Would you kill 6.5 Billion people ?

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  • #29782
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    I play this game with my friends. I dont have a name for this
    game but here is the scenario/question:

    IF you could push a button, that would make between 6 and 6.5 BILLION
    humans disappear would you push the button?
    Which 6.5 humans? YOU get to decide. It could
    be all Southerners or all democrats or all the people
    you dont know, or all the people with cruel-hearts…whatever.
    YOU get to create whatever rules you want as long as
    you ‘disappear’ Between 6 and 6.5 Billion.
    And the disappeared-humans would feel no pain. They’d just
    vanish.

    Now, would you push the button?

    Would you become a mass-murderer and push the button,
    or not?

    What do you think. Be honest now.

    I think I’d push the button btw.
    Pretty sure i would.

    O dear.

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    v

    #29790
    bnw
    Blocked

    Big difference between disappear and murder. Murder is bad. Maybe disappear if they are sent to a better place like an episode of the Outer Limits or the Twilight Zone. Why the 6-6.5 billion people? If its all Southerners you would have to be standing at the North pole.

    • This reply was modified 9 years, 3 months ago by bnw.

    The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

    Sprinkles are for winners.

    #29812
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    Big difference between disappear and murder. Murder is bad. Maybe disappear if they are sent to a better place like an episode of the Outer Limits or the Twilight Zone. Why the 6-6.5 billion people? If its all Southerners you would have to be standing at the North pole.

    Why 6.5 Billion? I dunno, just a number
    a lot of my friends seem to agree on, LoL.

    Population/Overpopulation discussions
    can get pretty tricky, and revealing
    sometimes.

    Are there too many humans in existence?
    Its a tricky question.

    w
    v

    #30064
    Avatar photonittany ram
    Moderator

    No, I couldn’t just dissappear 6.5 billion people even though I think the world would be a much better place with them gone. Even if I knew they would be going to a better place. I couldn’t make that decision for them. Even if it meant getting rid of all those people who I think deserve to be gone – getting rid of those who are responsible for or willingly contribute to pain and suffering. I couldn’t do it. I couldn’t do what needes to be done.

    I could kill all Pitt fans though.

    But that’s only about 5 people, tops.

    #30081
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    No, I couldn’t just disappear 6.5 billion people
    even though I think the world would be a much better place with them gone.

    Why not?

    Given that you agree,
    that the Biosphere would benefit from
    a six-billion-person reduction.

    w
    v

    #30088
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    Why not?

    Given that you agree,
    that the Biosphere would benefit from
    a six-billion-person reduction.

    w
    v

    Well, for one thing, in a couple hundred years, you would just have to do it again. Those 6.5 billion people would have died for no reason other than to punt the problem into the future where it would have to be faced all over again.

    Go read Dr. Heidegger’s Experiment.

    #30123
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    Why not?

    Given that you agree,
    that the Biosphere would benefit from
    a six-billion-person reduction.

    w
    v

    Well, for one thing, in a couple hundred years, you would just have to do it again. Those 6.5 billion people would have died for no reason other than to punt the problem into the future where it would have to be faced all over again.

    Go read Dr. Heidegger’s Experiment.

    If you would have to do it all over again, then
    maybe it would not be worth it — but I dont
    think you’d necessarily have to do it all over again.

    I mean, remember you get to make the rules about
    who gets disappeared. Dont you think disappearing
    everyone who believes in Corporate-Capitalism would
    change things? I mean, if the world was only
    populated by, say, Green-Party-types, wouldnt
    civilization unfold differently than it is now?

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    #30147
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    I think eventually we would end up in more-or-less the same place. But it would perhaps be worth a try, since we are certainly doomed given the trajectory we are on.

    I mean, if you could get rid of everyone who thinks violence is a justifiable conflict resolution, it might change things. And the irony would be worth it.

    #30150
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    I think eventually we would end up in more-or-less the same place. But it would perhaps be worth a try, since we are certainly doomed given the trajectory we are on.

    I mean, if you could get rid of everyone who thinks violence is a justifiable conflict resolution, it might change things. And the irony would be worth it.

    Welcome aboard. Now who do we vaporize first?

    I’m thinkin we start with all Religious-Fundamentalists.
    For starters.
    That should get us down to, what? 4.5 billion maybe?

    Then we eliminate Patriot fans.

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    #30170
    Avatar photonittany ram
    Moderator

    I think eventually we would end up in more-or-less the same place. But it would perhaps be worth a try, since we are certainly doomed given the trajectory we are on.

