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November 13, 2014 at 10:19 pm #11783znModerator
Broncos vs. Rams preview
By Nick Wagoner and Jeff Legwold
http://espn.go.com/blog/st-louis-rams/post/_/id/13580/broncos-vs-rams-preview
The St. Louis Rams and Denver Broncos appear to be two ships headed in opposite directions as they head into Sunday’s matchup at the Edward Jones Dome.
At 3-6, the Rams appear headed toward their 11th consecutive year without a winning record. The 7-2 Broncos again look poised for a Super Bowl run. Rams coach Jeff Fisher and his coaching staff have a long history with Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning dating to their days in the AFC and will renew acquaintances Sunday.
ESPN Rams reporter Nick Wagoner and Broncos reporter Jeff Legwold discuss the chances of the Rams pulling off the upset.
Wagoner: Obviously, the Broncos are a top Super Bowl contender and they’re all in on trying to get it done this year. More than halfway through the season, what are some reasons you think this team might be better equipped to finish the job this year and what are some things that might give you a little bit of pause?
Legwold: This time around they bring a far better defense into the mix. When John Elway dove into the offseason, he felt like the Broncos who were returning from injured reserve — starters like Von Miller, Chris Harris Jr. and Derek Wolfe — could be supplemented with free-agency additions, and the Broncos used cap space they had been holding back to sign DeMarcus Ware, T.J. Ward and Aqib Talib. The result is an across-the-board athleticism they did not have last season. And Miller has returned to his form of 2012 when he had 18.5 sacks. The Broncos also replaced Eric Decker with the more versatile Emmanuel Sanders at wide receiver and Peyton Manning has plenty of options. So much so that Manning is on pace to be the first guy to have back-to-back 50-touchdown seasons — 55 in 2013 and currently on pace for 51 this year. All that said, their biggest question mark at the moment is the offensive line, where they have already made four changes that weren’t injury related, including three for this past Sunday’s game against the Oakland Raiders. Manning will always be the biggest reason the offense limits sacks, but three of the nine the Broncos have surrendered this year have come on three-man rushes. And they have had 36 rushing attempts this year for no gain or negative yardage combined. It’s a fairly glaring issue at this point, but the Broncos’ offense as a whole is historically explosive and they always seem to find a work-around to repair the issue week to week.
This past offseason there were plenty of folks in the league, probably among the Rams’ decision-makers as well, who believed this team could put itself into the playoff discussion this year. What’s happened?
Wagoner: Indeed, the Rams had been pointing to this, the third year of the Fisher regime, as the season they break through into playoff contention. But it hasn’t come to light for plenty of reasons. It started with the season-ending knee injury to quarterback Sam Bradford, which spiraled into more injuries to key players over the first half of the season. But the other, perhaps bigger piece of the puzzle is a lack of development in many of the team’s young players. The Rams are the youngest team in the league again this year and were banking on many of those young players who have already been playing to take a major step forward. While some have flashed promise, there haven’t been enough taking the leap the Rams had hoped. The defense is finally starting to come around under new coordinator Gregg Williams but that took nearly half the season and the offense has regressed back to bottom-of-the-league levels as the quality of opponent has improved.
I’ve heard from a number of fans who are excited for this week just because they think it might be Manning’s last visit to St. Louis (for reasons beyond just the possibility of him retiring before the Broncos would be back). He seems like he’s as good as ever though. The Seahawks were able to beat the Broncos in the Super Bowl by generating consistent pass rush, especially from the front four. The Rams’ pass rush is finally starting to live up to the hype. Do you see this as a matchup that could possibly be similar given Manning and the offense’s relative issues, or will this be just another day at the office for him?
Legwold: The Broncos offense is a perfect storm at the moment between Manning’s arrival, coordinator Adam Gase’s ability to construct an offense around Manning that suits the 38-year-old quarterback, Gase’s risk-taking in play calling and the personnel the team has. Throw in a pass-friendly rulebook and you have the pile of touchdowns Manning has put up with Denver. In 41 regular-season games with the Broncos, Manning has now thrown 121 touchdown passes and been sacked just 48 times. He has 15 consecutive games and counting with at least two touchdown passes and his current streak of 48 consecutive games with a touchdown pass is third all time. In the end, teams that have success against him in the rush get the pressure in the middle of the field. Manning tends to identify the edge rushers quickly, even if defensive coordinators try to disguise them, and the ball is usually gone before the edge guys can win the one-on-ones. So the teams that have affected him the most made him pull the ball down, the ones that get push between the guards into the A gaps. Manning can also see those guys coming, so a defense has to get there or the price is high. But overall, the Broncos are dialed in, they find the matchups in the secondary to exploit and have enough impact players. They consistently get one-on-ones their guys can win. Even when Manning said he “stunk” after the loss in New England, he had thrown for 438 yards.
Sticking with the quarterbacks, what’s the long-term plan there? Do they believe Bradford comes back with potential to still be the long-term starter, so the Rams commit to another contract? Or are they looking at what is, at least in the early going, considered a thin class at quarterback in the 2015 draft beyond the top tier?
Wagoner: At this point, I think they’re still figuring out the best option moving forward but there’s a sense that it’s possible Bradford could be back. The Rams have budgeted for his $16 million-plus cap number and could theoretically bring him back at that level, but it seems more likely that they won’t. The question then becomes whether he’d come back at a reduced rate with incentives built in and a rookie quarterback to compete with or if he’d want to explore other options. Austin Davis has done enough to earn a role as a backup but probably not more than that. And Shaun Hill is now the starter but he’s only on a one-year deal and he’s 34. One way or another, the Rams have to prioritize quarterback in next year’s draft. It should be in the first round but Fisher’s knack for getting teams to mediocrity might take the top options out of play, which could in turn force the Rams to move up to get their guy. That would be a bit of a bitter pill to swallow for a team that has been flush with premium picks the past few years after trading the chance at Robert Griffin III to Washington.
The offseason additions to the defense seem to be paying off just fine. How much better is that group and what can Davis expect from that unit in terms of scheme and approach?
