Anti-Trump protests ARE peaceful and organic.

This topic has 78 replies, 11 voices, and was last updated 7 years, 6 months ago by bnw.

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November 12, 2016 at 7:49 am #57840

Billy_T
Participant

It’s happening again. Like clockwork. Throughout American history, whenever “the people” take to the streets in peaceful protest against injustice — and, yes, the election of Trump IS an injustice on an epic scale — the establishment lies its ass off about it and claims the protesters are violent subversives of one kind or another.

Bullshit.

For two centuries this has been the way things are done in America. From abolitionists to peaceful strikers, to antiwar activists and Civil Rights protesters, to Occupy and now this, the establishment, which has always tilted right in America, freaks out and then imposes its Big Lie machine. And all too many folks on the center and the right eat it up like pancakes loaded with sweet butter and blueberries.

“They’re shipping in anarchists, honey!!”

Again, bullshit.

No one is being “shipped in.” And “anarchists,” if they’re left-wing, actually believe in non-violent action and resistance. See Chomsky on this:

C-Span Chomsky on Anarchism

Are there exceptions? Yes. Of course. That will always be the case whenever large groups of humans gather. But the media, especially the right-wing lunatic fringe part of it, concentrate solely on that tiny, tiny fraction of exceptions and blows that up into one big “See!! This proves how violent leftists and blacks and blah blah blah are!!”

No, it fucking doesn’t.

And half of the time, the violence is caused by police or thugs hired to start shit BY the establishment. That, too, is American historical reality.

And if I hear one more whiny-ass so-called person of the left telling us “We need to listen to Trump voters and understand their pain!!” I’m going to fucking lose it, cuz I’ve never, in all my years following politics, not once, heard a righty call for understanding us. If a person really thinks the problem is “We don’t listen to them,” then they’re not listening. They’re in their own bubble. We can’t help but hear Trump voters because the MSM tilts center-right and it’s loaded to the brim with that echo chamber. And if it doesn’t have card-carrying wingnuts on the screen, 24/7, then it has whiny-ass faux-liberals telling us we need to understand those card-carrying wingnuts, and there is virtually zero reciprocation of any kind.

Fuck this shit.

November 12, 2016 at 8:39 am #57850

— X —
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

if they’re left-wing, actually believe in non-violent action and resistance

Maybe they’re not all left-wing. Maybe a great many are man-bun wearing, nose-ring having, or too content with government assistance to search for a job, non-voters. They can do whatever they want, and you can infer whatever you want, and I’ll just sit back in awe of the sheer ridiculousness of it all. And I kinda hope they keep interviewing these people too. That’s pure comedy gold right there. Can’t get enough of that.

“There will be casualties on both sides!”
“She should sue the United States!”
“Fuck Trump Steaks!”

Billy_T wrote:

“They’re shipping in anarchists, honey!!”

Again, bullshit.

Nope. Apparently they’re not. That seemingly originated from a spokesman of the NCFOP who later retracted his statement. His initial information was that a great many of Charlotte protesters had out-of-State IDs. No need to get so upset about it though. People make mistakes. And I assume you’re doing a caricature of me, because I’m the only one who mentioned that on this board. If so, nice touch. I’m beginning to get a better feel for how you tick.

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss

November 12, 2016 at 8:48 am #57852

InvaderRam
Moderator

i am ok with protesting trump. but how about protesting the democrats too? how about telling them they need to get a better candidate than hillary clinton?

i almost feel like this plays into their hands.

we’ll watch the country fall apart the next 4 years, and the democrats will be smiling and say, “hey. don’t worry. come back with us. we’ll take care of it…”

November 12, 2016 at 8:54 am #57853

Billy_T
Participant

— X — wrote:

Nope. Apparently they’re not. That seemingly originated from a spokesman of the NCFOP who later retracted his statement. His initial information was that a great many of Charlotte protesters had out-of-State IDs. No need to get so upset about it though. People make mistakes. And I assume you’re doing a caricature of me, because I’m the only one who mentioned that on this board. If so, nice touch. I’m beginning to get a better feel for how you tick.

