning 🥋 (@SocialistMMA) October 7, 2020

waterfield wrote:

<
My answer is never to tell people they are “wrong”. But to ask them questions-much like taking a deposition. If one says science doesn’t know everything-my question is “why do you say that”. Then they will say something like “I had a friend who…” Then I ask “do you personally know of others”. At some point the message comes across without them feeling they are looked down upon by someone who comes off as “having all the answers”. Might and likely won’t change their opinions but might give them a pause to think a second time about an issue. “Why do you ” are three very powerful words.

=================

OK, but at what point do you usually pull out an ice-pick and run it through their walnut-brain? Because i find that its best to do it just after I’ve asked them an ‘I have a friend’ question.

w
v

Zooey wrote:

Liberals ARE condescending. Leftists, too. Maybe Leftists even more so. And so the masses hate universities and experts and everybody whom they feel look down their noses at them.
.

================

Well, i dunno, but I know that I find myself being condescending all the time. I also find myself fighting my own habit of being condescending all the time.
I do it. But i try not to do it. And the pattern repeats.

Why do i do it? Because I am dealing with people who choose some weird Bible phrase over Science. Religion over Science.
Or, they choose some comforting political-myth over actual History.

So when I as a leftist am trying to communicate with a right-winger it is a huge challenge. How does one communicate with someone who believes in Myths/Religions and rejects History/Facts/Science?

It often either devolves into me being condescending, Or, I just find a way to change the subject to Football.

But….I do NOT find rightwingers being condescending to ME. Mainly they just pray for me, or shake their heads.

So, my personal experience has been that lefties are condescending and righties are not.

w
v

Zooey wrote:

wv wrote:

===============

Well, its very tempting for leftists like us, to think the best strategy for HIM would be to lean left. But is that really accurate? I am not convinced.

I keep thinking about the senate: 99-1.

If i were a corporate-dem, why in the hell would i trust the folks who got the “1” elected, instead of the folks that got the 99 elected.

Sure the polls say, 60 or 70 percent of folks want M4A etc. But they dont VOTE that way do they. I mean even in a DEM primary, Biden beat Bernie. Straight up. Liberals/Dems had a choice — and they chose AGAINST the leftist.

So why would Biden lean left? If i were his evil-political-adviser I’d tell Biden to do just what he’s doing. Be bland, and lean towards Right-Center. The DNC strategy.

I hate it. But it is what it is.

w
v

I was pondering the old conundrum last night about why so many people vote for the GOP, counter to their own interests. And I was thinking that part of it is that those voters, like Trump supporters, are really low information voters, ya know. Nothing new there. But that doesn’t answer the question. They’re low information either way, so how does the GOP get their allegiance?

And then I thought, well, the GOP appeals to their core…values/lifestyle/myths…whatever. A lot of these people just wanna go to work, have a beer with friends, watch UFC, go to church, shoot some birds, ride their motorbikes, raft the river, whatever. No time to watch BS on the news, or read Atlantic Monthly. It’s not their thing. Life is immediate and local. So the GOP just taps into their gut instincts, their biases, their prejudices, and does so without fearing that they, as governors, will ever be inspected for their actions. These people aren’t following the budgets, or the political movements that swirl in Yemen. The GOP goes straight for the Id, and sometimes the Ego.

Democrats, OTOH, want to REASON with these people. Educate them on how their policies are better for them, and they are amazed when nobody bites that bait.

So…I start wondering WHY the Liberals/Left don’t go for the Id appeals as well. I mean…why not?

And I think that it’s because the Left and Right see other people differently. I am considering that maybe the Right actually has an advantage because they think of the masses as a commodity. People are widgets. They are just a different category of Materials necessary to conduct business on the one hand, and potential consumers of services and products on the other hand. They don’t care about the “human” aspects of their lives whatsoever. They are just there like clay, or steel, or tariffs, or tax breaks…just Things that need to be manipulated to their advantage. Appealing to their Id is just an efficient way to do that.

Liberals and the Left give them a little more credit than that. They see them as people with human concerns. But they see them as uneducated and, frankly, sometimes stupid. They are raw humans, Uncultivated Humans. So they/we are driven to try to appeal to them through a variety of “Don’t you see that THIS is in your best interest, and THAT is not?” kind of things, and then get frustrated when they turn the channel to The Masked Singer. Ultimately, I think that Liberals tend to look DOWN on the masses because they are FAILING TO GRASP THINGS. And the Left tends to be condescending to everybody, including Liberals, and even other Leftists.

Well…they HATE being condescended to. Everybody hates being condescended to. And here is where the Right has an advantage. They aren’t condescending to these people because they don’t place any human value on them in the first place. Nobody gets condescending to a horse because it’s a fucking horse. You harness it, and put it to use. So the Right can saddle up the masses partly because they don’t expect anything from them except their direct service. The left wants to…you know…SAVE them. Make their lives better. And when they don’t cooperate, well, it’s because they are Deplorable. They’re morons. They’re backwoods hicks and rubes and yokels.

So the GOP can bang the identity drums, and the people will march because they hear the drumming, and they feel welcomed.