Legwold: When things are going well the Broncos have a rhythm on defense. They pound opposing run games out of their base look on early downs and this year have consistently forced teams into long second- and third-down situations. At that point defensive coordinator Jack Del Rio likes to go to their specialty packages in the nickel and dime when Del Rio loads the formation with speed. They give a variety of defensive fronts at that point; move Miller and Ware all over the formation and Del Rio will bring pressure from a variety of places. The Broncos have been successful this season in doing that because they have the lead so often and force teams to chase them and they have the No. 1 run defense in the league. They haven’t surrendered over 67 yards rushing in a game since Week 3 in Seattle and over the last six games they’ve only faced more than 20 rushing attempts by an opposing offense one time — 25 by New England, which ran for 66 yards.
On defense, there may be no collection of coaches who have faced Manning more than Fisher, Dave McGinnis, Williams and Chuck Cecil. How do you think they go about it and have they finally found some rhythm in their pass rush after a slow start?
Wagoner: I would think that the Rams took plenty of notes from how Seattle handled the Broncos in the Super Bowl and in their game earlier this season. The pass rush has been much better over the past four weeks, in part with improved play by the front four and even more so by better timed and executed blitzes. The Rams are first in the NFL in blitz percentage, which is no surprise given that Williams is running the show. Manning is probably the best ever at diagnosing blitzes pre-snap and getting the ball out quickly and accurately. I have to think that would give the Rams a little bit of pause in dialing it up as much as normal but I also tend to doubt they’ll stop being who they are completely. The best bet is for the Rams to lean on the front four to do most of the heavy lifting, which is what they had hoped they’d be able to do at the beginning of the season. But for that to work, they’ll need to have their best performance of the season.
Broncos at Rams: Stats of the Week: 6
Consecutive 100-yard receiving games for Broncos wide receiver Demaryius Thomas heading into this game. The Rams have surrendered one 100-yard receiving performance this season — 112 yards by Larry Fitzgerald last week.
13-6
Record Peyton Manning had as the Indianapolis Colts’ quarterback playing against the Jeff Fisher-led Tennessee Titans, including the postseason.
November 13, 2014 at 10:49 pm #11786znModerator
Fisher: Peyton Manning never betterBy Jeff Legwold | ESPN.com
ENGLEWOOD, Colo. — As an NFL head coach, Jeff Fisher has faced Peyton Manning 19 times, including one playoff game, and in all that preparation, he said Wednesday that the veteran quarterback looks even better this time around.
Manning and the Denver Broncos visit Fisher’s St. Louis Rams on Sunday. It will be the first time Fisher has faced Manning since the quarterback signed with the Broncos in 2012, and Fisher returned to the sideline that same season.
“With all due respect to the Colts and that system, the system is completely different now,” Fisher said on a conference call. “Everybody is moving around, as compared to Marvin [Harrison] playing on one side, Reggie [Wayne] on the other.
“This offense is completely different. They’ve done an outstanding job of putting outstanding players around him. I think this is the best cast of playmakers he’s ever had, and obviously the results are showing that.”
The Broncos have five players with at least 20 catches, with Demaryius Thomas and Emmanuel Sanders leading the way with 65 and 62, respectively. Tight end Julius Thomas leads the NFL with 12 touchdown catches.
In his tenure as Houston Oilers/Tennessee Titans coach, Fisher’s teams faced Manning twice a season beginning in 2002. Manning is 13-6 as a starter in those games. (Two games in that span were end-of-the-regular-season affairs when Indianapolis’ playoff spot was assured and Manning attempted seven and 17 passes, respectively.)
Fisher, whose playing and coaching roots are on defense, has tried all forms of coverage-rush combinations through the years. His staff in St. Louis also includes defensive coordinator Gregg Williams, assistant head coach Dave McGinnis and secondary coach Chuck Cecil, who were all also on Fisher’s staff at times with the Titans.
“I can’t remember a time when he was playing any better,” Fisher said. “I think he’s playing his best ball right now. He’s got great people around him, he’s really got a good feel, he’s not going to take a sack, he’s not going to make a bad decision. It’s very, very difficult to defend.”
Manning leads the NFL with 29 touchdown passes for the 7-2 Broncos and is on pace to become the first player in NFL history to throw for 50 touchdowns in back-to-back seasons. He is third in passing yards (2,912) and has been sacked fewer times (nine) than any other quarterback who has started all of his team’s games.
“There may be a time when you can try to catch a double here or there, but it’s not going to fool Peyton; he knows exactly where to go with the ball,” Fisher said. “When you watch this offense and you watch it close, there is usually two, oftentimes three receivers that are open as an option. Peyton has options.
“You oftentimes wonder why he goes there instead of over here. Well, when he goes there, he makes the right decision, so they make a play. It is very difficult to blanket this offense and take things away and make him hold [the ball].”
November 14, 2014 at 9:47 am #11796znModeratorThe STL Post-Dispatch’s Jim Thomas explains to CineSport’s Noah Coslov the keys to trying to limit Broncos QB Peyton Manning’s production & the reasons behind the Rams starting QB Shaun Hill.
http://cinesport.stltoday.com/saint-louis-sports/thomas-why-start-hill-over-davis/
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November 14, 2014 at 12:38 pm #11810znModeratorPFF Preview: Broncos @ Rams
https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2014/11/14/pff-preview-broncos-rams-week-11/
Coming off a blowout win against the Oakland Raiders, the 7-2 Denver Broncos will travel to St. Louis to take on Jeff Fisher’s 3-6 Rams.
As displayed many times this season, Peyton Manning’s receiving weapons are incredibly dangerous and difficult to defend. Denver’s wideouts are a very important cog in the team’s offensive machine. Demaryius Thomas ranks third among wide receivers with a +11.6 overall grade, and leads the NFL in yards after the catch (459 yards). Thomas is tops at his position in Yards per Route Run as well, posting a stellar 2.96 average. Fellow receiver Emmanuel Sanders has been equally effective in 2014: his quarterbacks have a 126.4 rating when targeting him in 2014, while his catch rate on Deep Passes (20 yards or more) is a solid 55.6, which is third at his position.
The Rams will have a tough time defending Denver’s receivers, but their secondary may be up to the task. Rookie cornerback E.J. Gaines has a strong +4.4 coverage grade and is tied for third at his position with seven passes defended. Gaines is also allowing only 1.01 Yards per Coverage Snap, which ranks him inside the Top 15 cornerbacks for that stat. Free safety Rodney McLeod has also graded positively in coverage this season (+2.4) and has only allowed 44 total yards after the catch. St. Louis’ secondary will certainly be targeted often seeing how much Manning trusts his receivers, so how they hold up to this test will be a telling indicator of the game’s ultimate outcome.