X,

You mentioned the other day that I don’t talk about my own views, and I spend too much time debunking others. You obviously don’t know me well, cuz I’ve been expressing my views on a wide range of subjects, online and off, for decades.

The reason why I do the debunking? Because it’s been my experience over the years that people on the political right spend the majority of THEIR time in these debates lying about the way things are, making shit up, getting hysterical about nothing, going deeply into their paranoid bunkers, and basically just filling the air with bullshit. Or, at best, repeating those lies, that hysterical nonsense, and that paranoia without making the slightest effort to fact-check.

So I see and hear endless streams of bullshit coming from the right, and it’s far too much for me or anyone else to tackle, so many of us do a bit of triage while the emergency room for bullshit victims is overwhelmed.

I also mentioned earlier that I have fallen back on bad habits on this forum recently, wasting my time with that triage and that wingnut bullshit, cuz I know and have always known fighting against it is futile. The right never stops making up shit, lying about reality, turning tiny molehills into hair’s-on-fire mountains, etc. etc. It. Never. Ends.

So, just give it time. In a few days, I’ll likely be out of here and off doing other things, like finishing my novels, hiking, climbing and enjoying life beyond the political.

In short, X, you have no clue who I am.

November 12, 2016 at 8:56 am #57854

wv
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

….Fuck this shit.

————

Hey, what happened to the BT that wanted to get back to some spiritual grounding?

Dark Times, comrad. For sure. But…be a light
Channel all that anger into some Art or Music or…drugs or somethin 🙂

Are you near an Ocean? Lake? Mountain trails? Get away from humans for a while. Recharge.

w
v
“…Every man, plant and creature in Existence,
Every woman, child, vein and note
Is…

A harbinger of joy,
The harbinger of
Light.
Hafiz – “The Subject Tonight is Love”

November 12, 2016 at 8:58 am #57855

Billy_T
Participant

InvaderRam wrote:

i am ok with protesting trump. but how about protesting the democrats too? how about telling them they need to get a better candidate than hillary clinton?

i almost feel like this plays into their hands.

we’ll watch the country fall apart the next 4 years, and the democrats will be smiling and say, “hey. don’t worry. come back with us. we’ll take care of it…”

I agree with a lot of that, IR. But from what I’ve seen, the Dems are catching a ton of hell right now, and deservedly so. I don’t think there’s a lack of circular firing squads for them today, or into the future. We can only hope that they clean house, like many of us want to clean house with the Rams.

November 12, 2016 at 8:59 am #57856
Billy_T
Participant
wv wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

….Fuck this shit.

————

Hey, what happened to the BT that wanted to get back to some spiritual grounding?

Dark Times, BT. For sure. But…be a light
Channel all that anger into some Art or Music or…drugs or somethin
w
v
“…Every man, plant and creature in Existence,
Every woman, child, vein and note
Is…

A harbinger of joy,
The harbinger of
Light.
Hafiz – “The Subject Tonight is Love”

WV,

I know I need to do that. Just pisses me off seeing the same old same old shit about protesters supposedly being “bused in” and violent.

I’ve really had enough of that. And that’s probably going to lead me offline and into doing those things you said. Give me a day or two, at least.

;>)
- This reply was modified 7 years, 6 months ago by Billy_T.
November 12, 2016 at 9:02 am #57858

— X —
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

You obviously don’t know me well, cuz I’ve been expressing my views on a wide range of subjects, online and off, for decades.

Well, yeah. Of course I don’t know you well. We’ve been exposed to each other’s views for what … 4 days? lol. And how would I know how you conduct yourself offline — for decades?

Billy_T wrote:

In short, X, you have no clue who I am.

Again. Clearly. That’s why I asked. You know, to gain a little insight? To get to know you?

