Rams need to make this next game real

This topic has 14 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 10 years, 3 months ago by Winnbrad.

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August 18, 2014 at 4:56 am #4296

GreatRamNTheSky
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The Rams need to see the real Rams next week. This needs to be more than a dress rehearsal. They need to game plan and let it all hang out so they know what they have going into the season.

Part of the Rams issues early in the season is they are not use to game planning. I’d use these last two games to do that.

Grits

August 18, 2014 at 8:41 am #4299

wv
Participant

I think they are busy game-planning for
the Vikings.

All i care about is that the OLine
gets to game one, totally healthy.

w
v

August 18, 2014 at 9:51 am #4302

zn
Moderator

Rams actually looked good in their opener last year. They pulled out a come from behind win against a strong ARZ defense. That’s with ARz leading 24-13 at the end of the 3rd quarter.

August 18, 2014 at 10:11 am #4304

rfl
Participant

GRITS, I don’t know that they need to game plan.

But, I agree that they need to pick things up. They need to start becoming their potential.

I don’t believe they can rely on just flipping the switch and suddenly competing when the season begins.

By virtue of the absurd ...

August 18, 2014 at 10:20 am #4306

zn
Moderator

rfl wrote:

I don’t believe they can rely on just flipping the switch and suddenly competing when the season begins.

But is that the only alternative?

Seems to me that the normal way to approach preseason is to make a real showing of it in games 2 and 3, then turn game 4 into a glorified scrimmage.

Fisher does not game plan games 1 and 2, and instead uses them to see players under certain conditions. Get some film on them.

He then gameplans a little for game 3, and takes game 4 seriously–he uses it the way most teams use game 3.

If all that’s true, and I think it is, then, we’re worrying over nothing.

They intended all along to rehearse the starters more in game 3 and then use game 4 to do the same thing.

Fisher on all this:

This is the time you typically continue to evaluate the bottom half of your roster

…that’s the one key thing that you look at, it’s the matchup, the 1-on-1 matchups and the athletic abilities as you’re evaluating the younger players.”

there’s no urgency as far as that’s concerned. We look at it from an individual standpoint across the board and look at every player. Although you want to win games, it’s important, you want to play well and be productive and score points. I think the thing that’s most important is just the individual improvement

…opening day in the National Football League is a lot different than preseason games from a standpoint of what you do.As long as, in our eyes, we’re continuing to do those things well on the practice field and we elect not to do those things in the game – there’s not a sense of urgency.

Looks to me that, among other things, they’re trying to grade players and rank the best 53. (Which in turn allows them to decide whether they keep 5 safeties or 10 OL…that kind of thing…plus it helps them decide if a potential waiver pick-up is better than their 53rd player, etc.)

An example of caring more about individual performance and improvement than team concepts:

(On if he’s concerned about the run game)
“Well we haven’t necessarily worked against those types of things we saw yesterday.”

In fact they were willing to just see what happened with guys:

“The young offensive line struggled in the fourth quarter. We move (T Sean) Hooey from right tackle to left tackle. He had not played in a game there before and he had his hands full. He graded out very well at right tackle when he was in the game. So, those are the kind of things that you look at.”

They don’t just wait for week 1 to flip a switch. But they do approach pre-season game 2 differently from most teams. But then, the Fisher way is (and has been) to step it up in games 3 and 4 in terms of team concepts and gameplanning and so on.

August 18, 2014 at 11:30 am #4309

rfl
Participant

Fisher does not game plan games 1 and 2, and instead uses them to see players under certain conditions. Get some film on them.

He then gameplans a little for game 3, and takes game 4 seriously–he uses it the way most teams use game 3.

If all that’s true, and I think it is, then, we’re worrying over nothing.

Well, I think I’m worrying more than others are. I find that remarkable, by the way. The lack of concern here.

Look, what the hell do I know? Not a helluva lot. They might turn it on according to a plan that concedes the early PS games. They might be fine.

But what I am seeing right now is a growing gap between the THEORY that they will have a 1st rate defense and the reality of what they’re showing on the field. I mean, it’s a big, big gap. Both fans and Ram spokesmen attribute it to missing personnel, playing vanilla, looking at individuals, yadda, yadda, yadda.