Here are three more notable numbers for each side:
Denver Broncos
Von Miller – leads all outside linebackers with a +23.9 pass rush grade, 32 quarterback hurries and 50 total pressures.
C.J. Anderson – has forced 14 missed tackles in only 38 touches this season, earning him an elusive rating of 100.7 (third among running backs with at least 30 touches).
Chris Harris Jr. – ranks first among cornerbacks with 0.52 Yards per Coverage Snap, while opposing quarterbacks have earned a 44.0 rating when throwing at him.
St. Louis Rams
Aaron Donald – the rookie leads all defensive tackles with a +13.8 run defense grade and is second with a 12.3 Run Stop Percentage.
Jared Cook – ranks at eighth among tight ends with 1.81 Yards per Route Run.
William Hayes – despite the attention that teammate Robert Quinn receives, Hayes ranks inside the Top 10 4-3 defensive ends in Pass Rush Productivity (10.8) and Run Stops (13).
November 14, 2014 at 2:04 pm #11816znModeratorPrediction: Broncos roll past Rams
By Nick Wagoner
http://espn.go.com/blog/st-louis-rams/post/_/id/13590/prediction-broncos-roll-past-rams
Predicting what the St. Louis Rams are going to do from week to week is a difficult exercise, especially when they’re heavy underdogs. Everything seemed to be working against them two weeks ago when they went to San Francisco and they somehow managed to win.
This week, the Denver Broncos come to town expected to cruise past the Rams. The us-against-the-world mentality will be in place once again in the Rams’ locker room. But it’s hard to see how they’ll be able to spring another surprise considering the matchups against the Broncos.
The Rams pass rush has been much improved with 16 sacks over the past four weeks, tied for most in the league (and it will be 17 when the league credits Robert Quinn for a correction from the Kansas City game). But Peyton Manning is probably the best ever at recognizing where pressure is coming from and getting the ball out quick.
Manning is averaging 2.29 seconds before passing, which is second-fastest in the league, and his 67.7 percent completion rate is fourth. The Rams, meanwhile, are last in the league in completion percentage allowed at 69.6 percent. That combination will prove deadly for the Rams because it will neutralize the pass rush and allow Manning and the Broncos offense to continue putting up the points. And scoring points isn’t something the Rams do well, either, averaging 16.6 offensive points per game, 29th in the NFL.
Add it all up and you have all the makings of a blowout.
My prediction: Broncos 31, Rams 10
November 14, 2014 at 5:02 pm #11832znModeratorBrian Schottenheimer points to turnovers leading to QB change
By Nick Wagoner
EARTH CITY, Mo. — If it wasn’t already clear why the St. Louis Rams decided to go back to veteran Shaun Hill at quarterback this week, offensive coordinator Brian Schottenheimer offered further explanation this week.
Simply put, Austin Davis’ propensity for turnovers, not just the sheer volume but the way in which they seemed to turn into immediate points was the driving force behind the decision.
“Austin has played really well for the most part,” Schottenheimer said. “I think the big thing for us was the turnovers. It’s hard to win in this league when you’re turning the football over. We brought Shaun here to be the backup. Austin kind of kept the job because he was playing so well, but now that Austin’s struggling a little bit we just feel like Shaun’s a guy that’s played. Obviously, has the experience. He’s been in this situation before and will go out there do some things and give us just some energy and things like that.”
More than energy, the Rams hope that Hill can cut down on the type of crushing mistakes that have dotted Davis’ time as the starter. In his eight starts and nine games, Davis threw four interceptions and coughed up two fumbles that were returned for touchdowns. Five of those six returns for touchdown have come in the fourth quarter.
Considering the Rams’ knack for starting fast and finishing slow, they can’t afford those types of costly giveaways with the game on the line. With Hill back in the mix, the Rams won’t ask him to take over games and throw it all over the field. Instead, they’ll hope that Hill can be the steady veteran hand they signed him to be and hoped he would be when he initially replaced Sam Bradford.
After a couple of days of watching Hill get back to work in practice, Schottenheimer said he doesn’t expect there to be much rust to knock off.
“He looked really good out here,” Schottenheimer said. “He’s been preparing. He’s a pro. He’s been in this role before. We were teasing a little bit that he looked a little out of shape. Maybe had too many snacks over the last couple weeks, but he’s looked really pretty good, done a nice job. Ball’s coming out of his hand well. Making good, clean decisions. I don’t see the rust.”
November 14, 2014 at 5:23 pm #11834znModeratorRams report: Team works outdoors on Friday, ready for Broncos’ challenge
• By Joe Lyons
After two days indoors, the Rams wrapped up their practice schedule with an outdoor workout at Rams Park on Friday.
The Rams (3-6) will take on the Denver Broncos (7-2) Sunday at noon at the Edward Jones Dome.
“It’s clearly better for your legs to get on the grass. Three days indoors can take its toll over a period of time,” Rams coach Jeff Fisher explained. “We had a great practice. It wasn’t too windy, so we could throw the ball.
“They’re excited, like they are every Friday. We had a good week of practice and we’re excited to play. Understand that we have a big challenge on our hands, but they go into every game thinking we have a chance to win it.”
November 15, 2014 at 9:03 am #11852znModeratorRams notes: After three on the road, team welcomes return to the Dome
• By Joe Lyons
After three eventful weeks on the road, the Rams return to the Edward Jones Dome to take on the Denver Broncos in their Salute to Service game at noon Sunday.
“This young team has learned how to travel, but you can’t beat playing at home,’’ Rams coach Jeff Fisher said.
In recent weeks, the Rams fell 34-7 to the Chiefs in Kansas City, pulled out a 13-10 road victory over San Francisco and dropped a 31-14 decision in Arizona to the Cardinals. Next up is last year’s Super Bowl runner-up, Denver, which is 7-2 and led by five-time league MVP Peyton Manning.
“People referred to (our schedule) as the gauntlet,’’ said Fisher, who has decided to go with veteran Shaun Hill at quarterback Sunday. “You know every week’s a challenge (and) this week’s obviously one of the biggest of the year from a matchup standpoint for us.’’
When asked about Manning’s special qualities, Fisher mentioned the veteran quarterback’s “tremendous respect for everyone associated with the game.’’
Fisher continued: “When Sam (Bradford) went down, I got a text from Peyton, making sure that I told Sam he was thinking about him, wished him luck. That’s the kind of person he is.’’
