Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Public House › Trump channeling Gertrude Stein as Holden Caulfield.
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bnw.
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September 30, 2016 at 12:27 pm #54145
Billy_TParticipantIt’s tough enough to follow Trump when you see him speak. But when you read his transcripts, it’s nearly impossible. His word salad makes Palin seem like Cicero.
After reading a coupla quotes in the latest from Chauncey DeVega, I was reminded of Gertrude Stein, her unique way of forming fragments, paragraphs, pages . . . and Salinger’s voice through his character Holden Caulfield.
“Or, as I’ve been saying for a long time, and I think you’ll agree, because I said it to you once, had we taken the oil — and we should have taken the oil — ISIS would not have been able to form either, because the oil was their primary source of income. And now they have the oil all over the place, including the oil — a lot of the oil in Libya, which was another one of her disasters.”
and . . .
“So we have to get very, very tough on cyber and cyber warfare. It is — it is a huge problem. I have a son. He’s 10 years old. He has computers. He is so good with these computers, it’s unbelievable. The security aspect of cyber is very, very tough. And maybe it’s hardly doable.”
and . . .
“I think that once the nuclear alternative happens, it’s over. At the same time, we have to be prepared. I can’t take anything off the table. Because you look at some of these countries, you look at North Korea, we’re doing nothing there. China should solve that problem for us. China should go into North Korea. China is totally powerful as it relates to North Korea. And by the way, another one powerful is the worst deal I think I’ve ever seen negotiated that you started is the Iran deal. Iran is one of their biggest trading partners. Iran has power over North Korea. And when they made that horrible deal with Iran, they should have included the fact that they do something with respect to North Korea. And they should have done something with respect to Yemen and all these other places.”
Not only is the substance of his remarks a key indication of his stupidity and ignorance, but the rhythm of it all, the sense that this is a child speaking, at best an arrested adolescent, is, well, scary, given what he’s trying to do.
If he were a fiction writer, and had created this voice, I’d be seriously impressed. But he’s not. This is the way his brain works. Scattered, fearful, disconnected fragments, circling back on themselves, sometimes at odds, spoken as if he were a five-year-old, or thirteen on a good day.
September 30, 2016 at 3:13 pm #54152
sdramParticipantMy wife’s grandmother was born in Germany and her father(my father in-law) spoke only German until he went to grade school in the early 40’s. So, their whole family was influenced by this and to a person they have an odd to the ear way of speaking. Their phrasing is sometimes backwards and certain phrases are continuously misspoken with the verb being kind of stuck into the sentence or phrase in the wrong place. It’s carried over to my wife and her siblings as well. It’s hard to explain unless one lives around them for forty years. Her grandmother immigrated to the US in the early to mid 30’s – she’s 104 now and still going strong. I think she said she was 14 when she came here and from the area known as Prussia.
For a long time I thought maybe they were Nazi spies who had been planted by Hitler en masse to at some point conquer the town of Hosmer South Dakota and rule it with an iron fist. But, it turns out they just grew up sort of secluded from the rest of American society, TV, and radio even and the willy nilly rules of the English language.
I don’t know – Trump sometimes sounds like a total idiot. I think there’s something to his phrasing that kind of reminds me of my wife’s family when they speak. But, regardless of what his IQ or mental abilities are, he’s always an asshole as far as I’m concerned.
September 30, 2016 at 4:15 pm #54155bnwBlockedNot only is the substance of his remarks a key indication of his stupidity and ignorance, but the rhythm of it all, the sense that this is a child speaking, at best an arrested adolescent, is, well, scary, given what he’s trying to do.
He’s trying to win by getting more votes than Hildabeast and he’s been exceptional at it. Even with all the usual democrat vote fraud and now with Hildabeast exceptional level of cheating by democrats within their failed big cities Trump is still going to win. The desperation and now panic on the left is gratifying.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
September 30, 2016 at 8:40 pm #54164
ZooeyModeratorI think…I’d rather have Holden Caulfield as president.
The guy was at least reflective, cared about other people, and possessed something of an artist’s soul. As self-absorbed and unable to read people as he was, he at least had those three virtues. Trump doesn’t have any. He is totally despicable. I cannot think of one thing about him that I find admirable. He is unintelligent and bellicose, chauvinistic, racist, a bully, and a liar. A compulsive liar that lies so much by habit that he isn’t even aware of the fact that he is lying much of the time. He has no understanding of laws, of diplomacy, the constitution, or how government works. He is so completely unfit for office that it is mind-boggling.
