Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Rams Huddle › Local Sportswriters and the R word
- This topic has 15 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated 10 years ago by zn.
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December 5, 2014 at 3:26 pm #13153wvParticipant
I saw this bit by BM. I always wince when i see the R-word.
Its all over this article.Anyway, i wonder what Burwell thought about the R-word?
Anyone know?Also, does anyone konw if any of the local St.Louis
reporters have refused to use the R-word ?Also, I’m interested in which National reporters
wont use the word anymore. So far, i only know about
Peter King, but I’m gonna google it, fwiw, and I’ll
add onto this post with any names i come across.
Just somethin I’m curious about; i know
not everyone iz.(obviously, this can be moved to the other
board. I keep forgetting where the R-word
posts go.)w
v
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Bernie Bit: Redskins will honor Bryan Burwell
• Bernie Miklasz[www.stltoday.com]
Good morning from Atlanta …
Washington Redskins VP Tony Wyllie texted late last night to inform me of the team’s plans to honor late Post-Dispatch sports columnist Bryan Burwell at Sunday’s Rams-Redskins game at FedEx Field. Washington will leave a seat in the press box empty and mark the spot with Burwell’s name.
And there are plans to have a moment of silence for Burwell, who died of cancer Thursday morning at age 59.
Leaving a seat open for a fallen sportswriter may not seem like a big deal, but in our business it’s considered a special honor — and greatly appreciated by the scribes and broadcasters.
Because of his illness Burwell had been unable to attend the Rams’ last two home games, the wins over Denver and Oakland. Bryan has an assigned seat in the Dome press box, but no sports writer or media person sat there during the last two games. We tried to keep it open as a gesture of respect to our beloved teammate.
This is a classy gesture by the Redskins. Bryan grew up near Washington D.C. and followed the team during his childhood. I know this would mean a lot to him.
I’m not surprised by the Redskins’ kindness here. Wyllie worked in the Rams media-relations department for several years in the mid-late 1990s. During his time here Wyllie was a terrific professional who treated the STL sports media with respect. Wyllie was friendly with Burwell and understands the depth of love and respect that our profession has for Bryan.
On behalf of the Post-Dispatch and STLtoday sports staff, I’d like to thank Washington owner Dan Snyder, our friend Wyllie and the Redskins organization for being so thoughtful. It means a lot to us during this difficult time.
We’d also like to thank the St. Louis sports teams, especially coach Jeff Fisher and the Rams, who have been so gracious in the aftermath of Bryan’s passing.
I’d suggest that the pressbox at the Edward Jones Dome be named in Burwell’s honor — better yet, let’s wait to do it at the new St. Louis football stadium that Burwell pushed for over the past few years.
Thanks for reading …
— Bernie
December 5, 2014 at 3:52 pm #13156wvParticipant========================
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/06/19/philadelphia-buffalo-writers-vow-to-stop-using-redskins-in-print/
… Tim Graham, the former ESPN.com writer who again is part of the Buffalo News’s sports department. Graham wrote a lengthy piece earlier this month, explaining his view. “I’m not out to change the world or the NFL or what you believe,” he began. “My plan is to change me and how I operate. Beyond the period at the end of this sentence, I intend never to use the word redskin again.”
—————–http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/06/19/philadelphia-buffalo-writers-vow-to-stop-using-redskins-in-print/
… Philadelphia Daily News sports columnist John Smallwood, who grew up in the Maryland suburbs and has been writing about sports for 25 years. He said he was inspired by Graham’s piece to make his own stand.
Instead of the official nickname, I will refer to the team as Washington, Washington’s football team, the ‘Skins, the R’s or some other reference. It won’t be hard, but it could potentially make life on deadline a bit more troublesome for the copy editors if higher-ups don’t agree with my stance and decide it is not my place to make personal policy a part of the newspaper. Still, I won’t write it.”——————————
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/dc-sports-bog/wp/2013/06/19/philadelphia-buffalo-writers-vow-to-stop-using-redskins-in-print/
—————————–http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/blogs/citydesk/2012/10/18/hail-to-the-pigskins/
In October, Washington City Paper editors decided that publication would henceforth refer to the team as the Pigskins.——————
http://dcist.com/2013/02/we_are_very_proud_to_omit_the_name.php
In February, DCist announced it would refer to the Redskins as “the Washington football team…or some variation.”
——————————–
The Kansas City Star has had a policy for several years of usually working around the team nickname.
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http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19920218&slug=1476314
(in 1992) The Oregonian no longer prints the nicknames of teams like the Cleveland Indians, the Atlanta Braves or the Washington Redskins. It is the first U.S. newspaper to adopt such a policy.
“Names are only a small part of it,” said Managing Editor Peter Thompson yesterday, following Sunday’s announcement of the change.
“American Indians seem to be clearly saying they’re a race of people and not a bunch of mascots and their rituals and their religion should not be mocked as part of sports fervor in sports arenas across the nation.”—————————-
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/13/AR2006011301863.htmlThe Seattle Times, honoring its 15-year policy of keeping Indian nicknames out of headlines and captions, allowed its writers to use the Redskins nickname only on first reference. All other references must read “Washington.”
…”But I’m dreading them coming,” said Joe, a member of the Swinomish tribe, which resides about 70 miles north of Seattle. “I really don’t want to hear how their nickname honors us.
