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If Wade Phillips is the DC, I think they could make it work. I read that in Denver he ran a one-gap 3-4. That is not traditionally what I think of when I think 3-4. And, yeah, the secondary needs some work. Another CB?. I think Phillips could have a top 10 defense on the field.
AgamemnonYou have to figure in too, how much of the time the defense will be in a Nickel or Dime package. Teams that run one style, 4-3 or 3-4, will switch schemes at times. Williams tailored the players to his style of defense. imo So, the new guy will want to do some of the same. There will be some changes.
Denver had 3 good man-to-man corners and a lot of pass rushers. That is about all I can say about that. What else they had, I don’t know.
Agamemnonhttp://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/13501687/denver-broncos-one-best-defense-nfl
Broncos’ D could be among NFL’s best
Aug 24, 2015
John ClaytonESPN Senior WriterENGLEWOOD, Colo. — John Elway’s signing of Peyton Manning moved the Denver Broncos into Super Bowl contention for the past three seasons.
But it could be the Denver defense that carves the team’s path back to the Super Bowl this season. To see this defense up close is to be surprised by the speed, like a televised horse race in which the tape speed is one-and-a-half times reality. It’s pretty clear the Broncos’ defense is under the radar. With Wade Phillips in charge as the defensive coordinator, the group is primed for improvement, and potentially the better unit on this team.
As I watched last Tuesday’s practice, linebackers were shooting through the blocking scheme so fast that they reached Manning twice before he was able to get the ball out. On another play, the pressure was instant, and Manning scrambled to his right and tossed the ball away to avoid the sack. Of course, a “sack” in camp is merely an obvious case of a defender being there before the ball would come out. But because you can’t hit the red jersey, defenders can slow up, and make the offense look better than it is. In this case, the speed with which Denver defenders could be near Manning was striking.
Speed. That’s the buzzword for the Broncos’ defense. DeMarcus Ware, Von Miller and Shane Ray fire through and into gaps with speed. The inside linebacking corps has range and speed.
“You just think about the guys in general — me, Von, Shane, Derek Wolfe and others,” Ware said. “We have guys who are very athletic. We don’t have the typical 3-4 guys who are doing two-gap. We are more of a pass-rush, dynamic 3-4. I am amazed how guys are hustling and getting to the quarterback.”
In the preseason opener, the Broncos sacked Seattle Seahawks quarterbacks seven times and forced Pete Carroll to make two changes along the line to fix the problems created by the Broncos. In two preseason games, the Broncos have a total of 12 sacks.
Because of the star power of the Broncos’ offense, the defense often gets overlooked. Under John Fox, who used a hybrid 4-3 scheme that dabbled a little with the 3-4, the Broncos finished third last year for fewest yards allowed and had 41 sacks.
Phillips thinks they can get better.
Shane Ray could be used in a rotation with DeMarcus Ware and Von Miller, making this a deep pass rush. AP Photo/George Bridges“The sky is the limit for us,” Ware said. “We are trying to be the best defense in the NFL. That is testament to what Wade brings to the game and how he plays guys. We have those types of guys who run and get to the quarterback. We shoot gaps. And the linebackers are fast and quick.”
Ware is probably the biggest benefactor of the Phillips hire. Ware had 60.5 sacks in the four seasons Phillips was with him in Dallas. At 33 and in incredible shape, Ware might be ready to return into the 16-to-20 sack level for at least another season with Phillips calling the defensive plays.
“It’s a comfort level,” Ware said. “Those were some of my top years playing in Wade’s defense. You can see it with Von now. He’s 100 percent healthy. Wade knows how to stunt guys and when to drop them in coverages. For offenses, you don’t know who is coming.”
Miller should be a candidate for defensive player of the year in this scheme. He has 49.0 sacks in his first 56 games in the league. He looks natural in Phillips’ 3-4 pass-rush scheme. Miller is a unique talent. Ware compares him to Derrick Thomas, the former Kansas City Chiefs Hall of Fame pass-rusher.
“Von comes off with so much speed and tenacity trying to get to the quarterback,” Ware said. “He has so many different types of rushes. He can spin. He can duck underneath blockers. He’s a short box guy, but he just has so much power. He can get his body so low. That’s what the coaches always like. He can get around the corner and still keep his stability.”
Don’t underestimate Ware’s ability either. He has 127 career sacks and has eight trips to the Pro Bowl. Those qualifications alone make him a candidate for the Pro Football Hall of Fame down the road. The Ware-Miller pass-rush tandem ranks among the best in football. And don’t forget rookie Shane Ray. Considered one the top pass-rushers in the NFL draft, he fell to the Broncos and could allow more of a rotation, keeping Miller and Ware fresh.
Phillips is arguably the best coach in football when it comes to taking a base 4-3 defense and converting it to the 3-4. Transitions in San Diego and Houston dot his NFL résumé. He laughs off the idea that it’s a complex transition, saying the only difference in the schemes is whether one defender plays with a hand on the ground or not.
Some 3-4 schemes force defenders to handle two gaps. Phillips stresses the one-gap approach and players love shooting those gaps in trying to get to the quarterback.