Trump is the worst candidate this country has ever seen. No-one this unqualified, both in terms of character and experience, has ever come anywhere near the office before.
September 30, 2016 at 8:55 pm #54165bnwBlockedSo gratifying.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
September 30, 2016 at 9:28 pm #54169Billy_TParticipantI think…I’d rather have Holden Caulfield as president.
The guy was at least reflective, cared about other people, and possessed something of an artist’s soul. As self-absorbed and unable to read people as he was, he at least had those three virtues. Trump doesn’t have any. He is totally despicable. I cannot think of one thing about him that I find admirable. He is unintelligent and bellicose, chauvinistic, racist, a bully, and a liar. A compulsive liar that lies so much by habit that he isn’t even aware of the fact that he is lying much of the time. He has no understanding of laws, of diplomacy, the constitution, or how government works. He is so completely unfit for office that it is mind-boggling.
Trump is the worst candidate this country has ever seen. No-one this unqualified, both in terms of character and experience, has ever come anywhere near the office before.
Zooey,
I agree with you completely about Trump. I wasn’t trying to compare him with Holden via “character.” Holden, for all his flaws, is a hell of a lot better person, and it’s not close. Just language. Just the way Trump speaks. His arrested adolescent way of speaking, though worse than Salinger’s character, with all of that word salad thrown in, jumping back and forth, against and outside itself.
Perhaps it’s a clumsy comparison, and me stretching things too much. But it’s struck me for sometime that Trump’s transcripts read in such a disjointed way, non-sequitur following non-sequitur . . . It’s almost like Dada.
Anyway, yes. He’s easily the worst candidate for president we’ve ever seen — at least in our lifetimes.
September 30, 2016 at 9:40 pm #54170Billy_TParticipantNot only is the substance of his remarks a key indication of his stupidity and ignorance, but the rhythm of it all, the sense that this is a child speaking, at best an arrested adolescent, is, well, scary, given what he’s trying to do.
He’s trying to win by getting more votes than Hildabeast and he’s been exceptional at it. Even with all the usual democrat vote fraud and now with Hildabeast exceptional level of cheating by democrats within their failed big cities Trump is still going to win. The desperation and now panic on the left is gratifying.
bnw, wake up. If there is fraud in this election, it will be perpetrated on behalf of Trump, not against him. His buddy Putin has been trying to tilt the election in his favor for months and months, and he’s had a lot of help via wikileaks. Ever wonder why they don’t go after the Republicans, and are just going after the Dems? And the GOP has conducted a partisan witch hunt against Clinton for years, ever since they realized she would run.
Our politics are playing out asymmetrically, bnw. Trump has an overwhelming advantage in the “rigging” category of things, and it’s not close.
He’s also quite lucky the media is only now starting to look into all of his crooked business dealings, his endless lies about his (non-existent) charitable giving, his refusal to come clean about them and his taxes, his using the Trump Foundation as a slush fund to pay for his thousands of lawsuits, and to avoid taxes. And now we know he broke the law by doing business with Cuba under the embargo. I’ve always been against it, but Trump broke the law and lied about it.
As I’ve said so many times, I can’t for the life of me understand why you support him. He’s been thoroughly exposed as a serial liar, cheat, conman, crook, criminal, bully, racist and misogynist. And for all of his talk about what’s wrong with America, he’s never told you or anyone else how he’d fix a thing. Never. He has no plan. He’s just conning you and everyone else.
September 30, 2016 at 9:42 pm #54171Billy_TParticipantMy wife’s grandmother was born in Germany and her father(my father in-law) spoke only German until he went to grade school in the early 40’s. So, their whole family was influenced by this and to a person they have an odd to the ear way of speaking. Their phrasing is sometimes backwards and certain phrases are continuously misspoken with the verb being kind of stuck into the sentence or phrase in the wrong place. It’s carried over to my wife and her siblings as well. It’s hard to explain unless one lives around them for forty years. Her grandmother immigrated to the US in the early to mid 30’s – she’s 104 now and still going strong. I think she said she was 14 when she came here and from the area known as Prussia.