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss

November 12, 2016 at 9:16 am #57859

Billy_T
Participant

— X — wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

You obviously don’t know me well, cuz I’ve been expressing my views on a wide range of subjects, online and off, for decades.

Well, yeah. Of course I don’t know you well. We’ve been exposed to each other’s views for what … 4 days? lol. And how would I know how you conduct yourself offline — for decades?

Billy_T wrote:

In short, X, you have no clue who I am.

Again. Clearly. That’s why I asked. You know, to gain a little insight? To get to know you?

Fair enough. But this is a two-way street. And, whether you believe me or not, the OP was NOT directed at you, though I did use a phrase from one of your comments. It’s directed “out there,” and is a response literally to decades of witnessing this, along with reading histories on the subject of American protest movements, treatment of dissidents, etc. etc.

I’d highly recommend this one, for instance:

The Age of Acquiescence.

My anger is wide-ranging, and I hope I’m never petty enough to direct that anger at just one person, especially on a bulletin board. If that ever happens, I’ve screwed up and let myself down too. It’s not about you, X, or me, frankly. It’s waaaay bigger than us. That’s my take on this crazy Groundhog Day shit in America.

And Trump? I have absolutely no doubt that he’s a conartist and that most of his supporters will soon see it too. If his surrounding himself with dozens Washington insiders and big time K-Street lobbyists isn’t enough, watching Ryan and McConnell ram through their agenda should be. He isn’t bringing any “change” beyond his vicious and vulgar public behavior.

Trump does in public what those guys in the back rooms have been hiding from us for decades. He won’t end it, and it was always beyond ludicrous to think a lying, cheating billionaire would. He has no interest in doing that. He’s always been one of them or a wannabe.

November 12, 2016 at 9:52 am #57867

— X —
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

Fair enough. But this is a two-way street. And, whether you believe me or not, the OP was NOT directed at you, though I did use a phrase from one of your comments. It’s directed “out there,” and is a response literally to decades of witnessing this, along with reading histories on the subject of American protest movements, treatment of dissidents, etc. etc.

I didn’t think it was directed *at* me. I was just addressing the caricaturization *of* me. I made a mistake. I took the word of a spokesman from the NC Fraternal Order of Police who said many of the arrested had out-of-State IDs. I don’t know who told him that, because I couldn’t fact-check it in real time. Nobody could. I had no access to the paperwork within those jails as those people were being arrested. So I made a mistake trusting and repeating the statement of a police official. Shit happens. I usually follow stories to their source and then determine whether or not they have any credibility.

Billy_T wrote:

I’d highly recommend this one, for instance:

The Age of Acquiescence.

I’ll check it out, maybe, but a cursory reading of the description tells me I mostly agree with it and have already studied the history and effects of corporatocracy. But as a favor to you, I’ll try to get a copy of this specific book and then maybe we’ll have something to discuss from a common ground perspective.

Billy_T wrote:

And Trump? I have absolutely no doubt that he’s a conartist and that most of his supporters will soon see it too. If his surrounding himself with dozens Washington insiders and big time K-Street lobbyists isn’t enough, watching Ryan and McConnell ram through their agenda should be. He isn’t bringing any “change” beyond his vicious and vulgar public behavior.

I can’t speak for anyone other than myself, but the prevailing opinion out there – from the right – is that his actions will be held under very close scrutiny, and he’ll be held accountable for his actions if he fails to live up to the promises he’s made to them. My personal twitter feed is littered with those very sentiments from highly regarded political commentators. So we’ll see how it shakes out.

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss

November 12, 2016 at 9:57 am #57871

zn
Moderator

— X — wrote:

And I assume you’re doing a caricature of me, because I’m the only one who mentioned that on this board. If so, nice touch. I’m beginning to get a better feel for how you tick.

Billy_T wrote:

So, just give it time. In a few days, I’ll likely be out of here and off doing other things, like finishing my novels, hiking, climbing and enjoying life beyond the political.