While the Rams (3-6) return home, Sunday will mark the third straight road game for the Broncos, who lost 43-21 at New England on Nov. 2 before rallying to blow out the Raiders 41-17 last Sunday.
“I think playing on the road is always taxing,’’ Denver coach John Fox said. “It’s eight (home) and eight (road); we know that much and how they clump them is up to the schedule makers. We were aware of it and it’ll be another challenge (Sunday).’’
INJURY REPORT
Cornerback Marcus Roberson, who suffered an ankle injury in the Rams’ road victory over San Francisco two weeks ago, has been ruled out of Sunday’s game.
Others sitting out Friday’s workout were linebacker Daren Bates (groin), defensive back Lamarcus Joyner (groin), wide receiver Damian Williams (hamstring) and defensive tackle Alex Carrington (quadriceps). Carrington is listed as questionable for Sunday while the rest are doubtful. Linebacker Will Herring (foot) was limited in practice Friday and is probable.
Also listed probable are starting middle linebacker James Laurinaitis (foot) and starting defensive end William Hayes (fibula). Both were full participants in Friday’s workout.
With starting running back Ronnie Hillman out with a foot injury, the Broncos’ Montee Ball could see some action Sunday in front of the hometown fans. Ball, who starred at Timberland High in Wentzville, has missed the last five games with a groin injury but has practiced this week and is listed as probable.
Hillman leads the Broncos with 378 rushing yards and has scored four touchdowns. Last week, second-year back C.J. Anderson enjoyed a career day when he rushed for 90 yards and added 73 receiving yards. It was his thrilling 51-yard catch and run for a touchdown just before halftime that helped the Broncos erase a 10-6 deficit and go on to a rout of the Raiders.
Ball, Denver’s second-round draft pick in 2013, ran for 559 yards with four touchdowns as a rookie. This season, he started three of the first four games, rushing for 172 yards and a touchdown with nine receptions for 62 yards.
Tight end Virgil Green (knee) did not practice and is doubtful for Sunday. The rest of the players on the Denver injury report — tackle Ryan Clady (groin), tackle Paul Cornick (shoulder), guard Orlando Franklin (knee), safety Quinton Carter (knee), linebacker Steven Johnson (ankle) and running back Juwan Thompson (knee) — practiced Friday and are probable.
BIG FINE FOR KENDRICKS
In the third quarter of last Sunday’s loss in Arizona, Rams tight end Lance Kendricks was called for an illegal blindside block on Cardinals safety Tony Jefferson that helped Jared Cook take an Austin Davis pass 41 yards to the Arizona 4-yard line.
The 15-yard call pushed the ball back to the Arizona 35. The Rams, who led 14-10 at the time, were unable to add any points as the Cardinals rallied with 21 fourth-quarter points for the win.
On Friday, the NFL hit Kendricks with a fine of $22,050, the minimum amount for an illegal blindside hit. The fine is a reflection of the NFL’s emphasis on player safety.
RAM-BLINGS
The Rams have nominated Fisher for the fourth annual Salute to Service award presented by USAA, the NFL’s official Military Appreciation Sponsor. The winner will be announced during the NFL Honors award show the night before the Super Bowl. Last year’s winner was Baltimore head coach John Harbaugh.
• Hall of Fame defensive back Aeneas Williams will receive his Hall of Fame Ring of Excellence on Sunday in Arizona when the Cardinals take on the Detroit Lions. Williams was drafted by the Cardinals in the third round of the 1991 draft but played the final four seasons of his standout career with the Rams.
• After Friday’s practice, Fisher confirmed that defensive end Chris Long would not be activated. Long suffered an ankle injury that required surgery in the season opener and has been on the injured reserve/designated to return list.
“He’s only practiced two days,’’ the coach said.
November 15, 2014 at 11:29 am #11868znModeratorRams Vs. Broncos: Shane’s Select Seven
Shane Gray
http://www.insidestl.com/insideSTLc…5401/Rams-Vs-Broncos-Shanes-Select-Seven.aspx
While the St. Louis Rams finalized a daunting three game road trip last week and will return to home action this weekend for the first time in a month, the Denver Broncos remain road warriors as they conclude their own three game road trek with a matchup at the dome.
The Broncos stand alone atop the AFC West with a 7-2 season record. The Rams, on the other hand, sit in the solitude of the NFC West’s cellar with a 3-6 mark.
Help From Hill
After posting strong ratings of 98 or above in four of his first five starts, quarterback Austin Davis came back to earth in generating 75.4, 44.6 and 62.6 ratings in his last three outings.
With Davis struggling of late, Rams Head Coach Jeff Fisher felt it was prudent to reevaluate the quarterback position and, in doing so, decided it was time to lean on veteran Shaun Hill, 34.
“We looked at things Monday night and I had lengthy discussions with the offensive staff and just felt that the best thing to do, at this point moving forward, was to lean on the experienced quarterback,” Fisher explained. “I told the team today in front of Austin (Davis) how much I appreciated Austin and his work ethic and his poise, his dedication and the tireless effort that he put in to prepare himself to play. He’s much better now than he was when he started, but made the decision to go ahead and play with Shaun (Hill).”
“We’re moving forward with an experienced quarterback that for all intensive purposes lost his job because of injury,” Fisher continued. “You all understand why we went that way because of the production that we got earlier out of Austin. Again, I don’t want to present anything that appears to be cloudy, but this is in my opinion and the offensive staff’s opinion, what’s best for this football team right now.”
According to Offensive Coordinator Brian Schottenheimer, the decision to demote Davis was most influenced by his recent propensity for turnovers. In his first five starts, he threw a total of three interceptions. However, in just his last three games, Davis has racked up five picks.
“Obviously, we went back and looked at things and Austin (Davis) has played really well for the most part,” Scottenheimer said Wednesday. “I think the big thing for us was the turnovers. It’s hard to win in this league when you’re turning the football over.”
While Davis has handled his return to the backup role in the classy manner that one would expect of the Southern Mississippi product, Hill is understandably excited to step back into the lineup after a 10-week hiatus.
“Obviously there’s some excitement that kicks in and things like that,” Hill admitted. “Now it’s kind of back to business as usual. I’m just 1/11th on offense. You go out and you prepare the best you can for Sunday.”
While Hill is happy to be back on the field, many wonder how much rust he will need to shake off after a two-and-a-half month layoff from live action on the gridiron.