For a long time I thought maybe they were Nazi spies who had been planted by Hitler en masse to at some point conquer the town of Hosmer South Dakota and rule it with an iron fist. But, it turns out they just grew up sort of secluded from the rest of American society, TV, and radio even and the willy nilly rules of the English language.
I don’t know – Trump sometimes sounds like a total idiot. I think there’s something to his phrasing that kind of reminds me of my wife’s family when they speak. But, regardless of what his IQ or mental abilities are, he’s always an asshole as far as I’m concerned.
That’s a really interesting family story, SD. Thanks for sharing that.
September 30, 2016 at 9:59 pm #54172bnwBlockedNot only is the substance of his remarks a key indication of his stupidity and ignorance, but the rhythm of it all, the sense that this is a child speaking, at best an arrested adolescent, is, well, scary, given what he’s trying to do.
He’s trying to win by getting more votes than Hildabeast and he’s been exceptional at it. Even with all the usual democrat vote fraud and now with Hildabeast exceptional level of cheating by democrats within their failed big cities Trump is still going to win. The desperation and now panic on the left is gratifying.
bnw, wake up. If there is fraud in this election, it will be perpetrated on behalf of Trump, not against him. His buddy Putin has been trying to tilt the election in his favor for months and months, and he’s had a lot of help via wikileaks.
Wake up its so obvious that it is a red herring. Putin has nothing to do with this election other than the establishment’s fear mongering meant to get into a war with Russia. The US is trying to goad Russia into a war. The leaked emails were from the murdered DNC staffer not the russians.
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This reply was modified 8 years, 1 month ago by bnw.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
September 30, 2016 at 9:59 pm #54173Billy_TParticipantI love this Samantha Bee staff picture. This is what they think about Trump after his “fat-shaming” of Alicia Machado.
September 30, 2016 at 10:08 pm #54175Billy_TParticipantNot only is the substance of his remarks a key indication of his stupidity and ignorance, but the rhythm of it all, the sense that this is a child speaking, at best an arrested adolescent, is, well, scary, given what he’s trying to do.
He’s trying to win by getting more votes than Hildabeast and he’s been exceptional at it. Even with all the usual democrat vote fraud and now with Hildabeast exceptional level of cheating by democrats within their failed big cities Trump is still going to win. The desperation and now panic on the left is gratifying.
bnw, wake up. If there is fraud in this election, it will be perpetrated on behalf of Trump, not against him. His buddy Putin has been trying to tilt the election in his favor for months and months, and he’s had a lot of help via wikileaks. Ever wonder why they don’t go after the Republicans, and are just going after the Dems? And the GOP has conducted a partisan witch hunt against Clinton for years, ever since they realized she would run.
Our politics are playing out asymmetrically, bnw. Trump has an overwhelming advantage in the “rigging” category of things, and it’s not close.
He’s also quite lucky the media is only now starting to look into all of his crooked business dealings, his endless lies about his (non-existent) charitable giving, his refusal to come clean about them and his taxes, his using the Trump Foundation as a slush fund to pay for his thousands of lawsuits, and to avoid taxes. And now we know he broke the law by doing business with Cuba under the embargo. I’ve always been against it, but Trump broke the law and lied about it.
As I’ve said so many times, I can’t for the life of me understand why you support him. He’s been thoroughly exposed as a serial liar, cheat, conman, crook, criminal, bully, racist and misogynist. And for all of his talk about what’s wrong with America, he’s never told you or anyone else how he’d fix a thing. Never. He has no plan. He’s just conning you and everyone else.
Wake up its so obvious that it is a red herring. Putin has nothing to do with this election other than the establishment’s fear mongering meant to get into a war with Russia. The US is trying to goad Russia into a war. The leaked emails were from the murdered DNC staffer not the russians.
bnw, it would be a little easier to accept some of your defenses regarding Trump if not for the fact that you dismiss all criticism of him and say it’s all part of some conspiracy. All of it. To you, he can do no wrong, ever. Despite mountains and mountains of evidence proving he’s a crook, a conman, a serial liar, you dismiss all of that — automatically.
No one on earth is that great, bnw. In effect, you’re saying he’s a god-like being without fault or flaws.