In short, X, you have no clue who I am.

This probably isn’t necessary cause you guys will handle things. BUT. I need to make the standard issue “statement.” This is all tip-toeing toward the edge. Remember the last huddle board fell apart because we let it fly and got into “sides bashing” (eg. “the left/right is universally [something bad]) and personal attacks. The new experiment is that we try to have an open public forum, where politics and social divisions among other things are uncensored topics, but we keep it within bounds.

BTW when it comes to that, I am a reformed basher myself and certainly not One With Answers.

Can we have clashing worldviews yet show just enough decent personal respectful restraint to make the experiment work? I think yes.

Hang on I have more but let me get my notes.

November 12, 2016 at 9:58 am #57872

Billy_T
Participant

— X — wrote:

I can’t speak for anyone other than myself, but the prevailing opinion out there – from the right – is that his actions will be held under very close scrutiny, and he’ll be held accountable for his actions if he fails to live up to the promises he’s made to them. My personal twitter feed is littered with those very sentiments from highly regarded political commentators. So we’ll see how it shakes out.

Thanks, X. Good response. Appreciate your willingness to check out that book.

And I really do hope what you say above is true. If the right does hold him accountable, as you say, it will go a long way in creating true “common ground” for all of us.

November 12, 2016 at 10:08 am #57875

Billy_T
Participant

ZN,

No worries. I fully intend to rein myself in. The last few days have just been really tough on a micro and macro level — for millions, as you know.

I’m just hoping that everyone here tries to be circumspect in their posts, their sources, their articles, etc. It goes without saying that this includes meself.

To me, it’s not just about refraining from personalizing stuff, though that’s the most important thing. In order to keep the heat down and spread the light, I think all of us should also fact-check and question the stuff we link to first, so we don’t provoke heated responses in turn.

Again, that obviously includes me as well.

Just my two cents.

November 12, 2016 at 10:11 am #57877

— X —
Participant

zn wrote:

This is all tip-toeing toward the edge. Remember the last huddle board fell apart because we let it fly and got into “sides bashing” (eg. “the left/right is universally [something bad]) and personal attacks. The new experiment is that we try to have an open public forum, where politics and social divisions among other things are uncensored topics, but we keep it within bounds.

Heh.

I have no intention of going sideways on your board, even though some of my past actions would lead people to believe I can go scorched earth at the flip of a switch. Won’t happen, and I’ve reached out to BT a couple of times to gain a better understanding of him. Yes, my remark was a slight escalation, and I admit it, but it wasn’t meant to incite him. It was just a gentle reminder that words have consequences. That said, I’ll try to rein it in a little out of respect for your rules.

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss

November 12, 2016 at 10:20 am #57879

Billy_T
Participant

Btw, X,

Can you re-post the link to that becoming a minister for the Dude thing?

Maybe a bunch of us can get together someday and watch The Big Lebowski. Perhaps after watching the Rams trounce the Niners.

;>)

November 12, 2016 at 10:27 am #57882

— X —
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

Btw, X,

Can you re-post the link to that becoming a minister for the Dude thing?

Maybe a bunch of us can get together someday and watch The Big Lebowski. Perhaps after watching the Rams trounce the Niners.

;>)

Ha. I would love that.

Get Ordained Free as a Dudeist Minister

And after I read your book, you have to read ‘The Tao of the Dude’. lol

The Tao of the Dude

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss

November 12, 2016 at 10:32 am #57883

Billy_T
Participant

— X — wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

Btw, X,

Can you re-post the link to that becoming a minister for the Dude thing?

Maybe a bunch of us can get together someday and watch The Big Lebowski. Perhaps after watching the Rams trounce the Niners.

;>)

Ha. I would love that.

Get Ordained Free as a Dudeist Minister

And after I read your book, you have to read ‘The Tao of the Dude’. lol

The Tao of the Dude

Thanks, X.

