Richard Wolff on the democrats

I’ve admired Wolff for some time, and think of him as among the finest Marxian economists and communicators out there. But on the subject of Russiagate, it’s clear to me he has a major blind spot — similar to Mate’s, Greenwald’s and Dore’s, among others.

(Will break up a coupla posts to run through this, and will try to be brief)

And I’m still confused about what Wolff and others are trying to say. There’s far too much mockery involved, generally, to really figure that out, especially with folks like Dore. Are they saying Russia didn’t meddle? Or that it doesn’t matter? Are they saying it doesn’t matter because we do it too? Yeah, our government is guilty of that, and we’re generally worse about it. But the old saw “two wrongs don’t make a right” applies, and even that misses the main point:

It’s not that Russia meddled per se. It’s that an American candidate willingly took the help, chased after it, exploited it, covered it up, lied about it repeatedly, and then obstructed justice (at least 10 times) to stave off an investigation. Yes, empires are gonna do their spy versus spy BS. But that shouldn’t mean we’re just fine with American politicians taking advantage of this in order to cheat their way into the White House. A sane society says that’s unacceptable, and it holds those people to account, regardless of party.

Again, I’m just continually baffled as to why any public leftist would dismiss what happened, and I don’t get how they can’t see that their dismissal helps Trump and the far right.

• This reply was modified 5 years, 2 months ago by Billy_T.

And the “this makes it so they can’t concentrate on more important things”? When did they before? Were they doing the people’s business before “Russiagate”? No. Were they avoiding wars, coups, the expansion of empire, fighting against the carceral state, the destruction of the environment, etc. etc.?

No. If this were actually preventing good deeds in the public sector, then they might have a point. If it really were a distraction from larger issues they would have dealt with otherwise . . . I would understand the complaint. But when was the last time either party really did focus on what matters and effectively do something about it? When was the last time antiwar, anti-imperialist, pro-environmental forces, etc. etc. won the day?

The so-called Russiagate hasn’t altered a thing. And despite the hysteria from the Greenwald and Mate crowd, it didn’t cause a war between us and Russia. Nothing changed in our relationship, which has been bad for generations.

To make a much longer story short, I can’t see a single argument from that crowd that makes one iota of sense. Not one. And it’s all the worse for being, at least indirectly, in service of a far-right president here and in Russia.

Quick last point before I take a break . . . and I hope others chime in:

Wolff is wrong when he says Europeans don’t care about this and find our concerns funny. On the contrary. Their papers have actually been more up front about it than ours, in general, and they took serious steps to harden their elections against attacks from Russia — the kinds of things McConnell and Trump have blocked. They have said repeatedly, in public, how much Russia impacted the Brexit vote, for example.

Sure, you can find some Europeans who think this is all a joke, and for the reasons Wolff mentions. But in no way is that the majority view. And, again, it has the same bizarre note as it does when minorities here say it.

“It’s okay that Joey beat the hell out of Johnny, because Johnny’s family did similar things in the past. It would be hypocritical of us to punish Joey under those circumstances.”

Not only does this bring in that “two wrongs don’t make a right” thing. It’s also never about the people who actually did the dirty deeds in the past suffering. It’s us who suffer, when leaders like Trump aren’t held to account. It doesn’t somehow right the wrongs of the past committed by others . . . and, ironically, Trump himself has and is engaging in “election meddling” oversees as we speak, and tried to overthrow the government of Venezuela.

zn wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

“It’s okay that Joey beat the hell out of Johnny, because Johnny’s family did similar things in the past. It would be hypocritical of us to punish Joey under those circumstances.”

Not only does this bring in that “two wrongs don’t make a right” thing. It’s also never about the people who actually did the dirty deeds in the past suffering. It’s us who suffer, when leaders like Trump aren’t held to account. It doesn’t somehow right the wrongs of the past committed by others . . . and, ironically, Trump himself has and is engaging in “election meddling” oversees as we speak, and tried to overthrow the government of Venezuela.

Plus people like us have always spoken against american interference abroad.

We’re not the ones who did it, and we protest it.

How that is supposed to lead to us not caring when it happens TO us is kind of beyond me.

.

You put that well. Succinctly, unlike moi.

The American tradition of election interference abroad, and worse . . . . that isn’t going to be stopped by saying what Russia (and Trump) did doesn’t matter, or by laughing it off, or by mocking the people who do care about it.

If anything, it will empower more of it from all sides. And, as you say, the upshot is that the American people suffer, not the folks who engage(d) in the meddling in the first place. It’s never, ever going to sync up as as a matter of “justice fulfilled.”

Hope all well is well . . .

• This reply was modified 5 years, 2 months ago by Billy_T.