Aside from all the massive evidence contradicting that take, this refusal to ever, ever admit that he’s not absolutely perfect in every way possible . . . well, it makes it impossible for me to take your defense seriously. It’s just so incredibly, blindly partisan.
September 30, 2016 at 10:20 pm #54176bnwBlockedYou didn’t even read my post.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
September 30, 2016 at 10:24 pm #54177bnwBlockedI love this Samantha Bee staff picture. This is what they think about Trump after his “fat-shaming” of Alicia Machado.
Machado’s done a great job of shaming herself on TV. While screwing a fellow contestant of a reality show she says
” ‘ Oh your d*** my love, what a tasty d***, your d*** is divine”
That is some appetite she has for sausage. But that is Trump’s fault?
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
September 30, 2016 at 10:39 pm #54178Billy_TParticipantYou didn’t even read my post.
Yes, I read it, bnw. I think you’re dead wrong. And, yeah I read it.
Can you honestly say that you ever click on the links we supply regarding Trump’s malfeasance, endless lies, demagoguery, racist and otherwise? Can you honestly say you read those articles? I don’t recall you ever responding to any of the points made; you just dismiss them out of hand, and try to change the subject to Clinton.
Remember, no one, with the possible exception of Waterfield, is a Clinton supporter here. So when we critique Trump, your attempt to redirect things away from him and toward Clinton, without admitting to any valid criticism of Trump, evah, just doesn’t cut it. It just sounds desperate.
Oh, and speaking of desperation and panic, you keep saying “the left” shows that when it’s critical of Trump. I guess you’ve missed all the right-wingers who despise him too, like Jennifer Rubin, Kathleen Parker and George Will at the WaPo. He’s managed to piss off folks all across the political spectrum, left, right and center. It’s not just “the left.”
September 30, 2016 at 10:42 pm #54179Billy_TParticipantI love this Samantha Bee staff picture. This is what they think about Trump after his “fat-shaming” of Alicia Machado.
Machado’s done a great job of shaming herself on TV. While screwing a fellow contestant of a reality show she says
” ‘ Oh your d*** my love, what a tasty d***, your d*** is divine”
That is some appetite she has for sausage. But that is Trump’s fault?
bnw,
Keep digging. You’re just like Trump.
And you’re back on ignore.
September 30, 2016 at 11:36 pm #54180bnwBlockedYou didn’t even read my post.
Yes, I read it, bnw. I think you’re dead wrong. And, yeah I read it.
Can you honestly say that you ever click on the links we supply regarding Trump’s malfeasance, endless lies, demagoguery, racist and otherwise? Can you honestly say you read those articles? I don’t recall you ever responding to any of the points made; you just dismiss them out of hand, and try to change the subject to Clinton.
Remember, no one, with the possible exception of Waterfield, is a Clinton supporter here. So when we critique Trump, your attempt to redirect things away from him and toward Clinton, without admitting to any valid criticism of Trump, evah, just doesn’t cut it. It just sounds desperate.
Oh, and speaking of desperation and panic, you keep saying “the left” shows that when it’s critical of Trump. I guess you’ve missed all the right-wingers who despise him too, like Jennifer Rubin, Kathleen Parker and George Will at the WaPo. He’s managed to piss off folks all across the political spectrum, left, right and center. It’s not just “the left.”
No you didn’t read it. You’ve now proven it twice.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
October 1, 2016 at 12:07 am #54181bnwBlockedAnd you’re back on ignore.
That is what the 7th time you’ve written that?
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
October 1, 2016 at 11:23 am #54195ZooeyModeratorbnw, it would be a little easier to accept some of your defenses regarding Trump if not for the fact that you dismiss all criticism of him and say it’s all part of some conspiracy. All of it. To you, he can do no wrong, ever. Despite mountains and mountains of evidence proving he’s a crook, a conman, a serial liar, you dismiss all of that — automatically.
This is from a WaPo op-ed by a guy named Robert J. Samuelson:
The pledge to “make America great again” is not an economic project. It’s an exercise in mass psychology. The idea is to get people to displace their anger and frustration onto groups that (in Trump’s view) have eroded America’s “greatness” — Mexicans, Muslims, the Chinese, political and financial elites, and “the media.” The Trump treatment is to peddle hatred and resentment for his political gain.