Meanwhile, the teams we play are also sitting guys, looking at individuals, and limiting their game planning, and they look a helluva lot better than we do.

And I don’t see how these excuses can offset the fact that our run defense just completely stinks. The unit has shown NOTHING, no competitiveness at all. I cannot reconcile that with some theory of how we’re going top suddenly become not just a good, capable defense, but an elite one.

I mean, that’s what we’ve all been imagining, right? That’s what pundits have been saying. We were good last year–with Williams and some young talent we’ll likely be Top 10, maybe Top 5. The theory of a superb defense is what has driven all these rosy prognostications despite the toughness of our division.

And in 2 PS games, we have seen NOTHING indicating the likelihood of this defense being special. I mean, teams do ratchet up from PS a few slots. I can fairly easily imagine them raising their game from what we are seeing to being average or just above. What I cannot see is a defense looking this bad through 2 games suddenly becoming elite. I see no signs whatsoever of it.

The gap between theory and reality is wide and depressing. I think if we’re being honest, we have to acknowledge that. And, frankly, I don’t think that what I am saying is essentially a case of worrying or fretting. I think it’s describing what we are seeing and acknowledging the huge challenge that our defense will face raising their game from bottom tier–the way they’re playing now–to the elite levels we need to compete in our division.

To be even more honest, I get tired of excuses. Just listened to Demoff repeating the excuse so frequently trotted out by fans and pundits alike: “Well, we were facing Aaron Rogers in a no huddle with no game plan … it isn’t surprising that …” Blah, blah, blah. Aaron Rogers and the GB offense are good. So are AZ and SEA and SF. So are numbers of other offenses, including DEN, whom we must face this year. That’s what competition in the NFL means–facing superb offenses. If we want to be anything better than mediocre we have to start manning up to deal with opponents like Aaron Rogers in the no huddle. As long as we are using the quality of the opponent as an excuse, then we ain’t competing as contenders do.

I mean, OK. Maybe they have a plan for games 1 and 2 and then 3 & 4. Maybe they are conceding things. What the hell do I know?

But I don’t want to hear from the Ram FO that Aaron Rogers is good and we’re looking at individuals and … reach for air sick bag. I want to hear the truth from them.

I want to hear them say, “Conceding the run the way we are doing is A) unacceptable and B) subversive of any ability to defend or to win games. There are perhaps some reasons for understanding the way things are going right now, but we MUST TURN THIS AROUND and do so quickly and drastically. We cannot compete with this level of performance.” Admit the truth. Take responsibility for turning things around.

You know, like many on the board, I’ve been watching the NFL for half a century. I’ve seen hundreds of good defenses. I’ve seen how HARD it generally is to run the football in this league. I’ve seen hundreds of middle of the pack teams take pride in stuffing the running game. It’s a basic, entry-level competency, like a singer hitting notes on pitch. I’ve seen–in person–Jeff Fisher bring his Titans to Macomb for camp scrimmages and PS games to make life impossible for our GSOT running game. Any NFL defense with decent personnel, a competent scheme, and pride can squeeze the run is not stuff it completely. You don’t have to be elite to do it. And, in terms of the PS, the defense is SUPPOSED to be ahead of offenses. It’s SUPPOSED to be even harder to run in PS games than in the regular season.

I have never seen an elite defense that couldn’t stop the run.

Yet for over a decade now, I have watched the Rams lie down and die facing RBs, many of them no more than mediocre. Coaches, players, and schemes have come and gone, and year after year one constant remains: lousy run defense. I’m tired of it. I’m not interested in excuses or theories about how it’s going to get better the stars align in the heavens.

Show me some guts, Rams. Show me some pride. Stop a damn running play. Set out a stall claiming simple COMPETENCE. And until you show it, don’t expect me to hold my breath looking for a winning year.

By virtue of the absurd ...

