Dunkirk

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  • #71156
    PA Ram
    Participant

    Just got back from seeing “Dunkirk”.

    It was good–very good. I won’t put it in my top three war films which are probably “Apocalypse Now”, “Saving Private Ryan” and “Platoon” but it was very good. The sound was amazing. If it doesn’t snag the Oscar for sound I’ll be surprised.

    What I liked:

    The war sequences were filmed very well. You could feel those attacks on the beach as if you’re there. I liked the idea of putting a character out there who says very little as the film’s main focus. It’s basically the audience representative. The acting was great with a very talented cast–although they weren’t asked to do too much. I absolutely loved the aerial sequences. I thought they were very well done. The musical score was also incredible and there were intense moments that were gripping.

    What I didn’t like: Christopher Nolan is obsessed with time lines. Many of his films play with this including, “Inception”, “Memento”, “Following” “Intersteller” and maybe one or two more. It’s his thing. I’m not sure that trick played well here though. I’m not sure he needed it. It made things a bit confusing and I’m just not sure there was a point to it beyond the fact that he loves to do it. There are three timelines running here: land, sea, air and while they sort of converge at some point, it’s the kind of thing that you’d want to watch again. My point is that this just didn’t seem to be a thing he needed for the film–like he did with “Inception” and “Memento” and “Intersteller” where time was central to the plot. I think it would have had a bit more impact if he’d have told the story just in a straight line. Don’t make the audience think too much on something like this.

    Still, beautifully filmed. Certainly worth seeing on the big screen.

    I’m giving it a thumbs up.

    • This topic was modified 6 years, 9 months ago by PA Ram.

    "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick

    #71158
    zn
    Moderator

    Spoilers ahead.

    I liked it too but I also have some reservations, as I always do with Nolan films. I will leave the reservations out. These are just random remarks. Well okay one reservation. The film does not give you the sense, which is more realistic, that the beach at Dunkirk was under constant attack from the air. The way Nolan does it, it’s as if the occasional German air patrol shows up, with bombers basically flying solo.

    First, Tommy’s story. Tommy’s small unit gets shot up in the town, he nearly gets on a hospital ship that is sunk, then makes it out to a frigate that is torpedoed, then makes it back to the land, ends up in a stranded boat that gets shot at, makes it out to another frigate or destroyer that gets bombed, and then the fuel on the water catches fire right over him, and then he makes it aboard a yacht which is then strafed.

    Tommy sure has awful damm bad luck. It’s like reciting the last decade’s history of Rams offensive lines. Okay maybe not THAT bad, but pretty bad.

    I liked the entire story of the yacht and Mark Rylance/ Mr. Dawson. Every detail of it. Like the fact that it takes Dawson forever to get what he is really sailing into, and how he then simply doesn’t flinch while in it.

    I like the air story and the fact that Tom Hardy/Farrior basically ends up with a glider he uses to attack German aircraft, while knowing that without fuel he is never making it back across the channel.

    ….

    #71159
    PA Ram
    Participant

    I get what you’re saying about the bombers. That could have been given more attention but the few scenes where he did it, the shots were fantastic. I think he was just caught up in the idea of three time lines and was content to just splash a bit of this here and that there, to give you the sense of it. I really think the film would have benefited without the whole time lines angle.

    As for Tommy–I just think this film was about putting the audience in the experience and using the character as their representative. He didn’t want to spend time on developing new characters for each situation. It was hardly a character driven film anyway. It was almost darkly humorous in how this guy kept getting into jams, but I sort of see why he did it.

    Overall I had a good time and enjoyed the film.

    My favorite Nolan film is still “Inception” followed by “The Dark Knight” and then “Memento”.

    The only films he has made I did not particularly like was “Intersteller” and “The Prestige”.

    I pretty much like everything else. I may watch “Following” tonight. It’s been years since I’ve seen it–and I own the DVD.

    "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick

    #71276
    zn
    Moderator

    a negative review of Dunkirk, fwiw.

    ..


    Bloodless, boring and empty: Christopher Nolan’s Dunkirk left me cold

    David Cox

    https://www.theguardian.com/film/filmblog/2017/jul/26/bloodless-boring-empty-christopher-nolan-dunkirk-left-me-cold?CMP=share_btn_fb

    Nolan’s celebrated story of the evacuation at Dunkirk trades guts and glory for a 12A airbrushed rendering of history. The true story is much more complex – and moving

    Wednesday 26 July 2017 06.33 EDT Last modified on Wednesday 26 July 2017 06.34 EDT
    Is it just me? Christopher Nolan’s Dunkirk has bowled over critics and taken $100m (£77m) at the global box office in barely a week, but it left me cold.

    The subject sounds enticing: the legend of Dunkirk tells of an array of unprepared civilians assembling an armada of fishing boats, pleasure craft, yachts, motor launches, paddle steamers, barges and lifeboats to rescue an army from a battle-swept beach. What might cinema reveal of the logistical skills, resourcefulness, courage, doubts, arguments and fears of the citizenry involved?

    Yet Nolan’s film chooses to ignore tales such as that of the Medway Queen, a paddle steamer that brought home 7,000 troops in seven round trips and shot down three German planes, or the Royal Daffodil, which returned 9,500 soldiers after blocking a hole below the waterline with a mattress. Instead, we encounter just one boat, skippered by a saintly Mark Rylance, comically attired in his Sunday best. The travails such a figure might have endured were apparently not dramatic enough. Instead, Rylance’s character is subjected to a bizarre set of events garnished with grating sentimentality.