    I mean, if you could get rid of everyone who thinks violence is a justifiable conflict resolution, it might change things. And the irony would be worth it.

    Welcome aboard. Now who do we vaporize first?

    I’m thinkin we start with all Religious-Fundamentalists.
    For starters.
    That should get us down to, what? 4.5 billion maybe?

    Then we eliminate Patriot fans.

    w
    v

    Who gets to live?

    #30174
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    I think eventually we would end up in more-or-less the same place. But it would perhaps be worth a try, since we are certainly doomed given the trajectory we are on.

    I mean, if you could get rid of everyone who thinks violence is a justifiable conflict resolution, it might change things. And the irony would be worth it.

    Welcome aboard. Now who do we vaporize first?

    I’m thinkin we start with all Religious-Fundamentalists.
    For starters.
    That should get us down to, what? 4.5 billion maybe?

    Then we eliminate Patriot fans.

    w
    v

    Who gets to live?

    Yes, well at least now you are on the genocide-train
    with Zooey and Me.

    Who gets to live?

    Good question. I think about it a lot, LoL.

    I prefer to start at the other end —
    who gets eliminated first.

    I’d start with the religious-fundamentalists.

    Any objection to that?

    And then all fascists, Republicans, Nazis,
    KKK members, and Corporate-Capitalists.

    Objections?

    Just think of a world without religious fundamentalists.
    That alone would make political policies completely different
    in the US and Middle-East.
    v

    • This reply was modified 9 years, 3 months ago by Avatar photowv.
    #30178
    Avatar photonittany ram
    Moderator

    I think eventually we would end up in more-or-less the same place. But it would perhaps be worth a try, since we are certainly doomed given the trajectory we are on.

    I mean, if you could get rid of everyone who thinks violence is a justifiable conflict resolution, it might change things. And the irony would be worth it.

    Welcome aboard. Now who do we vaporize first?

    I’m thinkin we start with all Religious-Fundamentalists.
    For starters.
    That should get us down to, what? 4.5 billion maybe?

    Then we eliminate Patriot fans.

    w
    v

    Who gets to live?

    Yes, well at least now you are on the genocide-train
    with Zooey and Me.

    Who gets to live?

    Good question. I think about it a lot, LoL.

    I prefer to start at the other end —
    who gets eliminated first.

    I’d start with the religious-fundamentalists.

    Any objection to that?

    And then all fascists, Republicans, Nazis,
    KKK members, and Corporate-Capitalists.

    Objections?

    Just think of a world without religious fundamentalists.
    That alone would make political policies completely different
    in the US and Middle-East.
    v

    Here’s where it get’s tricky.
    I would have no problem eliminating all religious fundementalists. But what about “believers” in general? As long as the seed exists then isn’t the possibility of fundementalism taking root always present? Wouldn’t we want our new society to be based on reason rather than faith?

    #30179
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    KIRK: You’re a man of integrity in both universes, Mister Spock.
    SPOCK: You must return to your universe. I must have my captain back. I shall operate the transporter. You have two minutes and ten seconds.
    KIRK: In that time I have something to say. How long before the Halkan prediction of galactic revolt is realised?
    SPOCK: Approximately two hundred and forty years.
    KIRK: The inevitable outcome?
    SPOCK: The Empire shall be overthrown, of course.
    KIRK: The illogic of waste, Mister Spock. The waste of lives, potential, resources, time. I submit to you that your Empire is illogical because it cannot endure. I submit that you are illogical to be a willing part of it.
    SPOCK: You have one minute and twenty three seconds.
    KIRK: If change is inevitable, predictable, beneficial, doesn’t logic demand that you be a part of it?
    SPOCK: One man cannot summon the future.
    KIRK: But one man can change the present. Be the captain of this Enterprise, Mister Spock. Find a logical reason for sparing the Halkans and make it stick. Push till it gives. You can defend yourself better than any man in the fleet.
    SCOTT: Captain, get in the chamber!
    KIRK: What about it, Spock?
    SPOCK: A man must also have the power.
    KIRK: In my cabin is a device that will make you invincible.
    SPOCK: Indeed?
    KIRK: What will it be? Past or future? Tyranny or freedom? It’s up to you.
    SPOCK: It is time.
    KIRK: In every revolution, there’s one man with a vision.
    SPOCK: Captain Kirk, I shall consider it.
    (He beams them away.)

    #30234
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    Here’s where it get’s tricky.
    I would have no problem eliminating all religious fundementalists. But what about “believers” in general? As long as the seed exists then isn’t the possibility of fundementalism taking root always present? Wouldn’t we want our new society to be based on reason rather than faith?