I’ll definitely pick up that book. Looks good.

Oh, and, one more thing:

Fuck it, let’s go bowling.

November 12, 2016 at 10:36 am #57885

zn
Moderator

Billy_T wrote:

no worries. I fully intend to rein myself in.

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping X in check.

— X — wrote:

I’ll try to rein it in a little out of respect for your rules.

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping BT in check.

zn wrote:

I am a reformed basher myself

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping zn in check.

..

November 12, 2016 at 10:44 am #57886

bnw
Blocked

— X — wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

You obviously don’t know me well, cuz I’ve been expressing my views on a wide range of subjects, online and off, for decades.

Well, yeah. Of course I don’t know you well. We’ve been exposed to each other’s views for what … 4 days?

Billy is the communist Chicken Little of american politics. The sky is always falling because continental capitalism through corporatism (see wv I listen) control of our government plays the workers against each other for the benefit of the greedy 1%. Billy wants a localized communal based economy in which people work and contribute as much as they want with no one being in control or getting rich. Mao suits optional.

The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

Sprinkles are for winners.

November 12, 2016 at 10:45 am #57887

Billy_T
Participant

zn wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

no worries. I fully intend to rein myself in.

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping X in check.

— X — wrote:

I’ll try to rein it in a little out of respect for your rules.

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping BT in check.

zn wrote:

I am a reformed basher myself

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping zn in check.

..

ZN, please don’t go all meta on us again. Last time you did that, this happened:

November 12, 2016 at 10:50 am #57888

bnw
Blocked

zn wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

no worries. I fully intend to rein myself in.

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping X in check.

— X — wrote:

I’ll try to rein it in a little out of respect for your rules.

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping BT in check.

zn wrote:

I am a reformed basher myself

No what I meant was, I need your help keeping zn in check.

..

You got it.

The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

Sprinkles are for winners.

November 12, 2016 at 10:53 am #57889

Billy_T
Participant

bnw wrote:

— X — wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

You obviously don’t know me well, cuz I’ve been expressing my views on a wide range of subjects, online and off, for decades.

Well, yeah. Of course I don’t know you well. We’ve been exposed to each other’s views for what … 4 days?

Billy is the communist Chicken Little of american politics. The sky is always falling because continental capitalism through corporatism (see wv I listen) control of our government plays the workers against each other for the benefit of the greedy 1%. Billy wants a localized communal based economy in which people work and contribute as much as they want with no one being in control or getting rich. Mao suits optional.

bnw,

Thanks for getting into the spirit of things here. Well done.

And, Mao? Really? Come on, man. We’re opposites. My vision is fundamentally anti-authoritarian, left-anarchist, libertarian socialist, and my personal philosophy scores out at the bottom of Adorno’s F-Scale on that issue — updated over at political compass.

But you’re gonna believe what you’re going to believe, so whatev.

November 12, 2016 at 10:59 am #57891

— X —
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

Fuck it, let’s go bowling.

188 average.
Though, that fluctuates higher and lower depending on my BAC.
I’ve found that a .102 BAC is the sweet spot.

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss

November 12, 2016 at 11:13 am #57898

Billy_T
Participant

— X — wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

Fuck it, let’s go bowling.

188 average.
Though, that fluctuates higher and lower depending on my BAC.
I’ve found that a .102 BAC is the sweet spot.

It’s a fun game. But I haven’t been in a long time. Used to be halfway decent at it, but never got to the point where I bought my own gear. I think I broke 200 once or twice and dated a girl back in the day who could do that regularly. She was my beautiful “Jersey Girl,” and I was damn proud of her and just being with her knocked me for a loop. She was so cool and gorgeous I really didn’t care that she kicked my butt in bowling.

November 12, 2016 at 11:34 am #57910

bnw
Blocked

Billy_T wrote:

bnw wrote:

— X — wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

You obviously don’t know me well, cuz I’ve been expressing my views on a wide range of subjects, online and off, for decades.

