Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Rams Huddle › all 4 centers hurt? and other things about the 2014 OL
- This topic has 8 replies, 3 voices, and was last updated 9 years, 11 months ago by SunTzu_vs_Camus.
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January 2, 2015 at 9:25 am #15294znModerator
I read this bit, from an analysis of the Dallas game Ag posted.
It led to questions.
http://theramshuddle.com/topic/offensive-line/page/2/#post-15286
Scott Wells
C
78.5%
I was impressed with how consistently Wells played and the relative power he displayed when asked to get push. Wells wasn’t covered up so that certainly helped his grade a little.
So I wondered, at what point did Wells hurt the elbow? He was also listed as having a back issue at one point. Which also made me wonder…what’s the deal with Barnes? He only had 9 offensive snaps all year. Jones had 23 snaps on offense and I remember him going in during a game but they quickly shelved him again.
So I did a little spin around the net.
In October, Barnes was listed as having a shoulder issue. It’s likely that had an effect all season.
Jones replaced Barnes for part of the Chiefs game:
Rams | Scott Wells injures elbow
Sun, 26 Oct 2014 13:36:04 -0700
St. Louis Rams C Scott Wells (elbow) suffered an elbow injury in the Week 8 game against the Kansas City Chiefs. C Barrett Jones replaced him.
Read more: http://www.kffl.com/player/27764/nfl/barrett-jones#ixzz3Nfpg8E2q
Jones himself was not that viable because, according to his own account, he needs this off-season to re-gain the muscle and strength he lost in the aftermath of the back surgery.
You know what this means? If you add the fact that Rhaney went on IR, the Rams had injuries to ALL FOUR centers this year.
Wells, according to that account of the Dallas game, was not playing that badly before the elbow. He was more like the Wells of late 2012, mid 2013. Not the abomination he became, and some people seem to think he always was.
January 2, 2015 at 9:57 am #15297znModeratorOkay something else.
What about Long and Saffold and Barksdale?
Long was also injured in the Chiefs game, same as Wells.
Saffold ALSO injured in the Chiefs game.
So that’s Oct. 26, Black Sunday.
Now using PFF grades (fwiw), when did Barksdale become a problem?
According to their grades, he has 2 spurts where he plays poorly and gets consecutive negative grades. Weeks 8-10, and weeks 14-17 (with a brief “decent game” interval in week 16).
So it starts in week 8. The Chiefs game.
Here’s the thing about that. If the rest of the line struggles, it is hard for one player to play above that. He’s not in sync with them, they cut back the things they can do so he’s more exposed, he gets less help, he has to help out more and so gets over-stretched, and so on.
Actually in weeks 2-5 he’s graded pretty highly.
That all makes it look like the KC game killed the OL.
After the KC game, it went like this:
LOT. Long out. Robinson shifts to LOT. He was supposed to be the LOG this year.
LOG. Saffold hurt, plays with a bad shoulder the rest of the way. Was supposed to be the ROG with GR at LOG. Is not the same after the injury. According to PFF grades, only has 2 good games after KC.
OC. Wells–elbow injured in KC game. As I say in the post above, all 4 centers hurt in 2014. Man. Good luck coming back from THAT. This means they have a rookie at LOT and a banged-up center…which is just a recipe for disaster. Wells played below average all year. I don’t think he ever really recovered from his illness over the summer (an infection that got him hospitalized).
ROG. Saffold was a great OG in 2013, and then ends up being a mediocre LOG in 2014. Joseph was never supposed to play.
ROT. Barksdale plays ever snap and near as we know was not injured. BUT he has a stretch of bad games starting in week 8 (Chiefs game). Before that he had one below avg. game (week 6, 1st SF game).
So… theory:Barksdale and Saffold were both fine until Saffold was hurt, Wells was hurt, Long was hurt, GR shifted to LOT, and Joseph had to start.
For the future this probably means Barksdale is fine, Saffold is fine, GR improves in the off-season (in fact the odds are against that NOT happening).
Wells is probably on the wrong side of old and injured, and Long probably isn’t back.
That means they have 3 pieces in place. That’s a lot actually. The days of year to year 5-man OL continuity died with free agency and the cap. Having 3 (if they sign Barksdale) is good.
I say, with all that, they not only have a good chance of fixing the OL, they have a chance to field a very good one.
January 2, 2015 at 10:30 am #15298wvParticipantI think all of that sounds about right.
(though i dont think Wells was ever
a particularly effective player for
any length of time. Its always ‘somethin’
with Wells and with Jake Long)I’m not sure about Barksdale.
I dunno. If he needs that much
help then is he really a solid RT?Bottom line is, once again injuries
destroyed the offense.w
vJanuary 2, 2015 at 10:47 am #15301znModeratori dont think Wells was ever
a particularly effective player for
any length of time.Well depends on what you mean by “length of time.”
He plays well when he comes back for the 2nd half of 2012.
He plays well enough for the 1st half of 2013. Or, he’s not the major problem in the 1st 4 games, when the line struggled some. But then I always thought that those 1st 4 games was due to the offense as a whole–they were playing a spread with young receivers PLUS their feature back could not run and everyone knew it (Richardson).
Long got injured all up. But he did not start out poorly. He actually grades out well for most of 2013. He was much MORE effective once they went to a play-action offense and away from that gawd-forsaken Richardson + baby receivers in a spread offense, but still.
If you mean Wells got hurt a lot, yeah he did.