The Democrats are hamstrung because they are trying to herd cats with shit like “Build Back Better,” whatever the fuck THAT is supposed to mean. And the Democrats don’t really have anything to offer because they aren’t committed to running on anything that will actually change lives. So it’s easy for the GOP to paint them as the party of giving away crap to OTHER people. And that’s totally believable because they certainly aren’t giving anything to ME. To US. To anybody in MY neighborhood. They’re trying to appeal to the masses without offering them a vision of anything other than Hope and Change and Harmony on the one hand, and a tall stack of Policy Papers on the other. Those just aren’t drumbeats that get them very far.

Biden is running as a Rorschach Test. He is largely a vacuum with an invitation to everybody to believe he is whatever they want him to be.

=========

All food for thought, for sure. There’s a lot there to unpack.

But what I think about all the fucking time — i cant let it go — is: Biden VS Bernie.

No republicans involved. None of their games came into play. This was totally a Dem Vote. And the Democrats rejected the Left. Just flat out rejected it. Democrats did that.

And sure, we all know that the powers-that-be did everything they could to get the Democrats to vote for Biden. All the usual shit. But Bernie’s message was out there. He’d been around for five years. People knew his message. The corporate media may have been tilted against him but people knew he was for an increase in Minimum Wage, free college, and M4A. And the DEMOCRAT voters rejected it. The Rep-thugs didnt even get in the game. The DEMOCRAT VOTERS rejected. Not the elites. The Dem VOTERS.

And while thinking about ‘that’ lovely dynamic, lets widen the perspective to include all the other Senate/Congressional Elections over the last fifty years. How many times have the DEMS (and Reps) rejected leftwingers? Almost Every fucking time. So, its not just something about Bernie.

Pretty dark picture. Why do i bring it up? I think its because I’ve spent time in the Left-twitter-bubble the last two days, and I am surprised at how often leftists FAIL to absorb and reflect on the awful historical facts. We are a small group. We are not a large uprising. We are not a great and powerful movement.

99-1.
The DEM voters freely and knowingly and willingly chose Biden over Bernie.

w
v

NASA Discovers Evidence That Life Could Exist Outside America https://t.co/31RM0GaihQ pic.twitter.com/HgZ9zuN9iu

— The Onion (@TheOnion) October 6, 2020

InvaderRam wrote:

wv wrote:

Well he did say that he thought he was a little too conservative. But I dunno.

you’re right. but i’d also like to hear what he says after watching film. what was the defense doing to the rams offense? was the deep ball just not there with goff checking down? did goff have to audible out of plays based on what he was seeing? did he miss receivers downfield?

at first i agreed with you. i liked the methodical approach the rams were taking although i admittedly got nervous there toward the end.

i thought the comment posted in another thread about the rams having to scale back their running attack due to the absence of noteboom was interesting. maybe the giants noticed this in the bills game last week and the rams got more predictable in the run game? i have no idea. but it could partially explain why the rushing game wasn’t as effective as it was the first 3 weeks.

===============

Didnt know about the Noteboom comment Even more reason to stay conservative and safe, perhaps.

w
v

InvaderRam wrote:

nittany ram wrote:

While watching yesterday’s display of offensive ineptitude, I wondered what happened to the Rams’ downfield passing game? The one medium to deep ball they connected on yesterday (Kupp TD) was a blown coverage.

i’d like to hear/read what mcvay says about that.

==============

Well he did say that he thought he was a little too conservative. But I dunno.
If he had thrown more downfield he would have exposed Goff to more danger, more risk of turnovers, sacks. Would it have been worth the risk? Maybe. But maybe it made sense to assume the Giants would self-destruct in some way as losing teams tend to do, and just play a nice safe game, as long as they had the lead.

w
v

Cal wrote:

I believe that I recently saw Lawrence has a higher rating from PFF this year than Donald.

I didn’t watch any of the game, but that could be a D-line that gives teams trouble.

======================

There was one play that made me wince and kinda set the tone.
I cant remember which Rams RB got himself pile-driven to the ground, and i cant remember which Giant DLineman did the pile-driving, but it reminded me of Warren Sapp slamming Marshall Faulk. It was brutal.

w
v

Who knows how many drugs he’s on, but….
==================

This man is on high dose steroids, which commonly cause hallucinations, agitation, mania, euphoria. He feels better than he did 20 years ago b/c he's on a steroid high.

PLEASE do not interpret these tweets as any source of truth about his condition or COVID-19 in general. https://t.co/DlMao5aVTT

— Dr. Jenn Conti (@doctorjenn) October 5, 2020

nittany ram wrote:

InvaderRam wrote:

wv wrote:

I dunno, but i just think this is what the Rams Offense looks like when you take away the run. The Giants took away the run. And when that happens, all those short passes by the rams dont amount to much.

right now i’m thinking it’s one of two things.

either mcvay has no plan for when the rams run game is stalled.

or mcvay knows the oline can’t hold up if they go too pass heavy.

the other possibility of course is that goff needs the run game to thrive. i don’t think that’s the case though. goff looked good today.

While watching yesterday’s display of offensive ineptitude, I wondered what happened to the Rams’ downfield passing game? The one medium to deep ball they connected on yesterday (Kupp TD) was a blown coverage.

================

Well, i think i remember two fairly deep balls near the sideline that were simply well covered. Giants good D.

w
v