Well, yeah. Of course I don’t know you well. We’ve been exposed to each other’s views for what … 4 days?

Billy is the communist Chicken Little of american politics. The sky is always falling because continental capitalism through corporatism (see wv I listen) control of our government plays the workers against each other for the benefit of the greedy 1%. Billy wants a localized communal based economy in which people work and contribute as much as they want with no one being in control or getting rich. Mao suits optional.

bnw,

Thanks for getting into the spirit of things here. Well done.

And, Mao? Really? Come on, man. We’re opposites. My vision is fundamentally anti-authoritarian, left-anarchist, libertarian socialist, and my personal philosophy scores out at the bottom of Adorno’s F-Scale on that issue — updated over at political compass.

But you’re gonna believe what you’re going to believe, so whatev.

Not Mao. Mao suits. It was a joke. However I did try my best to accurately give your view as told to me repeatedly in the past.

The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

Sprinkles are for winners.

November 12, 2016 at 11:50 am #57915

— X —
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

It’s a fun game. But I haven’t been in a long time. Used to be halfway decent at it, but never got to the point where I bought my own gear. I think I broke 200 once or twice and dated a girl back in the day who could do that regularly. She was my beautiful “Jersey Girl,” and I was damn proud of her and just being with her knocked me for a loop. She was so cool and gorgeous I really didn’t care that she kicked my butt in bowling.

[Video omitted from the quote because … no.]

That’s a cool story. I had a girl like that once, and also from Jersey. Old Bridge, to be exact. Her cousin was my best friend in Florida and she used to come down to visit them and we hooked up. Absolutely the most gorgeous girl I had ever seen in my life. To the point that her other cousin used to get caught ogling her. lol. So I went up to NJ every few months (I was 18/19 at the time), and she would come back down every few months until it became obvious that a long distance relationship between teenagers was what it was. We just ended up meeting other people who were more readily available, but I still think about her from time to time, some 32 years later. I wouldn’t wanna run into her now either. I’d rather remember her as the super fine 19 year old black-belt [think: flexibility] that she was.

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss

November 12, 2016 at 11:53 am #57916

Billy_T
Participant

bnw wrote:

Not Mao. Mao suits. It was a joke. However I did try my best to accurately give your view as told to me repeatedly in the past.

Okay. So it was a joke. And you got some of the basics down, yeah. But you added an intro that wasn’t accurate. Chicken little, etc. So I give you a five score out of a possible ten.

;>)

November 12, 2016 at 12:06 pm #57921

Billy_T
Participant

— X — wrote:

Billy_T wrote:

It’s a fun game. But I haven’t been in a long time. Used to be halfway decent at it, but never got to the point where I bought my own gear. I think I broke 200 once or twice and dated a girl back in the day who could do that regularly. She was my beautiful “Jersey Girl,” and I was damn proud of her and just being with her knocked me for a loop. She was so cool and gorgeous I really didn’t care that she kicked my butt in bowling.

[Video omitted from the quote because … no.]

That’s a cool story. I had a girl like that once, and also from Jersey. Old Bridge, to be exact. Her cousin was my best friend in Florida and she used to come down to visit them and we hooked up. Absolutely the most gorgeous girl I had ever seen in my life. To the point that her other cousin used to get caught ogling her. lol. So I went up to NJ every few months (I was 18/19 at the time), and she would come back down every few months until it became obvious that a long distance relationship between teenagers was what it was. We just ended up meeting other people who were more readily available, but I still think about her from time to time, some 32 years later. I wouldn’t wanna run into her now either. I’d rather remember her as the super fine 19 year old black-belt [think: flexibility] that she was.

Wow, X. Your Jersey girl story isn’t that far away from mine. Long-distance, very young lovers stuff too. Mine lasted about 2.5 years, and it was like a drug for me. Just thinking about driving north on I95 made me crazy. I had it that bad for her.