Schottenheimer, however, does not seem overly concerned about that and feels Hill will be ready.
“He looked really good out here,” Schottenheimer said of Hill’s practice outings this week. “He’s been preparing. He’s a pro. He’s been in this role before. We were teasing a little bit that he looked a little out of shape and maybe had too many snacks over the last couple weeks, but he’s looked really pretty good and done a nice job. The ball’s coming out of his hand well. He’s making good, clean decisions. I don’t see the rust.”
In 27 career starts, Hill has compiled a 13-14 career record. He and the Rams hope he reaches the .500 mark Sunday in St. Louis.
The St. Louis Secondary
The extremely green St. Louis secondary has struggled against the pass for much of the season while also dealing with injuries to the likes of Trumaine Johnson, Janoris Jenkins and LeMarcus Joyner. The stats bear out the difficulties they have had in dealing with opposing air attacks, with the Rams giving up the highest completion percentage in the league (69.6) and the fourth highest passer rating (102.6).
While the St. Louis defensive backfield is the youngest in the NFL overall, Fisher credits his youthful group of safeties with helping to hold things down while dealing with the aforementioned injuries to several of the defense’s cornerbacks.
“I think T.J. (McDonald) is playing the safety position right now as good as any safety in the league,” Fisher asserted. “The last couple weeks I think that his play and body of work speaks for itself. He’s making plays. He’s all over the field. He’s going to continue to do that. We got production out of Mark (Barron) last week in a package. Rod’s (Rodney McLeod) been playing very well. These guys have been holding the corners together because we’ve been rolling the young corners. Obviously, now that (CB Trumaine Johnson) Tru’s back and (CB Janoris Jenkins) Jenks is back, (CB E.J. Gaines) E.J.’s going to get some work inside because (CB) Lamarcus (Joyner) looks doubtful for this week. Those guys (at safety) have pretty much been the glue in the secondary.”
This week against future first ball Hall of Fame QB Peyton Manning, that glue and this group is going to face perhaps its stiffest test of the season. Entering this game, Denver is second in points per game, third in offensive yardage per contest, second in passer rating, third in yards per pass attempted and fifth-best on third downs.
Measuring Manning
Coaches have used almost every adjective and cliche imaginable in attempting to desribe the dynamic and other-wordly production of 13-time Pro Bowler and seven-time All-Pro Manning over his illustrious career.
During a mid-week question and answer session with reporters, Fisher compared Manning to playing against a computer. Yes, a computer.
“I’ve said this before, it’s like playing a computer,” Fisher said. “That’s what he is. He runs that offense. He’s going to put them in the best possible position. He’s nearly impossible to fool and is hard to get down. If you rush more than four, the balls coming out and he’s not going to take the hit. That’s just how he is. He puts that offense in the best possible position every snap. If the run’s not there, then he’s going to pick it up and he’s going to change and he’s going to put the ball down the field. He’s prepared. He’s prepared week after week, year after year.”
Fisher went on to explain that he feels that Manning’s career is just now reaching its pinnacle state.
“There’s no doubt, Peyton’s playing his best football right now,” Fisher continued. “Faced him many, many times. He’s playing his best football. It’s amazing the things he’s doing with the football. The cast that they have surrounded him with is outstanding. It really tests your defense. It requires patience. You have to run the football and get their punter on the field. I’m trying to simplify things for you, but you run it on offense and your goal is to get their punter on the field. Then you have a chance.”
In looking at the numbers, it is tough to argue strongly against Fisher’s notion, what with Manning having 29 touchdowns as compared to just seven interceptions to this point in the campaign. His 112 rating this fall is the third-best of any in his career and his QBR is his second best ever.
According to Denver Head Coach John Fox, it it his preparation and adaptability that sets him apart from almost all other NFL signal callers.
“I just think the way he prepares himself, whether it’s physically or whether it’s mentally,” Fox stated. “He has a ‘raise all boats’ type of approach. It’s been huge for our offense. I think what he’s accomplished kind of speaks for itself. Coming off a year of not playing football, stepping into a new organization after being with one team for so long and the same teammates for so long. His ability to adjust and change and do it in a new place is pretty remarkable in my estimation.”
Obviously, Fisher has a long history of facing Manning after coaching against him at least twice per year while with the Titans in the AFC South. With that considered, Fisher readily realizes the difficulties his defense will face this week against the future first ballot Hall of Famer.
“It’s a tremendous challenge,” Fisher said. “One of the biggest challenges I’ve been associated with a staff is defending him and his offense.”
All that said, Fisher maintains he has high expectations for Defensive Coordinator Gregg Williams’ unit.
“We’ve had some success (against Manning),” Fisher said. “And we’re expecting to again. That’s the way you go into it.”
Considering the Clock
Sometimes, the keys to success in a football game are so simple they get overlooked by the masses. In facing Manning and the Broncos bold offensive arsenal, the most basic approach is the best: keep the football out of his hands as much as humanly possible.
Schottenheimer explained why this is important on Thursday.
“Every time that Peyton’s (Manning) on the bench that certainly is important, and their offense is on the bench,” explained Schottenheiemer. “Certainly have played him a lot of times. The times we’ve played well against him, going back to the days with the Jets in division playoff games and stuff like that, you win the time of possession battle. You stay on the field.”
“Again, part of that is getting into third down and manageable, converting third downs and sometimes avoiding third downs with explosive plays,” Schottenheimer continued. “It’s a rhythm thing. Again, I think the big thing for us this week because of time of possession is going to be running the football and throwing completions.”
Against a dynamite Denver defense, though, winning the time of possession battle may be easier said than done.
Denver’s Defense
Even though it’s the Broncos boisterous offense that gets most of the credit throughout Colorado and the broader pro football world, the defense has managed to become a top-tier unit while flying primarily under-the-radar.
On the year, the Denver D has been the league’s best in allowing just 3.2 yards per garry and 67 rushing yards per game. The longest run they have given up all season is a 25 yarder. Facing such a strong ground defense is highly problematic to the St. Louis offense as they need to run the ball effectively to use clock and keep the Broncos’ prolific offense off of the turf.
In addition to their dominance in run defense, Denver has the fifth fewest defensive penalties, ranks seventh in interceptions, seventh-best on third downs, tenth in sacks, ninth best (or lowest) passer rating allowed, tenth best (or lowest) passing completion percentage against and fourteenth in passing yards per game relinquished even while leading big in many of their contests.