    Yes, it gets tricky. Saving the Biosphere through Genocide is not as easy
    as it seems.

    Do we want our new world order to be based on ‘reason’ ?

    I dunno. Reason without compassion could lead to disaster too.
    Just like Spirituality could lead to ‘religion’ which then leads to disaster.

    So, we’re stuck with certain unknowns and dangers due to the tiny brains
    that have evolved to this point.

    Bashing on relentlessly, If its my call to make….I’m not disappearing
    the “Spiritual but not religious” folks. Granted, there’s danger,
    but talking-monkeys always present dangers to the biosphere.

    Once the Corporate-Capitalists are gone,
    and the Fundamentalists are gone, just think of
    the humane policies and laws that would be easy
    to implement.

    w
    v

    #30244
    Avatar photonittany ram
    Moderator

    I dunno. Reason without compassion could lead to disaster too.
    Just like Spirituality could lead to ‘religion’ which then leads to disaster.

    w
    v

    Well, I don’t think reason and compassion are mutually exclusive. And compassion isn’t born of religion or spirituality. Love, altruism, compassion…these things predate religion. Religious beliefs teach us that those of us who believe the ‘correct’ way are better than those who don’t. We own the truth. That leads to prejudice which leads to holocaust.

    Reason tells us that we’re all the same and therefore entitled to be treated the same.

    But, I’m not saying those with a spiritual belief should necessarily be disappeared. I’m just throwing the potential pitfalls out there. You run the risk of allowing the same sort of institutionalized patriarchy, bigotry and classism that you’re trying to avoid to arise again.

    • This reply was modified 9 years, 3 months ago by Avatar photonittany ram.
    #32659
    Mackeyser
    Moderator

    This is the question that precedes genocide.

    No, absolutely not.

    You could pick any scenario, but oppositional thinking is innate. And some of the things people want to control for are biological and can’t be controlled. Raise people on communes and we’ll still get econo-fascists. Raise people in hyper straight fundamentalist backgrounds and we’ll still get gay and transgender people.

    Eliminate people? It’s an abhorrent question.

    If the question is ultimately how to improve the planet or our species, there are bunches of ways to approach that other than genocide.

    Sports is the crucible of human virtue. The distillate remains are human vice.

    #32707
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator

    i would not. but. if i would, i would not discriminate.

    i would divide into as many different demographic categories as possible. or as many as i could think of. by age, ethnicity, geographical location, occupation, wealth, gender, sexual orientation, religion… i don’t know if i’m missing anything. and then i’d just randomly remove a percentage within each category.

    not that i’ve ever thought about this.

    the only other solution i can think of is getting off this planet.

    but then you’d just have more humans.

    #32717
    TSRF
    Participant

    I’d start with all the first born males, unless their house was marked with the blood of a rams coach…

    Then I’d kill God. But then the game would end because I was dead.

    #32732
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    This is the question that precedes genocide.

    No, absolutely not.

    You could pick any scenario, but oppositional thinking is innate. And some of the things people want to control for are biological and can’t be controlled. Raise people on communes and we’ll still get econo-fascists. Raise people in hyper straight fundamentalist backgrounds and we’ll still get gay and transgender people.

    Eliminate people? It’s an abhorrent question.

    If the question is ultimately how to improve the planet or our species, there are bunches of ways to approach that other than genocide.

    I dunno Mack. I dunno. Maybe Biosphere-cide is worse than genocide.
    And the trajectory of things sure looks bad to me.

    w
    v

    #32733
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    I’d start with all the first born males, unless their house was marked with the blood of a rams coach…

    Then I’d kill God. But then the game would end because I was dead.

    ———–

    Can God,
    kill God?

    w
    v

    #32748
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    Here’s where it get’s tricky.
    I would have no problem eliminating all religious fundementalists. But what about “believers” in general? As long as the seed exists then isn’t the possibility of fundementalism taking root always present? Wouldn’t we want our new society to be based on reason rather than faith?

    I don’t think that would make any difference.

    There is something about humans that resorts to tribalism no matter what. Dance team members think they are better than cheer, jocks think they are better than band, Rams fans think Raiders fans suck (no offense). If it wasn’t religion, it would be something else. Lord of the Flies, baby. If it wasn’t God, it would be haircuts, or freckles, or the way we cover our poop.

    We’re doomed.

    And right now, overpopulation is one of the major threats to our survival. And we can’t count on help from other countries. Just look at how irresponsible the Danes are.

    #32851
    TSRF
    Participant

    OK, here’s my play.