August 18, 2014 at 11:51 am #4310
rfl
Participant
Fisher on all this:

This is the time you typically continue to evaluate the bottom half of your roster

…that’s the one key thing that you look at, it’s the matchup, the 1-on-1 matchups and the athletic abilities as you’re evaluating the younger players.”

there’s no urgency as far as that’s concerned. We look at it from an individual standpoint across the board and look at every player. Although you want to win games, it’s important, you want to play well and be productive and score points. I think the thing that’s most important is just the individual improvement

…opening day in the National Football League is a lot different than preseason games from a standpoint of what you do.As long as, in our eyes, we’re continuing to do those things well on the practice field and we elect not to do those things in the game – there’s not a sense of urgency.

Yadda, yadda, yadda.

I dunno what to say about this.

I do know that last year, we pulled a 1st game out of the hat and then sucked for 4 games, putting us in a hole we could never climb out of. I do know that the return to respectability last year required turning the ship around not only running the ball, but also defensively. What we put out there the 1st month was NOT competitive. The PS approach did not prepare us for the season.

You know, Mike Martz used to be criticized for not preparing his team for the season. But he went 6-0 like 3 times in a row.

Meanwhile, Fisher’s approach to the PS has not yet prepared us to compete and contend at the beginning of the season. Last, given what we saw the team do later in the season, we should have been better on both sides of the ball from the off. We could easily have gone, say, 3-1 and been in contention for the year. Instead, We go 1-4 or whatever and then Fisher gets credit for his big psychological trick of re-starting the year. OK. It helped and we ended up kind of OK. But after the 1st month, we were out of contention, another lost year confirmed.

I can’t sit here and say that all of this was because of Fisher’s approach to the PS. But you know it’s damn hard for me not to feel strongly that there is at least some correlation.

This team has talent and shows flashes. But it isn’t right yet. It isn’t clicking. It has not drawn itself together and made a statement that opponents need to pay attention to.

I mean, can you imagine SEA or SF looking at film from our 1st 2 games and not laughing?

The fact is, we are STILL playing SOSAR football. Still. The whole point of being the SOSARs is that you might show some flashes, but you’re really not ready to compete with the grown up men. Fisher has not changed that yet. He didn’t change it last year. So far, we see no signs that he has changed it this PS.

I’ll believe we have left SOSAR meekness behind when I see it. And I’ll believe in Fisher’s approach to the PS when we start out 4-0 or 3-1.
- This reply was modified 10 years, 3 months ago by rfl.
By virtue of the absurd ...
August 18, 2014 at 11:53 am #4312

PA Ram
Participant

It’s a sort of sloppiness I’d like them to clean up. Yes–they aren’t sure where to be right now(at least the young guys)they aren’t scheming for teams, they aren’t even going 100 percent. But the one thing that bothers me is sloppiness. Sloppy tackling. That’s fundamentals stuff. On that first Lacy run they missed 4 tackles! That can’t happen. They need to clean that up. On the other hand, the Packers did not miss tackles. Even when a Ram had space, when the Packer player got there they wrapped up and ended the play.

That has to be fixed.

"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick

August 18, 2014 at 12:56 pm #4313

Isiah58
Participant

I think Fisher has been around this league far too long to feel like he “needs” to do anything, and from his press conference tomorrow he certainly doesn’t seem like someone who is the least bit concerned with what has happened thus far. I doubt that he cares one bit about the hand-wringing that goes on here, and he knows that almost nothing that has gone on in PS games 1 & 2 has any carry-over to September.

I suppose you people also think SF is going to go 0-16 and get outscored 24 – 456 this season? That’s what they are projected to do after two preseason games. Maybe the Rams are laughing at THEIR film?

I think that Fisher has a six week plan to get the team ready for September 7th, and he doesn’t care what happens on August 23rd. And none of us will care what happens on August 23 if the Rams come out and win game 1. While it may make you sleep better to have them win next week, in the grand scheme of things it means nothing.

And I respectfully disagree that the Rams have looked any sloppier than all of the other teams. I have watched every team play at least one preseason game, and the level of play for all of the teams are comparable at this point. Every fan base in the NFL right now is complaining about missed tackles, and every fan base is fretting over perceived deficiencies culled from watching the starters play about 10 minutes of preseason ball. The Rams are not unique in this manner.

“Marge, don't discourage the boy! Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals! Except the weasel.” - Homer Simpson

August 18, 2014 at 1:25 pm #4314

zn
Moderator

This team has talent and shows flashes. But it isn’t right yet. It isn’t clicking. It has not drawn itself together and made a statement that opponents need to pay attention to.