“When players in Wade’s system come to the games, it’s not like it’s, ‘OK, I got to butt this tackle or butt this guard or I’ve got to play the A-gap and the B-gap,'” Ware said. “You know you are playing one gap and there are 10 other guys who have their own gap responsibility. Bill Kollar [the defensive line coach] came in here and said we aren’t two-gapping anymore, we aren’t going to be sitting ducks. We are a pass-rush 3-4 team.'”
Agamemnon
Just a thought. Maybe Donald can play ILB. He runs a 4.6-7. He can do just about anything. He could still pass rush, but from anywhere.
I moved past moving Quinn to OLB, because everybody already does that. But, then, could he move to ILB?
At first glance, it appears that we need LBers, but there are a lot of combinations that might work. imo
But, how much of the time will we be in Nickel or Dime coverage?
I am more inclined to look for good man-to-man CBs. AgamemnonAnd now…it’s no longer pure speculation.
Here’s a thought on how they could line up.
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off the net from Blue and Gold
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there is not that much difference in what he does in a 3-4 than what teams do in a 4-3.
The one-gap part is the key, it’s not a two-gap 3-4 like the Pats sometimes use. It’s like Tennessee, or Steelers.
“We try to fit what the players can do in the defense rather than saying, ‘OK, we’re a 4-3 or we’re a two-gap 3-4,’ ” Phillips said. “We’re a team where if a guy can stunt and rush the passer, we let him do that. If a guy is a power guy, we try to let him be that. It’s all what individual players can do.”
On how to use Donald. in the 3-4 defense these days the DC can play one of the DEs down a 3-tech. In the Phillips playbooks it’s called “Sink” and they can have AD move to either side.
See the post previous to this one.
On how to use Donald. in the 3-4 defense these days the DC can play one of the DEs down a 3-tech. In the Phillips playbooks it’s called “Sink” and they can have AD move to either side.
Just thinking out loud. The idea there is that rather than play both 3/4 DEs over the tackle (as DEs do in most 3/4s), one plays in the 3-tech gap between guard and tackle. The idea is that that suits Donald better.
According to the pic in the last post the front 7 would be:
LDE: Westbrooks, Hayes
NT: Brockers
3-tech: DonaldLOLB: ?
LILB: ? (in the pic it’s Barron but I can’t see that) (Forrest?)
RILB: Ogletree
ROLB: QuinnDonald, Quinn, and Tree on the defensive right side would be a lot of fun and a nightmare for opposing offenses.
According to the way I have interpreted this, Barron seems to be odd man out. Too small to play LB in a 3/4? But then I ain’t Phillips and maybe he has ideas.
If though I am right about Barron, they would then need 2 LBs. Could one of these guys can become a linebacker in this system? —> Forrest, Longacre, Fox, Sims.
And you know…that IS possible, that one of those guys could convert.
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I have no idea how Phillips uses his safeties, so it’s not clear if he would like the Alexander/McDonald combo.
BTW another thing I have seen guys talk about is moving Donald to ILB. On paper that’s plausible but then you would still need a DE.
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I saw a blurb somewhere where a guy said not to worry about the 3-4/4-3 distinction with Phillips. He said all Phillips does is have one of his DEs stand up.
Oops. Now I remember where I saw it. It’s from a tweet Ag posted in another thread.
Invader has a good video of Wade.
Published on Aug 20, 2014
To purchase the full video, click here:https://coacheschoice.com/p-3090-the-…
Featuring one of the most respected defensive coaches in the history of the game, The 3-4 Defense: Alignments, Assignments, and Responsibilities provides an overview of several of the key factors involved in the 3-4 defensive scheme. Initially, the DVD details the advantages of a 3-4 defense, particularly when compared to a 4-3. The DVD then discusses how players are aligned in the 3-4, what assignment they’re expected to undertake, what technique they should employ, and how coaches should individualize how each defender plays according to his unique skill set. The DVD also reviews how the “Phillips 3-4 defense” is executed. Finally, the DVD explains how coaches can utilize the 3-4 to combat specific offensive strategies.
Wade says he has gone away from the traditional 3-4 LBers who take on the guards. He might use one, but the other MLB would be a move lber. He also uses a one-gap technique, not the two-gap that is the more tradional 3-4. His will lber is a chase LBer. He does use a SLBer, which maybe Forrest can fill?
AgamemnonThat’s all true, but, Barron was small even for a 4/3 LB.
In a 3/4 he may be a flat-out liability.
WP uses a 1-gap system but then so did Williams. Even in a 4/3 with Donald drawing double teams, Barron would often just get blown out.
You still have to control the gap. You can’t do that by getting launched into the upper seats.
Yeah, Barron is small. I was surprised he held up last year. How often will the Rams be in Nickel or Dime coverage? What alignments will we use then?
Agamemnoncan josh forrest play mike? that’s the key for me. if he can, my guess is phillips can make forrest and ogletree work. he can make it more than work.
oh wait. the key also is if quinn can play weakside linebacker. according to phillips that’s where the sack production will come from.
you listen to demarcus ware gush about wade. i think he could be great for both quinn and donald.
If you play Forrest at Mike, you don’t have a SLBer.
This thread is about speculation, so speculate. 😉
Agamemnon
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