“They’re awfully good, yeah,” Fisher said. “What happens typically when you have an offense that’s so potent and making so many big plays and has a scoring average per game that’s so high. The opposing offenses are playing catch-up. Those yards…you don’t want to call them garbage yards, but the defense is going to soften a little bit, give up some plays to win the game.
That happens to an outstanding defense. They are very difficult to run against. Both the edge rushers are outstanding and they get inside push. They’ve done a great job rebuilding their secondary, which was obviously a focus. I think they’ve got a great group of linebackers. We’re going to have to play very well.”
As good as the Denver defense has been, former All-Pro linebacker Von Miller feels they are only going to continue to improve.
“I feel like we still haven’t got to playing the type of football that we know we’re capable of playing,” Miller said. “I feel like we’re getting better and better every week. Our run defense is probably our identity right now. A good first- and second-down defense makes a good third-down defense. I think we’re just starting to get better, preparing for this stretch that we’ve got coming up.”
Dynamic Duo
It isn’t often that we find ourselves halfway through November and find one team touting two of the top 10 indivual sack artists.
In Denver, though, three-time Pro Bowl linebacker Von Miller has nine sacks while seven-time Pro Bowl defensive end DeMarcus Ware has eight—good for sixth and tenth in the NFL, respectively.
The duo doesn’t spend its time competing or trying to top the other in production, though, but instead works hard to help each other be the best they can be.
We’ve got a healthy work-minded relationship,” Miller said in a conference call with Rams reporters Wednesday. “Every day he (Ware) pushes me. I go out there and push him. It’s all healthy and it’s helping our team. I enjoy DeMarcus. I love coming to work every single day, being around him and watching the way he prepares and I think it’s helped me with my game as well.”
Schottenheimer is certainly well aware of the problems the carnivorous combo will present to his offense.
“They create a lot of problems and they play really hard,” Schottenheimer suggested. “It’s a little bit of a benefit obviously, playing them at home, not having to go into the noise. The guy that’s really jumped out just because they move him around quite a little bit is Von (Miller). He’s just really explosive, great spin moves, but we certainly respect them both and they’re really, really good players. Nothing surprising there. You’ve got to do things to keep them off balanced and we’ll certainly try to do that, but it will be a long day if we can’t control those guys.”
“In most of the passing situations he’ll (Miller) be on our right going against (RT) Joe (Barksdale). DeMarcus (Ware) will be on the left. Again, two elite pass rushers, not only are they great rushers, they have great technique and they play extremely hard. They don’t give up and a lot of the sacks they get are second effort plays.”
Obviously, the St. Louis pass protection better be on its collective “A” game come noon Sunday. If not, it will likely be a long day for Hill and the Rams air attack.
Home Sweet Home
After a three-game stretch away from home, St. Louis returns to the dome on Sunday for some home cooking. While away, the Rams were competitive, but won just one of those three contests outside of the Gateway City.
This week, Fisher and the Rams are excited to be playing back under the mighty shadow of the Gateway Arch.
“It’s been an eventful three weeks,” Fisher said. “This young team’s learned how to travel, but you can’t beat playing at home.”
This week, however, a relatively nearby Denver club comes to town with a 7-2 record.
That, along with the pressing stadium issue, the current 3-6 record and a decade-long run of futility may make the dome feel more like a neutral-crowd atmosphere.
Either way, the Rams will have a lot more fans pulling for them this week at home than they have in any of the games they have played in roughly a month.
That alone should be helpful to this still young Rams roster. It just may not be quite as helpful as it would be under more ideal conditions.
November 15, 2014 at 12:01 pm #11872PA RamParticipantOkay–in my work pool I took the Rams to beat the Broncos this week. Nothing but a hunch. Maybe nothing but wishful thinking. But that’s the pick I made–and I loudly boasted about making it. I am not afraid to make such bold proclamations because come Monday I’ll look like a genius.
Or a moron. Either way…that’s my pick.
GO RAMS!!!!!!!!!!
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
November 15, 2014 at 8:32 pm #11891znModeratorW2W4: St. Louis Rams
By Nick Wagoner
http://espn.go.com/blog/st-louis-rams/post/_/id/13682/w2w4-st-louis-rams-14
EARTH CITY, Mo. — The St. Louis Rams and the Denver Broncos kick off Week 11 on Sunday at the Edward Jones Dome. Kickoff is set for 1 p.m. ET on CBS regional coverage.
Here are three things to watch from the Rams’ perspective:
1. The best defense: For as much as we’ll talk about how great Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning is and how difficult of a challenge it is for the defense to slow him and the Denver offense down, the easiest way to stop Manning is to keep him on the sideline. That means establishing an offense capable of consistently moving the chains, extending drives and not turning the ball over. Sounds good, right?
Well, the Rams haven’t exactly been doing any of those things well in recent weeks. The Broncos are first in the league in run defense and not just because teams are throwing a lot by trying to catch up. They’re holding opponents to just 3.19 yards per carry, which is also first in the NFL. The Rams, meanwhile have yet to establish the running game many thought they would. They’ve finally settled on Tre Mason as the primary ballcarrier and he’s flashed promise at times but hasn’t consistently been able to generate yards.
One major key for the Rams is getting better on third down. They were 1-of-10 last week against Arizona and if they can’t keep the chains moving, that means too many chances for Manning.
2. Getting after Manning: Pressuring Manning is easier said than done because he’s one of the best ever at getting rid of the ball quickly. So far this season, Manning is getting rid of the ball after just 2.29 seconds which is second quickest in the league. That means there isn’t much time for the Rams to get after him or for their blitz-heavy packages (they lead the league in blitz percentage) to get home but if there’s going to be a way to get to Manning, it will likely have to be up the middle.
Denver’s offensive line has been in flux the past few weeks, particularly on the interior. That could mean some opportunities for the Rams defensive tackles, especially rookie Aaron Donald. Donald has consistently terrorized quarterbacks in his first nine games and would seem to have an advantage against the musical chairs in the middle.
To slow Manning and the Broncos offense, the Rams will have to do enough in coverage to force him to go to his second or third read and hope that buys them enough time to get in the backfield.
3. Turning to Hill: With veteran Shaun Hill back in the saddle at quarterback, the Rams are hoping that they can cut down on the costly turnovers and mistakes that have plagued them over the past few weeks. Removing Austin Davis from the starting lineup was done mostly because of his propensity for turnovers (six that turned into defensive touchdowns, including five in the fourth quarter).