Nor do I think they intend to do that, or even think it’s necessary in the summer.

If they come out of the gate losing games we think they should have won, I will absolutely come around to that POV. Right now, my view is, they’re just not doing what we would like them to, they’re doing different things. At least in P-s games one and two.

So all that’s happening now, I think, is that some of us are taking sides in the eternal yin-yang debate over pre-season and how to count it.

Well, for me, it gets down to one of my favorite quotations from the Coen Brothers. It’s from Raising Arizona: “There’s what’s right and there’s what’s right, and never the twain shall meet.”

August 18, 2014 at 4:33 pm #4327

wv
Participant

zn wrote:

Well, for me, it gets down to one of my favorite quotations from the Coen Brothers. It’s from Raising Arizona: “There’s what’s right and there’s what’s right, and never the twain shall meet.”

I dunno. I was thinking it was more like the Coen brothers remake
of the story of Job :

w
v

August 18, 2014 at 4:44 pm #4328

zn
Moderator

wv wrote:

Well, for me, it gets down to one of my favorite quotations from the Coen Brothers. It’s from Raising Arizona: “There’s what’s right and there’s what’s right, and never the twain shall meet.”

I dunno. I was thinking it was more like the Coen brothers remake
of the story of Job
w
v

A man doesn’t tell another man which Coen Brothers film he means to quote.

Dammit, I mean, if a man knows anything, he knows which Coen brothers film he means to quote.

August 18, 2014 at 7:37 pm #4338

InvaderRam
Moderator

i really don’t know that “turning it on” in the preseason will have any bearing on the regular season.

if they suck, they will suck in the regular season.

having said that. i would like the rams to have some of their regular starters back for the browns game and see an improvement in run blocking and run defense.

August 18, 2014 at 9:10 pm #4345
InvaderRam
Moderator
I think Fisher has been around this league far too long to feel like he “needs” to do anything, and from his press conference tomorrow he certainly doesn’t seem like someone who is the least bit concerned with what has happened thus far. I doubt that he cares one bit about the hand-wringing that goes on here, and he knows that almost nothing that has gone on in PS games 1 & 2 has any carry-over to September.
I suppose you people also think SF is going to go 0-16 and get outscored 24 – 456 this season? That’s what they are projected to do after two preseason games. Maybe the Rams are laughing at THEIR film?

I think that Fisher has a six week plan to get the team ready for September 7th, and he doesn’t care what happens on August 23rd. And none of us will care what happens on August 23 if the Rams come out and win game 1. While it may make you sleep better to have them win next week, in the grand scheme of things it means nothing.

And I respectfully disagree that the Rams have looked any sloppier than all of the other teams. I have watched every team play at least one preseason game, and the level of play for all of the teams are comparable at this point. Every fan base in the NFL right now is complaining about missed tackles, and every fan base is fretting over perceived deficiencies culled from watching the starters play about 10 minutes of preseason ball. The Rams are not unique in this manner.

i think you’re right. and you know. i was complaining too about how ugly the game was on saturday. but upon reflection. this is what happens when you’re trying to limit contact to a minimum. and you’re trying to save your body for the real season.

so i’ll try and save my griping for when the games count.
- This reply was modified 10 years, 3 months ago by InvaderRam.
August 18, 2014 at 10:59 pm #4354

Winnbrad
Participant

I’m not worried about these preseason games. Their purpose is to evaluate who to cut, and who to keep.

Bradford looks good. Britt, if he can stay out pf prison, could be a big time playmaker. That’s something this team hasn’t had at receiver for a long time. Quick seems to be stepping up. And if Austin can make plays on special teams, or on offense, so much the better.

We know what Cook gives us, when he makes the effort. And we know Kendricks is a keeper.

Stacy and Cunningham are the backs, and I’m thrilled with that.

The D-line is excellent.

After that, keep the O-line healthy, try to cut down on penalties, and no more stupid suspensions (I’m looking at you Bailey).

Oh, and don’t turn the ball over. Ever. For the entire season.

All that matters now is beating the @#$% out of the Vikings.
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