    I stick with the Angel of Death kill the first born male, but make it retroactive through time.

    That means Cain dies before he can kill Abel. That also stops this whole mess:

    Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch. 18 To Enoch was born Irad, and Irad was the father of Mehujael, and Mehujael was the father of Methushael, and Methushael was the father of Lamech.

    19 Lamech married two women, one named Adah and the other Zillah. 20 Adah gave birth to Jabal; he was the father of those who live in tents and raise livestock. 21 His brother’s name was Jubal; he was the father of all who play stringed instruments and pipes. 22 Zillah also had a son, Tubal-Cain, who forged all kinds of tools out of[g] bronze and iron. Tubal-Cain’s sister was Naamah.

    Also, Abel was a “keeper of flocks” i.e., a sheep fucker. No children. No human race. No overpopulation. Problem solved.

    #32852
    TSRF
    Participant

    OK, here’s my play.

    I stick with the Angel of Death kill the first born male, but make it retroactive through time.

    That means Cain dies before he can kill Abel. That also stops this whole mess:

    Cain made love to his wife, and she became pregnant and gave birth to Enoch. Cain was then building a city, and he named it after his son Enoch. 18 To Enoch was born Irad, and Irad was the father of Mehujael, and Mehujael was the father of Methushael, and Methushael was the father of Lamech.

    19 Lamech married two women, one named Adah and the other Zillah. 20 Adah gave birth to Jabal; he was the father of those who live in tents and raise livestock. 21 His brother’s name was Jubal; he was the father of all who play stringed instruments and pipes. 22 Zillah also had a son, Tubal-Cain, who forged all kinds of tools out of[g] bronze and iron. Tubal-Cain’s sister was Naamah.

    Also, Abel was a “keeper of flocks” i.e., a sheep fucker. No children. No human race. No overpopulation. Problem solved.

    #32863
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    Also, Abel was a “keeper of flocks” i.e., a sheep fucker. No children. No human race. No overpopulation. Problem solved.

    I don’t think you can genuinely do all that. I mean, near as I know, retroactive species cleansing is not really possible.

    If it were…no John Shaw. Is all I’m sayin.

    #33665
    lyser
    Participant

    Yes, I would. Eagerly. Easy decision, your game. We are severely overstocked with humans – many of them bad. Everyone that has ever intentionally harmed another for their own gain or amusement would be gone. I don’t even have to think about it. It would be over 6.5 billion too and I would be happy they were gone.

    Now, if the rules were changed, and I had to make a Judgement call, then no I could not do that. But if I knew for certain that those that fit my definition of bad would be gone, I would jump at the chance.

    #33675
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    Yes, I would. Eagerly. Easy decision, your game. We are severely overstocked with humans – many of them bad. Everyone that has ever intentionally harmed another for their own gain or amusement would be gone. I don’t even have to think about it. It would be over 6.5 billion too and I would be happy they were gone.

    Now, if the rules were changed, and I had to make a Judgement call, then no I could not do that. But if I knew for certain that those that fit my definition of bad would be gone, I would jump at the chance.

    Yeah, I think i would to. But what the hell
    does that say about us?

    Mack may be the only one of us
    thats not massively-genocidal.

    w
    v

    #33721
    Avatar photonittany ram
    Moderator

    What if some of the 6.5 billion people disappeared had to come from members of your family and friends?

    Could you do it then for the good of the world?

    #33750
    bnw
    Blocked

    The talk of disappearing reminds me of the TV series “The Leftovers”. One fifth of the human race disappeared without warning or explanation.

    The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

    Sprinkles are for winners.

    #33990
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    What if some of the 6.5 billion people disappeared had to come from members of your family and friends?

    Could you do it then for the good of the world?

    Well the game rules are set by the “decider”. So,
    you can make what ever rules you want. I think, originally,
    I said no friends or family need be involved, etc.

    But if you want to set up a scenario where friends and family
    have to be included — then…I’d have to think about it
    harder.

    It might depend on ‘which’ family members ? 🙂

    Again, ‘my’ argument is, that the biosphere is
    seriously threatened now. FUTURE humans, animals,
    and plants will not be born, if something doesnt change…
    …so, what if someone eliminated all the “unkind” and “unwise”
    humans….what would the future look like ‘then’…?

    Define ‘wise’ or ‘unkind’ anyway YOU want.

    w
    v

    #34012
    Avatar photonittany ram
    Moderator

    It might depend on ‘which’ family members ? :)

    w
    v

    So…you’d bump off the ewe? Better hope she doesn’t read this or it will be mighty awkward around the Thanksgivings Day table.

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