Hill is in his 14th NFL season and has plenty of experience which should allow him to manage the game. The Rams won’t put the game in Hill’s hands but his primary job will be not to lose it. As always, it’s worth watching the turnover battle but if Hill does give it up, when and where it happens is also something to keep an eye on.
November 15, 2014 at 8:33 pm #11892znModerator
Rams-Broncos: Matchup breakdown
By Nick Wagonerhttp://espn.go.com/blog/st-louis-rams/post/_/id/13607/rams-broncos-matchup-breakdown
EARTH CITY, Mo. — A look at three individual matchups to keep an eye on when the St. Louis Rams and Denver Broncos meet this Sunday at 1 p.m. ET.
Rams defensive tackle Aaron Donald vs. Broncos right guard Manny Ramirez/Whoever starts at right guard
Clearly, the Broncos are unhappy with the production they are getting from the interior of their offensive line. They’ve played musical chairs over the past few weeks and even went so far this week as to bring in former Ram Richie Incognito for a workout and a visit. Denver didn’t sign Incognito but left the door open to add him later on.
Ramirez started for the Broncos against Oakland last week after spending the season at his more traditional spot at center. All of that movement isn’t good for an offensive line that will be tested by the Rams’ surging pass rush. The Rams have 17 sacks over the past four weeks (including one for Robert Quinn that the league plans to credit but hasn’t yet), most in the NFL. That production coincides nicely with the emergence of Donald as the starter at left defensive tackle.
Donald has been a terror from day one, posting three sacks and 12 tackles for loss. Rams coaches have credited him with 18 quarterback pressures and eight quarterback hits. Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning is the best in the world at getting the ball out quick which can help neutralize the pass rush off the edge but if nobody can slow Donald, things will get much more interesting in this one.
Rams left tackle Greg Robinson vs. Broncos right defensive end DeMarcus Ware
After watching Ware throttle Rams left tackle Jake Long in the Dallas game in 2013, many Rams fans are probably happy not to have to watch a rematch here. But that doesn’t mean that things will be any easier when it comes to blocking Ware. One of the best pass-rushers of his generation and still productive in his new home, Ware has eight sacks this season.
The reality is that when the Broncos get in a groove, coordinator Jack Del Rio will move Ware and fellow pass-rusher extraordinaire Von Miller all over the formation which means Robinson will get plenty of different looks throughout the game. But the primary matchup he’ll face is Ware. Robinson has seen some good pass-rushers in his first two starts at left tackle but none the caliber of Ware.
Robinson is still refining his understanding of angles and getting into his set. Physically, he has the ability to keep up with Ware but Ware will challenge him in ways he hasn’t been with his array of pass-rush moves and intellect.
Rams cornerback Janoris Jenkins vs. Broncos wide receiver Demaryius Thomas
Earlier this season, the Rams used Jenkins to shadow the opponent’s top wide receiver. The results of that experiment were mixed with good moments against the likes of Dallas’ Dez Bryant to go with bad ones. Jenkins has been hobbled by a knee injury of late and returned last week against Arizona. This week, he appears to be closer to full strength and should see his workload get back close to normal levels.
But the challenge awaiting Jenkins is perhaps the biggest of the season. Thomas has 1,002 receiving yards with six touchdowns, and at 6-foot-3, 229 pounds is one of the most physically impressive wideouts in the league. For whatever reason, Jenkins has always seemed to fare a bit better against bigger receivers but Thomas is also one of the best. Jenkins has a knack for staying with a top wideout for a number of plays then giving up a big one. It remains to be seen if the Rams will use Jenkins or anyone to shadow Thomas but either way, they can ill afford to allow yet another big play for a touchdown in the passing game.
November 16, 2014 at 1:30 am #11903znModerator7 things to watch: Rams vs. Broncos
By Jim Thomas
HILL RETURNS
After eight games and more than two months on the bench, Shaun Hill resurfaces as the Rams’ starting QB. His timing could’ve been better considering he’ll be trying to match throws with the great Peyton Manning. Not to mention, he’ll be facing the NFL’s fifth-ranked defense. But when it comes down to it, his timing with Rams receivers will be what matters most. There will be an adjustment process, be it the way the ball comes out of Hill’s hand — as a opposed to Austin Davis — or even his cadence at the line of scrimmage. “Shaun has a different touch on the ball,” TE Lance Kendricks said. “But it still gets there the same. He’s a vet quarterback, so he’s been there before. There’s nothing wrong with having that veteran leadership in the huddle. The plays are still the same. We like Shaun. Everyone loves him here. No issues there.”
LAST DANCE IN ST. LOUIS?
Even if the Rams don’t relocate to Los Angeles, this likely will be Manning’s last appearance in the Gateway City. Under the NFL scheduling formula, the Broncos won’t play here again until 2022. He would be 46 by then. So unless he changes clubs, say farewell Sunday to one of the all-time greats. Manning has played here only twice before — both times with Indianapolis. In 2001, the Colts lost 42-17; in 2009, the Colts turned the tables with a 42-6 win.
MILLER & WARE
The Rams faced an elite pass-rushing tandem three weeks ago in KC’s Tamba Hali and Justin Houston. No disrespect intended, but Rams offensive coordinator Brian Schottenheimer likes the Denver duo of Von Miller and DeMarcus Ware. “Since we don’t play Kansas City again this year, I’ll say Denver’s clearly better,” Schottenheimer said. Ware and Miller have 17 sacks between them this season. Miller moves around some, but will play mainly over RT Joe Barksdale.
RUSH HOUR
Tre Mason clearly has moved into feature back status in the Rams’ backfield, but the going will be tough against Denver’s run defense. The Broncos allow only 67 yards rushing per game and only 3.2 yards per carry — both league bests. The man-mountain with one of the NFL’s best nicknames, DT Terrance “Pot Roast” Knighton, clogs the middle. The Broncos have allowed only 11 runs of 10 yards or more all season — yes, another league best.
RUSH HOUR II
The Broncos will be missing their leading rusher against the Rams; Ronnie Hillman has been ruled out with a foot injury. So C.J. Anderson, who had 163 yards rushing and receiving last week in Oakland, is expected to get the start. Montee Ball (Timberland High), who began the year as the starter, is set to return after missing the last five games with a groin injury. So the Broncos shouldn’t miss a beat without Hillman in the lineup.
