New St. Louis Rams Stadium May Be Built On Ancient Native American City

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May 22, 2015 at 9:02 pm #25121

JackPMiller
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http://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinakillgrove/2015/05/19/new-st-louis-rams-stadium-may-be-built-on-ancient-native-american-city/

New St. Louis Rams Stadium May Be Built On Ancient Native American City

A $1 billion plan to build a new stadium for the St. Louis Rams NFL team has archaeologists and Native Americans up in arms because of its proposed riverfront location. Just a few blocks northwest of the current Edward Jones Dome, the remains of two dozen earthen mounds dot the Mississippi River bank. While the mounds were flattened in the 1800s to accommodate the rise of St. Louis as an urban center, underneath the buildings and parking lots is a 900-year-old Native American town.

Across the river in Illinois, the site of Cahokia is much better known. Currently a 3.5-square-mile historic park, Cahokia boasts over 80 mounds and decades of archaeological research that has revealed a Grand Plaza, mass burials and sacrificial victims, and a unique copper workshop. Due to differences in funding and state laws about development, though, Cahokia’s sister city in Missouri is not well understood.

Archaeologist Joe Harl told St. Louis Public Radio that he is certain that ancient Native American artifacts will be found if the building project goes forward. Even though the project will use state bonds to finance a portion of it, because the project will be on private land and has no federal funding, in Missouri, developers are not required to call in archaeologists. Neither Harl nor Everett Waller, chairman of the Osage Minerals Council who spoke with Indian Country Today Media Network, wants to see plans for the stadium completely shelved. But both suggest that the stadium proposal task force take another look at possible locations and factor in money to do archaeological survey first.

Many states, like Florida where I live, require archaeological survey in advance of big development projects such as this. Missouri does not. But the expense to do a thorough archaeological assessment of the new site prior to or during construction is a very, very small fraction of the stadium’s reported $1.5 billion price tag. It would be in the best interest of the stadium proposal task force to advocate for archaeology, to ensure we preserve and record as much of our country’s collective past as possible while celebrating our present.

May 22, 2015 at 9:45 pm #25122

Zooey
Moderator

Oh, boy.

Well, we know what Peacock is going to spend the weekend talking about.

My first instinct – while a lot of questions remain to be asked – would be to find out what an archaeological survey is, exactly, and how quickly one could get started and finished. Do it now.

Here are a couple other stories that I don’t even have time to read right now, cuz I gotta go:

http://news.stlpublicradio.org/post/new-football-stadium-threatens-what-remains-st-louis-native-american-past-and-present

http://indiancountrytodaymedianetwork.com/2015/04/29/sacred-native-site-be-buried-new-st-louis-nfl-stadium-160186

May 22, 2015 at 9:52 pm #25123

sdram
Participant

We’re surrounded by native American sites here in SD and if anything is unearthed while digging anything – construction stops until it gets sorted out. How long depends on the significance of what was unearthed and how big it is.

May 22, 2015 at 11:10 pm #25125

Zooey
Moderator

sdram wrote:

We’re surrounded by native American sites here in SD and if anything is unearthed while digging anything – construction stops until it gets sorted out. How long depends on the significance of what was unearthed and how big it is.

Apparently Missouri does not have those protective laws.

It is private land, and they can do whatever they want as long as they do not take any federal money for the project. I have no idea how they would get federal money anyway, or if that was part of their planning.

But it seems to me that this is – at best – a PR snag Peacock cannot afford, since the need to have everything nailed down is urgent. At worst, there could be litigation, though I don’t know what grounds anyone would have to sue over it.

Kroenke is opening a bottle of his finest tonight, methinks.

May 23, 2015 at 1:11 pm #25137

bnw
Blocked

There are no tribal stakeholders for the site since the tribes in question are extinct. Even Cahokia Mounds has no tribal stakeholders since the Mississippian Culture abandoned it and died out before european settlement of the area. This is a thinly veiled attempt to delay the stadium process. This property has been developed for over a century and all of eastern MO along waterways and definitely within 2 miles of the Mississippi River likely show some signs of Indian activity. I wouldn’t be surprised if a developer with a big project in the works in CA is behind this effort. I also wouldn’t be surprised if his acreage in CA could harbor Indian sites too.

The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

Sprinkles are for winners.

May 23, 2015 at 1:20 pm #25138

bnw
Blocked

Mounds at the proposed stadium site

The site of the proposed riverfront football stadium covers the former locations of several Native American mounds. The locations, marked in red below, are approximate.

The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

Sprinkles are for winners.

May 23, 2015 at 1:34 pm #25139
bnw
Blocked
Making an Indian mound out of a mole hill. The stadium sites western border lies over a small portion of where two mounds used to be. Not entire mounds but a small portion of a footprint of two mounds that are no longer there.

Mound locations in red. Approximate stadium area in blue.
Source: Mound locations: The Missouri Archaeologist, Vol. 53 — mounds mapped by Peale and Say; Imagery: NAIP2014
Credit: Brent Jones | St. Louis Public Radio

http://news.stlpublicradio.org/post/new-football-stadium-threatens-what-remains-st-louis-native-american-past-and-present
- This reply was modified 9 years, 5 months ago by bnw.
- This reply was modified 9 years, 5 months ago by bnw.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

Sprinkles are for winners.
May 23, 2015 at 1:43 pm #25142

InvaderRam
Moderator

they’re going to make a documentary about this someday. all the rumors, conspiracy theories, backroom dealings, politics…

should be entertaining.

May 23, 2015 at 1:58 pm #25146

Zooey
Moderator

The article was interesting the way it was worded. Evidently the Osage tribe claims some sort of link, but the way it was stated suggested that direct descendency from the Cahokia is uncertain. Also of note on that score is that the Osage tribe doesn’t want them excavated, either. Of course, there is no way they get their wish. That area is not going to be left as is because of the mounds. Their desecration is a fait accompli, and the majority of voters are just not going to sympathize with a solution that says leave everything the way it is for the rest of eternity when it is unattractive urban decay. I mean, if they were talking about removing some mounds NOW, I am sure in this age that there is no way they could do that. But they are long, long gone. And it cannot be turned into a park, or monument, or whatever, because several mounds are under freeways. So the place is going to be developed.

The only question is the timeline.

Because not only are there some Native Americans to work with, there is some historical/archaeological interest. How much? I have no idea. I am sure there is some scholar out there who is curious enough to want to dig through the area in hopes of finding something unique or valuable. There is no way of knowing if that kind of academic interest will get any push.

I do not think the final outcome is in doubt. The area will be redeveloped. Again…the question is the timeline. Will this delay moving forward, or will it just be another hoop to jump through while all the other hoops are jumped through?

It isn’t good news, though.
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