Higbee

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  • #109937
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    So anyone have a theory as to WHY Mr Higbee, exploded in the last month? Was it something McVay did? Should McVay have done that ‘something’ a lot earlier? Is ‘it’ sustainable’?

    w
    v

    #109938
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    So anyone have a theory as to WHY Mr Higbee, exploded in the last month? Was it something McVay did? Should McVay have done that ‘something’ a lot earlier? Is ‘it’ sustainable’?

    w
    v

    Gurley was asked about that and said something interesting. He said, no what happened with Higbee came as no surprise to people who saw him in practice. That is, the team already knew about Higbee’s development as a receiver.

    Why didn’t they go to it sooner? Well I suppose they liked what they had and what they were doing–the 3 WRs plus Everett–and in those circumstances Higbee was a blocker. But then stuff changed. Cooks hasn’t been the same this year (concussions?) and Everett got hurt (again) and teams started to focus on Kupp. Higbee emerged out of that as a new option.

    My guess is that it really took TH 3-4 years to develop, but then finally when he did, he had an opportunity and grabbed it.

    Going forward you have to wonder if ole McV will re-arrange his priorities and feature him more. Along with everything else he brings—including a team leading 77.5% catch percentage—TH seems to have good chemistry with Goff. (In terms of catch percentage, among those with 40 or more targets, the 2nd to Higbee is Kupp at 70.1%).

    .

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    #109940
    Avatar photoAgamemnon
    Participant

    I have lost interest in Cooks, but he isn’t going anywhere.

    Agamemnon

    #109942
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    I have lost interest in Cooks, but he isn’t going anywhere.

    ===================

    Lol. Well, I guess we know what his strengths and weaknesses are by now. He’s never gonna be Isaac Bruce, but when he’s healthy he can kindof be ‘the cherry on top’ of a good offense. Teams cant just ignore him. He ‘might’ make a big play.

    Higbee and Kupp and Woods really make an interesting trio going forward.

    The thing is though, they dont have “a real Gurley” anymore. I just think thats huge. Gurley was that special factor that teams just couldnt deal with. Thats gone.

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    #109944
    Avatar photoAgamemnon
    Participant

    I have lost interest in Cooks, but he isn’t going anywhere.

    ===================

    Lol. Well, I guess we know what his strengths and weaknesses are by now. He’s never gonna be Isaac Bruce, but when he’s healthy he can kindof be ‘the cherry on top’ of a good offense. Teams cant just ignore him. He ‘might’ make a big play.

    Higbee and Kupp and Woods really make an interesting trio going forward.

    The thing is though, they dont have “a real Gurley” anymore. I just think thats huge. Gurley was that special factor that teams just couldnt deal with. Thats gone.

    w
    v

    The real Gurley is gone. His shadow haunts the football field.

    Agamemnon

    #109951
    Cal
    Participant

    Cooks’s speed makes him an important part of this offense. He just adds a dimension that Reynolds, Woods, and Kupp don’t offer.

    Having a healthy Cooks next year will make a difference to the offense next year.

    With Higbee’s emergence this year does anyone think the Rams could trade Everett? I believe next year is his last year under contract and it’s hard to imagine the Rams resigning him with Higbee’s contract.

    The Rams surely could use another 3rd or 4th round pick to help build some depth.

    #109954
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    Cooks’s speed makes him an important part of this offense. He just adds a dimension that Reynolds, Woods, and Kupp don’t offer.

    Having a healthy Cooks next year will make a difference to the offense next year.

    With Higbee’s emergence this year does anyone think the Rams could trade Everett? I believe next year is his last year under contract and it’s hard to imagine the Rams resigning him with Higbee’s contract.

    The Rams surely could use another 3rd or 4th round pick to help build some depth.