LOTS OF RECEIVERS
With Marcus Roberson (ankle) ruled out and Lamarcus Joyner (groin) doubtful, the Rams are paper thin at corner. So this isn’t the best time to see Demaryius Thomas, Emmanuel Sanders and Wes Welker come to town. Thomas has a current streak of six consecutive 100-yard receiving games — a franchise record. Sanders already has set a career high for single-season receiving yards (852). Welker has 867 career catches, most for an undrafted player in NFL history.
THE “OTHER” THOMAS
If only the Rams just had to worry about the Denver wideouts. At tight end, Julius Thomas has been a scoring machine, with 12 TD catches in nine games. He’s the first TE in NFL history with at least 12 TDs in back-to-back seasons, proving his breakout year of 2013 was no fluke. At 6-5 and 250 pounds, Thomas literally is a huge challenge for Rams safeties and linebackers in coverage. The only saving grace would be if Thomas gets called upon to stay in more as a blocker.
November 16, 2014 at 2:15 am #11909znModeratorRams set to combat Manning’s wizardry
By Jim Thomas
New Rams safety Mark Barron has faced Peyton Manning only once, two years ago as a Tampa Bay Buccaneer.
It wasn’t the most monstrous of Manning performances: three touchdown passes, 242 yards in a 31-23 Denver victory. Even so, in the minds of Barron and his teammates, it was as if Manning knew every call by the Tampa defense. It’s like he knew what was coming.
“We came away from the game thinking he had cheated or something, the way he was calling it out,” Barron said. “Seriously. He’s a smart guy, man. He knows the game.”
Prof. Manning brings his act to St. Louis — along with the rest of the Denver Broncos — for a noon kickoff Sunday at the Edward Jones Dome. Of course, the show comes complete with all the gestures, gyrations and verbal signals that have become part and parcel of Manning’s game over these many years.
“Omaha! Omaha!”
“I did hear ‘Omaha,’” Barron said of that 2012 game. “He’s been doing that for years. He has a lot of terminology that he uses. It’s like he really has his own language.”
But is it real? Or fake?
“You don’t really know,” Barron said. “You don’t know if something he’s saying is actually real or if it’s a dummy call.”
Since Manning won’t be supplying decoder rings Sunday, it’s up to the Rams to figure that all out. Or … just ignore it.
“You try not to think about that at all,” linebacker Jo-Lonn Dunbar said. “I think he has way too many code words.”
Nothing personal Peyton, but Dunbar doesn’t plan on listening.
“You don’t want to play that cat-and-mouse game with him,” Dunbar said.
Defensive tackle Kendall Langford agrees.
“It’s crowd noise,” Langford. “You can’t get caught up in listening to that because it’ll slow you down. Just go out there and play your game. Do your job. Do your 1/11th, and hopefully we can get it done.”
Teams have tried just about everything in an effort to slow Manning down over the years. Blitzing like crazy. Dropping eight men in coverage. Distracting him with circus clowns. Not much seems to work, unless you have Seattle’s defensive personnel or Bill Belichick’s brain.
Make no mistake, the Rams have studied those tapes, looking to beg, borrow or steal anything they can to slow Manning.
But even for a defensive coordinator as creative as Gregg Williams, you don’t reinvent the wheel 10 games into the season. Especially when you’re facing Manning.
“Really, you don’t change a lot of things you’re doing,” Williams said. “When people start doing that type of stuff is when big accidents happen. We’ve just got to be who we are. We’ve got to be a lot more focused in a couple of situations, in a couple of formations, that they’ll present.”
So at its most basic level, the Rams will try to change looks as much as possible in an effort to keep Manning from zeroing in on what they’re doing — or decipher any pattern to what they’re doing.
Hard as it may seem, if they can take away Manning’s first read, that might give the Rams’ pass-rush — which has been coming on lately — an extra split-second to get in Manning’s face.
Manning doesn’t like getting hit. He has been known to get angry at his blockers when that happens. But he doesn’t get hit much, in large part because he almost always knows where he’s going with the ball and gets the ball out so quickly.
And of course, give the Broncos’ offensive line, re-shuffled as it has been lately, a healthy share of the credit. Manning has been sacked only nine times, a league low, and has been hit only 24 times this season, again a league low.
It’s that way almost every year, which has allowed him to keep upright and keep firing over his 17 NFL seasons in an amazingly consistent and productive fashion.
He enters the Dome on Sunday having thrown at least two touchdown passes in an NFL record 15 consecutive games.
He has thrown at least one TD pass in 48 straight contests, the third-longest such streak in league history.
The only player in NFL history to win five MVP awards, Manning set the NFL all-time record for career TD passes earlier this season. That mark is at 520 TD passes and counting. Should the game somehow be close in the fourth quarter, well, the 13-time Pro Bowler has led a game-winning drive in the fourth quarter or overtime 50 times.
(Yes, that’s also a league record.)
There are few head coaches this side of Belichick who know Manning as well as Rams coach Jeff Fisher. Since Manning entered the league as the No. 1 overall draft pick in 1998, Fisher faced him 19 times as head coach of the Tennessee Titans.
Fisher went 6-13 in those games, with one of those victories coming in a 1999 divisional playoff game the season the Titans advanced to the Super Bowl against Dick Vermeil’s Rams. That’s a winning percentage of just .316, but it’s slightly above the career winning percentage of all opponents against Manning in the regular season: .301, on 75 wins and 174 losses.
“I’ve said this before, it’s like playing a computer,” Fisher said. “That’s what he is. He runs that offense. He’s going to put them in the best possible position. He’s nearly impossible to fool and is hard to get down.”
There were years when Fisher had his entire defense wear wristbands with numbers on them signifying various defensive calls. Not only that, Fisher had the Titans’ defense switch to different wristbands every quarter.
“We couldn’t talk (on the field) because he recognizes your terminology and your calls and things like that,” Fisher said.
So they’d play defense by numbers. Numbers that changed every quarter. If the call was ”Three!” in the second quarter, it would signal something entirely different than what ”Three!” meant in the first quarter.
Did that work?
“No,” Fisher said, laughing. “It may have for a quarter. I don’t know.”
Over the years, Fisher has tried just about every way imaginable to defend Manning.
“Yeah, and we’ve had some success,” Fisher said. “And we’re expecting to again. That’s the way you go into it.”[/quote]
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