    For it is not the dynamics of the people’s armada that interest Nolan. He is more concerned with what is happening on and above Dunkirk’s beaches. What’s mainly happening, however, is that lots of soldiers are waiting around. Escapades, not altogether convincing, are therefore contrived for a few of them. Some bombs fall, some ships are sunk. Commanders mutter briefly but sagely to each other. In the skies, fighter pilots conduct what seems like an endlessly repeated dogfight. One plane runs out of fuel, although not as quickly as audiences might have hoped. And that’s sort of it.

    Film-makers usually instil interest in their protagonists by giving them backstories and meaningful dialogue, thereby creating characters who can be engaged in drama. In Dunkirk, these things don’t happen.

    The film also denies filmgoers any context. We’re told little about how the army has come to be beached or the threat it faces. We never see a German soldier, let alone the generals and politicians of either side who are masterminding events. We don’t even get the customary three sentences of text at the end, explaining the outcome. This is deliberate: Nolan has said he didn’t want to get “bogged down” in politics.

    Another flaunted absence is CGI. Scale is the essence of the Dunkirk myth. There were more than 330,000 soldiers on the beach, and 933 British vessels, naval and private, plying the waves. It is for this kind of situation that computers were invented, but according to Nolan CGI counts as giving up.

    So, in spite of his film’s $150m budget, the Royal Air Force seems to consist of three Spitfires, although real-life pilots flew 3,500 sorties at Dunkirk. The Luftwaffe, which Hitler made solely responsible for wiping out the beached Brits, seems able to summon up little more than a couple of Messerschmitts, three Stukas and one bomber. The Royal Navy appears to comprise just two destroyers; in fact, it deployed 39 destroyers and 309 other craft.

    Women are excluded from the action by being confined to stereotypical roles, such as providing tea for the homecoming menfolk. In real life, female Auxiliary Territorial Service telephonists – who received two-thirds of a male soldier’s pay – were some of the last military personnel to leave the beach. The evacuees also included female civilians, including girls, caught up in the turmoil.

    The restrictions Nolan places on himself have been cited to demonstrate his brilliance as a director. Not for him the humdrum apparatus of lesser directors. His film must be pared back so it can home in on its true subject. Which is what, exactly? Don’t be silly, the reviewers groan: it is the horror of war as never before. OK, got that, another stab at war-is-hell. Except that Dunkirk is no such thing. It is a 12A effort that avoids blood and guts as thoroughly as it avoids so much else. In the film, people hit by bombs die discreetly, with no unseemly dismemberment. Even abandoning a torpedoed ship doesn’t seem too unpleasant. So the movie doesn’t, as claimed, make you feel the terror of those it depicts. Why not?

    Well, Dunkirk isn’t actually a war film at all – Nolan tells us so. That is why it doesn’t concern itself with “the bloody aspects of combat”. Instead, it is “a survival story, and first and foremost a suspense film”, according to the director.

    A survival story, like Gravity, perhaps? But Dunkirk’s soldiers are denied the means of effecting their own survival, and it is in this that their pathos resides. Their unheroic fate is to mill around on a beach and get ferried home by non-combatants. Signaller Alfred Baldwin, who was at Dunkirk in 1940, recalled: “You had the impression of people standing waiting for a bus. There was no pushing or shoving.”

    Or is it a suspense film, like Rear Window? We all know the outcome of the event, and know that nothing terribly bad was ever going to happen to Harry Styles, Captain Rylance or our plucky pilots. Even Hans Zimmer’s manipulative score can’t make that brick out of this straw.

    But at least I now understand why I didn’t get it: there was nothing to get. Nolan trades on a mystique fuelled by affectations such as mangled timeframes and Imax cameras. In the film, the complications of chronology seem silly, and the naturalistic environment exposes this. I trekked to Leicester Square in London to get the full benefit of the 70mm picture, but I didn’t notice any. Indeed, I thought the subject would have been better suited to the cold, TV-news glare of digital than the lushness of film.

    Still, Warner Brothers and the world seem happy to indulge Nolan. Good luck to him, not that he seems to need it.

    #71277
    PA Ram
    Participant

    I know that Nolan hates CGI and I was happy to see a film that didn’t rely on that. The reviewer wanted a certain story told on a grander scale. It just wasnt the way Nolan chose to do it. Perhaps Speilberg will make that film someday.

    I think Nolan made the sort of film he wanted. I don’t agree with some of the choices but I liked it and I liked the air battles minus the CGI.

    "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick

    #71297
    zn
    Moderator

    I know that Nolan hates CGI and I was happy to see a film that didn’t rely on that. The reviewer wanted a certain story told on a grander scale. It just wasnt the way Nolan chose to do it. Perhaps Speilberg will make that film someday.

    I think Nolan made the sort of film he wanted. I don’t agree with some of the choices but I liked it and I liked the air battles minus the CGI.

    PA, I honestly recognize Nolan’s merits. But I don’t like him as much as you. That’s purely and sheerly a matter of taste on my part. So you say TOHM-AA-TOE, and I say PORK DUMPLINGS.

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