But then. Their are only 2 years in the last 12 where the Rams OL is NOT hurt a lot–2003 and 2010. So is that Wells or the Rams OL curse?
Demoff btw says that OL injuries are the Rams achilles heel.
January 2, 2015 at 11:02 am #15304wvParticipantwv wrote:
i dont think Wells was ever
a particularly effective player for
any length of time.Well depends on what you mean by “length of time.”
He plays well when he comes back for the 2nd half of 2012.
He plays well enough for the 1st half of 2013. Or, he’s not the major problem in the 1st 4 games, when the line struggled some. But then I always thought that those 1st 4 games was due to the offense as a whole–they were playing a spread with young receivers PLUS their feature back could not run and everyone knew it (Richardson).
Long get injured all up. But he did not start out poorly. He actually grades out well for most of 2013. He was much MORE effective once they went to a play-action offense and away from that gawd-forsaken Richardson + baby receivers in a spread offense, but still.
If you mean Wells got hurt a lot, yeah he did.
But then. Their are only 2 years in the last 12 where the Rams OL is NOT hurt a lot–2003 and 2010. So is that Wells or the Rams OL curse?
Demoff btw says that OL injuries is the Rams achilles heel.
Well, i think we all agree with Demoff on that one.
Wells and Long were both ‘warriors’. Great
work ethics, great passion for the game,
smart players — but their bodies
just couldn’t hold up.I am not sure I am crazy about boudreau/fisher’s
leaning toward old-grizzled-vet-injured-linemen.
Linemen on the downside of their careers.
I guess that has worked in a lot of places,
but it dont work in St.Louis, apparently.I would like some fresh, young, stud-talent
on the Oline, Mr Boudreau.
And, I’m tired of ‘projects’ like
the soft Barrett Jones.w
v- This reply was modified 9 years, 11 months ago by wv.
January 2, 2015 at 11:52 am #15308SunTzu_vs_CamusParticipantI agree, WV…Rams need talent & youth on OL!
Fisher wil make the OL a position of strength this draft & FA.
Get many young HogMollies for Boo to play with.Remember last year? We all wanted to get better DBs(especially FS)…
and we brought in 5 new DBs(Joyner, MoAlex, Gaines, Roberson & Barron)
and it is now a position of strength(youth & talent). McD & McCleod got MUCH better this last year…
and know GWs defense much better. And GW has learned how to use his players better after some trial and error.
Fisher now has the OC & DC he originally chose and a talent base that is familiar with the O & D systems.Also, I want to see Bradford get one more shot with this better team around him…
but we need another QB to compete. I think Bradford beats everyone out and wins the starting spot.
Bradford’s ACL stuff is bad luck. ANY player’s ACL breaks….it’s just a twist of fate.
Great thing is though…in this 2015 draft…there is very good depth of interior OL.- This reply was modified 9 years, 11 months ago by SunTzu_vs_Camus.
"I should have been a pair of ragged claws...
Scuttling across the floors of silent seas."January 2, 2015 at 12:37 pm #15311znModeratorI am not sure I am crazy about boudreau/fisher’s
leaning toward old-grizzled-vet-injured-linemen.
Linemen on the downside of their careers.That was just last year, mate. You go back through history and look at both the Titans and Falcons lines and there’s no grizzled factor. Heck in 2006, Fisher was starting 2 2nd year OTs.
So let’s not exaggerate on the basis of one year.
AND the 3 cornerstones of this OL…Saffold, Barksdale, Robinson are not “grizzled.”
AND there are good LOTs in the league who have more years than LOng. He’s just at the end of his injury rope.
So I see no such “leaning.” I think that’s just overgeneralizing on the basis of one year, which is mostly about injuries anyway.
I mean how many teams handle injuries to 4 centers.
January 2, 2015 at 1:19 pm #15322wvParticipantI agree, WV…Rams need talent & youth on OL!
Fisher wil make the OL a position of strength this draft & FA.
Get many young HogMollies for Boo to play with.Remember last year? We all wanted to get better DBs(especially FS)…
and we brought in 5 new DBs(Joyner, MoAlex, Gaines, Roberson & Barron)
and it is now a position of strength(youth & talent). McD & McCleod got MUCH better this last year…
and know GWs defense much better. And GW has learned how to use his players better after some trial and error.
Fisher now has the OC & DC he originally chose and a talent base that is familiar with the O & D systems.Also, I want to see Bradford get one more shot with this better team around him…
but we need another QB to compete. I think Bradford beats everyone out and wins the starting spot.
Bradford’s ACL stuff is bad luck. ANY player’s ACL breaks….it’s just a twist of fate.
Great thing is though…in this 2015 draft…there is very good depth of interior OL.Well, i tend to agree with all that. I do
think Snisher will concentrate on the OLine
and i do think thats the last puzzle piece.So, the season will come down to Bradford’s body.
w
vJanuary 2, 2015 at 1:34 pm #15327SunTzu_vs_CamusParticipant“So, the season will come down to Bradford’s body.”
Well, Fisher needs to be smart an upgrade the QB depth/youth for the team’s sake.
So, a 3rd round QB is where I put that need.Resign Hill, Davis(RFA)…unless they can get a better FA – QB upgrade to compete…
or all the above!
I kinda like Ryan Fitzpatrick as a back-up/starter that would do well in our PA/run oriented scheme.
But, that’s just me and my love for Martz ex-pats! 😉"I should have been a pair of ragged claws...
Scuttling across the floors of silent seas." -
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