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    How come some offensive genius doesn’t figure out how to use two pass-catching TE’s on the field at the same time? Why cant we see Everett and Higbee and Kupp and Woods and Cooks on the field at the same time?

    w
    v

    #109957
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator

    How come some offensive genius doesn’t figure out how to use two pass-catching TE’s on the field at the same time? Why cant we see Everett and Higbee and Kupp and Woods and Cooks on the field at the same time?

    w
    v

    wasn’t the washington offense under mcvay a 2 te offense?

    that’s what i’d like to see.

    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/was/2016.htm

    they had reed and davis that year. both receiving threats.

    i feel like mcvay should have been exploiting this more.

    #109977
    Cal
    Participant

    Which Wr do you take off the field if you go with 2 tight ends?

    I don’t think McVay had the weapons at WR like the Rams have when Vernon Davis and Jordan Reed combined for 110 catches in McVay’s last year in DC.

    After this year, Cooks would seem to be the easy choice, but when he was healthy last year he had a helluva year. Hopefully, with a better line next year, Cooks can run some of those deeper routes and return to his 2018 production.

    #109978
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator

    i’d take cooks off. i just think they’d be more dynamic with two tight ends.

    the running game especially.

    #109983
    Avatar photoBilly_T
    Participant

    I liked the Higbee pick from Day One, and thought he was underused. IMO, it comes down to that. He just wasn’t thrown to. Lack of targets. A receiver is nada if the GQ doesn’t bother to throw to him.

    (I think they basically ruined Brian Quick for similar reasons)

    He’s big, fast for his size, has good hands, and is a try-hard runner after the catch. He’s also an excellent blocker. What’s not to love?

    IMNSHO, they should try to trade Everett, not Higbee. If they get a third or a fourth for him, I’d be happy. A second? Ecstatic.

    I think they can find another H-back kinda TE with a bit better size and speed. Everett is a tad under 6’3″ and probably 240 or so. They can find better matchup guys in FA and the draft. I’d use the draft pick on O-line help or a run-stuffing DT, though.

    #109984
    Cal
    Participant

    Maybe, but McVay seems to place an emphasis on speed. The Rams spent a lot to get Cooks and they wasted no time at all locking up Gurley who used to be special because of his size and speed. When Gurley’s knee became an issue, they used their second pick last year on Henderson, a small but fast rb.

    If Cooks is healthy, I don’t think McVay takes him off the field. We’ll see.

    I’m very curious to see what the Rams do with this off season.

    Do they bring back Whit or trust Noteboom at LT?
    Fowler or Littleton or neither?
    How do they continue to improve the OL?
    How do they improve the depth at DL?

    #109986
    Avatar photoBilly_T
    Participant

    Maybe, but McVay seems to place an emphasis on speed. The Rams spent a lot to get Cooks and they wasted no time at all locking up Gurley who used to be special because of his size and speed. When Gurley’s knee became an issue, they used their second pick last year on Henderson, a small but fast rb.

    If Cooks is healthy, I don’t think McVay takes him off the field. We’ll see.

    I’m very curious to see what the Rams do with this off season.

    Do they bring back Whit or trust Noteboom at LT?
    Fowler or Littleton or neither?
    How do they continue to improve the OL?
    How do they improve the depth at DL?

    I’m not a Cooks fan overall, primarily because he’s just not a threat to win contested footballs. Though he did shock me with one this past game. And while he’s very, very fast, the college ranks always have their share of fast receivers. I just don’t see him worth the draft pick and the high salary, and wish Watkins had worked out.

    NE basically got their draft pick back when they traded him to the Rams. Right now, I don’t think the Rams would get anything close to that, and I think they should trade him if they can. Not sure what their minimum should be, but there’s a point where he’s worth more to keep than trade if it’s not enough. If they could get a 2nd or a 3rd, I’d do it. Perhaps a 4th and later is too little and they should just hang on to him. Find a way to get him isolated more, in the open field, etc. etc.

    #109962
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    How come some offensive genius doesn’t figure out how to use two pass-catching TE’s on the field at the same time? Why cant we see Everett and Higbee and Kupp and Woods and Cooks on the field at the same time?

    w
    v

    wasn’t the washington offense under mcvay a 2 te offense?

    that’s what i’d like to see.