It was returned for most of that time, until it wasn’t. And her parents loved me too. Basically all but said they wanted me to be their son-in-law. Looking back on that aspect now, I think their expression of this was the beginning of the end for us. To her, at first, I was this cool, long-haired rebel without a cause, and no way did she want her parents to “approve.” I had won her heart with poetry and my amazing charm and charisma!!! — ;>) — but she was hot-blooded (Puerto Rican and Italian), and didn’t really like the idea of her folks liking her beau.

I get nostalgic for her when I hear Bruce sing Tom Wait’s song. Those were the days!

November 12, 2016 at 12:11 pm #57923

NewMexicoRam
Participant

zn wrote:

— X — wrote:

And I assume you’re doing a caricature of me, because I’m the only one who mentioned that on this board. If so, nice touch. I’m beginning to get a better feel for how you tick.

Billy_T wrote:

So, just give it time. In a few days, I’ll likely be out of here and off doing other things, like finishing my novels, hiking, climbing and enjoying life beyond the political.

In short, X, you have no clue who I am.

This probably isn’t necessary cause you guys will handle things. BUT. I need to make the standard issue “statement.” This is all tip-toeing toward the edge. Remember the last huddle board fell apart because we let it fly and got into “sides bashing” (eg. “the left/right is universally [something bad]) and personal attacks. The new experiment is that we try to have an open public forum, where politics and social divisions among other things are uncensored topics, but we keep it within bounds.

BTW when it comes to that, I am a reformed basher myself and certainly not One With Answers.

Can we have clashing worldviews yet show just enough decent personal respectful restraint to make the experiment work? I think yes.

Hang on I have more but let me get my notes.

_____________________________________________________
A-ha. Thanks, zn, for that post. I left the previous board because I thought the posts didn’t emphasize issues and got into personal attacks, with no attempts to see the other’s POV. And it did seem to me your own “tone” changed, but I didn’t want to mention it, but you now confirm it. Thank you very much and I’m very willing to participate in such a board the way you are describing it. Being able to discuss in a civil matter is one thing that makes America great and what all should strive for.

November 12, 2016 at 12:38 pm #57932

— X —
Participant

Billy_T wrote:

Wow, X. Your Jersey girl story isn’t that far away from mine. Long-distance, very young lovers stuff too. Mine lasted about 2.5 years, and it was like a drug for me. Just thinking about driving north on I95 made me crazy. I had it that bad for her.

It was returned for most of that time, until it wasn’t. And her parents loved me too. Basically all but said they wanted me to be their son-in-law. Looking back on that aspect now, I think their expression of this was the beginning of the end for us. To her, at first, I was this cool, long-haired rebel without a cause, and no way did she want her parents to “approve.” I had won her heart with poetry and my amazing charm and charisma!!! — ;>) — but she was hot-blooded (Puerto Rican and Italian), and didn’t really like the idea of her folks liking her beau.

I get nostalgic for her when I hear Bruce sing Tom Wait’s song. Those were the days!

Yeah, I can relate. Picking her up from the airport, or waiting to see her while flying, was torturous. Man if we could somehow bottle that feeling, eh? Oh wait. Ecstasy. But yeah, I had it real bad for her too. She was an artist and a black-belt. I was a guitar player, and a boxer. So we had that goin’ for us. Which was nice. And her parents adored me too, but that’s actually what she wanted more than anything. They were a real tight-knit family with new age ideas and a fond attachment to Woodstock. Very eclectic people who I grew to love more than my own family (another long, long story).

The thing that brings me back to those days is this song.

It was playing our first time – in her bedroom in her parent’s townhome – on her oversized white down comforter with the faintest scent of sandalwood incense in the air from her parent’s room – and one small street light shining through her plum-colored curtains, giving off just enough light to see that perfect body and those big brown eyes. That’s a groundhog day I wouldn’t mind being stuck in for eternity.

You have to be odd, to be number one.
-- Dr Seuss
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