I think he is largely right, and I would add “intellectual elites” to the list (even though Trump hasn’t attacked them, his supporters show disdain for them). This is the deal: Trump is promising to make all these groups suffer, and to transfer comfort to white, working America. That message has such strong appeal, that his supporters are completely deaf to everything else. Completely deaf. They will not hear it. They are latched onto that core message with vise grips.
And, as president, Trump would make good on the first part of that promise – to make those groups suffer. He won’t follow through on the second part of that promise and anybody who understands the impracticality of bringing industry BACK to the US, and understands Trump’s personal business history knows exactly why he won’t fulfill that promise, but his supporters care only about that one core promise. Nothing else. And they will not be shaken, no matter how much evidence is piled up before them. Trump supporters have no interest in objective evidence, and it is apparent most of them do not even understand the process by which objective evidence is examined, or possibly even understand that there is one.
October 1, 2016 at 11:52 am #54198Billy_TParticipantbnw, it would be a little easier to accept some of your defenses regarding Trump if not for the fact that you dismiss all criticism of him and say it’s all part of some conspiracy. All of it. To you, he can do no wrong, ever. Despite mountains and mountains of evidence proving he’s a crook, a conman, a serial liar, you dismiss all of that — automatically.
This is from a WaPo op-ed by a guy named Robert J. Samuelson:
The pledge to “make America great again” is not an economic project. It’s an exercise in mass psychology. The idea is to get people to displace their anger and frustration onto groups that (in Trump’s view) have eroded America’s “greatness” — Mexicans, Muslims, the Chinese, political and financial elites, and “the media.” The Trump treatment is to peddle hatred and resentment for his political gain.
I think he is largely right, and I would add “intellectual elites” to the list (even though Trump hasn’t attacked them, his supporters show disdain for them). This is the deal: Trump is promising to make all these groups suffer, and to transfer comfort to white, working America. That message has such strong appeal, that his supporters are completely deaf to everything else. Completely deaf. They will not hear it. They are latched onto that core message with vise grips.
And, as president, Trump would make good on the first part of that promise – to make those groups suffer. He won’t follow through on the second part of that promise and anybody who understands the impracticality of bringing industry BACK to the US, and understands Trump’s personal business history knows exactly why he won’t fulfill that promise, but his supporters care only about that one core promise. Nothing else. And they will not be shaken, no matter how much evidence is piled up before them. Trump supporters have no interest in objective evidence, and it is apparent most of them do not even understand the process by which objective evidence is examined, or possibly even understand that there is one.
That rings true, Zooey. And he plays them all like a fiddle. He dupes his followers into believing he’ll help them, despite the evidence that his policies would help no one but the Trumps of this world.
It’s also amazing to watch his fanboys take everything he says as the gospel, and then parrot it online. He tells his Igors to go after his enemies, and they do, parroting the same lies he spews about undocumented workers, black and brown people in general, life in the inner city, and new targets like Alicia Machado. I see this everywhere. He tells them to jump, and they say how high. For all the right’s talk about “liberty and freedom,” they walk in lockstep with their chosen messiahs and do their bidding without question.
In the case of Machado, Trump shows he’s unfit to govern by launching his crusade to destroy her — a powerless young woman. All over the Internet you can find his loyal brownshirts following his misogynist lead:
This reminds me of what Limbaugh tried to do to Sandra Fluke, lying about what she said to Congress — she never talked about her sex life, etc. etc. Trying to “slut-shame” her for having the nerve to call for greater focus and resources to support women’s health.
The man is beyond despicable. And even if we put aside his personal inner ugliness, none of his policies would benefit anyone but the ultra-rich. He has conned his supporters into zombie-like obedience.
October 1, 2016 at 11:56 am #54199Billy_TParticipantThanks for the article, btw.
And no one can accurately say Samuelson is a “liberal” or moderately center-left. He’s a center-right columnist, who mostly writes about economics — and from that angle.
October 1, 2016 at 12:02 pm #54200bnwBlockedThere it is playing the race card again! Trump supporters are not racist. We want change. Change for the better that strengthens the economy, decreases unemployment, removes government from dictating health care, enforcing immigration law, ending the policy of regime change, support for law enforcement and making citizens safe and so much more.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
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