    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/was/2016.htm

    they had reed and davis that year. both receiving threats.

    i feel like mcvay should have been exploiting this more.

    ================

    What, if anything, do you blame McVay for this year? Anything? Did he do anything wrong ?

    w
    v

    #109988
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator

    What, if anything, do you blame McVay for this year? Anything? Did he do anything wrong ?

    w
    v

    well. a lot of the problems on offense came down to the oline. i think we can all agree on that. and as a result of that goff had some growing pains this year. so how much could mcvay really do? and on top of that gurley wasn’t gurley anymore.

    i’m just surprised that mcvay took this long to get higbee going. if gurley is saying that the players could see it in practice, then why not go to him earlier in the season?

    i think sometimes mcvay is slow to adjust to what’s happening. maybe as he gets more experience he’s quicker to make those changes. sometimes it’s easier to do what’s more comfortable to you.

    #109989
    Avatar photoBilly_T
    Participant

    What, if anything, do you blame McVay for this year? Anything? Did he do anything wrong ?

    w
    v

    well. a lot of the problems on offense came down to the oline. i think we can all agree on that. and as a result of that goff had some growing pains this year. so how much could mcvay really do? and on top of that gurley wasn’t gurley anymore.

    i’m just surprised that mcvay took this long to get higbee going. if gurley is saying that the players could see it in practice, then why not go to him earlier in the season?

    i think sometimes mcvay is slow to adjust to what’s happening. maybe as he gets more experience he’s quicker to make those changes. sometimes it’s easier to do what’s more comfortable to you.

    My pet peeve is that he was incredibly stubborn when it came to his eleven personnel packages. He opened that up slightly in the last few games . . . but I think the stubbornness may well have kept them out of the playoffs. They needed just one more win, remember, cuz the Vikings ended up losing their last two . . . ironically, etc.

    I’d go further, of course. I think the Rams need to use six offensive linemen at times . . . and find the right DT to use as a fullback/ball carrier option. Mix things up more.

    McVay is young, obviously. Which means his great press must have impacted his thinking, at least a bit. I have a feeling he was humbled by this past season, and will be more open to changing things up in 2020.

    #110005
    Hram
    Participant

    I agree with Billy. They should play two TEs more (they are both really good receivers) and cooks less. Cooks seldom fights for the ball let alone successfully fight for it.

    #110007
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    They can’t pay Cooks less, though.

    And I like Cooks as the deep threat. He’s a solid deep threat type because unlike guys like Avery and Givens, he can do other things. Those guys in contract were one trick ponies.If he can do other things, then he’s a better deep threat.

    His contract? To me that one is just the market. The year he came up, the going rate on 2nd contracts for a starting caliber (tho non-elite) WR was more or less around 16 M. That’s what Watkins and Evans got in the same year. That’s just the market.

    Apparently McV needs a deep threat in his system. And–no that are not that easy to find. I mean for example Cooks is the first good one the Rams have had since Holt, drafted in 99. And they have tried to get others (Givens, Avery). When on, like he was the previous 4 years, he is a very valuable complementary receiver.

    Is he a go-to #1 WR type? No. Is he a success on contested catches? Well he did it last game but usually no (but then how many deep threat types are good at that?)

    He had one down year–probably because of the concussions and their aftermath—but before that he had 4 consecutive 1000+ yard seasons while averaging around 76 catches a year.

    Do you give up on that after one down season?

    I think a combo of A Revitalized Cooks, Woods, Kupp, and The New Higbee would be a nightmare for defenses.

    ….

    #110015
    Hram
    Participant

    The two TEs we have can be just as devastating imo.

    I keep Cooks this year because of the contract. I simply recommend they play more two TEs with Woods on the field most of the time. The other WRs can rotate to stay fresh and bring something different into the game as matchups and adjustments dictate with some periodic 3 WR sets.

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