“It’s like we’re slipping back in time. The fans with the war paint on their faces, the feathers, the bad costumes — I mean, don’t they know how that looks and makes us feel?” …
==============December 5, 2014 at 3:52 pm #13157joemadParticipantthis link has a vid on Burwell thoughts on Washington’s team name….
BTW, when Washington played SF a few weeks back in SC, there was protests out side the stadium.
Burwell a Washingtonian, and fan of the team, no longer used the team name.
- This reply was modified 10 years ago by joemad.
December 5, 2014 at 3:57 pm #13160wvParticipantDecember 6, 2014 at 12:37 am #13192znhaterBlockedThis is just getting ridiculous. I thought this was a football forum?
December 6, 2014 at 12:47 am #13193znModeratorThis is just getting ridiculous. I thought this was a football forum?
It is. And on most Rams boards, the Washington team name issue isn’t permitted. Here, so far…and who knows how long…we have kept it on the football forum because we think people can discuss it and differ in a civil way. It’s one of the things the board takes pride in…we just don’t have conflicts like that. Looking at it from that perspective, arguably, controversies are part of the NFL and so controversies over a team’s name can be seen as part of discussing the NFL (same as, for example, players and domestic abuse).
Still, some issues just might be too volatile. Is this one of them? I know we (as a group) have been back n forth. Previously, months ago, the posters at the buzz voted that all politically charged issues should be off the football board. But then, there was a kind of change on the new huddle, and the thought was, it could work on the football board.
But if people want this moved to the other forum (“The Public House”) then, that’s how we’ll do it.
I am open to any decision the posters themselves make.
Discuss?
December 6, 2014 at 1:26 am #13196znhaterBlockedIt’s just to me this should be a non issue. No one minded calling them the redskins for all those years. And now, some people who aren’t even Indian thinks it’s offensive. Hell, Snyder even had some native Americans in the booth with him sporting redskins gear a couple of weeks ago.
People that say “the r word” or the “Washington team” are just adding fuel to the fire imo. It’s only derogatory if used that way, and in 44 years of living i have never used it or heard it used that way. My grams was full blooded Cherokee and i never heard get say anything about a redskin or say that it offended her. Just my 2 cents worth.
December 6, 2014 at 10:38 am #13206nittany ramModeratorIt’s just to me this should be a non issue.
That’s fine. As long as you acknowledge that there are a myriad of opinions on this subject that are equally as valid as the ‘non-issue’ viewpoint. Some of us find the term Redskin to be self evidently offensive due to its historical connotation. Yeah there are native Americans who don’t really care about the word but there are also native Americans and others who are offended by it and their opinions have to count for something too, right?
December 6, 2014 at 11:12 am #13208znModeratorRams4life wrote:
It’s just to me this should be a non issue.That’s fine. As long as you acknowledge that there are a myriad of opinions on this subject that are equally as valid as the ‘non-issue’ viewpoint. Some of us find the term Redskin to be self evidently offensive due to its historical connotation. Yeah there are native Americans who don’t really care about the word but there are also native Americans and others who are offended by it and their opinions have to count for something too, right?
The question remains, is this too political a subject to be on the football forum?
As you know, this community has gone back and forth on that.
December 6, 2014 at 11:37 am #13210nittany ramModeratornittany ram wrote:
Rams4life wrote:
It’s just to me this should be a non issue.That’s fine. As long as you acknowledge that there are a myriad of opinions on this subject that are equally as valid as the ‘non-issue’ viewpoint. Some of us find the term Redskin to be self evidently offensive due to its historical connotation. Yeah there are native Americans who don’t really care about the word but there are also native Americans and others who are offended by it and their opinions have to count for something too, right?
The question remains, is this too political a subject to be on the football forum?
As you know, this community has gone back and forth on that.
Well, even though it’s imcredibly controverial it is a football topic. So in that sense it should be fair game here. But I also know what has happened on past boards when things got political so…
I dunno. I’ll be fine with it if you move it to the public forum.December 6, 2014 at 12:11 pm #13214ZooeyModeratorThe issue isn’t currently creating any ill will, let alone dividing the board.
Back to the topic: I did not know that the disuse of the name was official for ANY newspaper or media outlet. I thought only a handful of people had chosen to disuse it.
There are a couple of papers in the Pacific Northwest that quit using the term 15 – 20 years ago (and other Indian nicknames), long before the issue became a national topic of conversation in the past decade. Interesting.
December 6, 2014 at 2:09 pm #13228rflParticipantIt’s just to me this should be a non issue. No one minded calling them the redskins for all those years. And now, some people who aren’t even Indian thinks it’s offensive. Hell, Snyder even had some native Americans in the booth with him sporting redskins gear a couple of weeks ago.
People that say “the r word” or the “Washington team” are just adding fuel to the fire imo. It’s only derogatory if used that way, and in 44 years of living i have never used it or heard it used that way. My grams was full blooded Cherokee and i never heard get say anything about a redskin or say that it offended her. Just my 2 cents worth.
I’ll just point this out.
In the mainstream world of the American majority … no one minded the name for decades. Not on the surface. Not in mainstream public discourse.
That is a long way away from saying that “no one minded.” What bothers minorities is virtually always invisible to majorities … until the minorities are allowed to express themselves. Indeed until they learn HOW to express themselves. Generally, when that begins to happen, the majority is shocked. “Where has all this come from?” And it instinctively trivializes disaffection and alienation expressed by the minority. “Suddenly everyone is taking offense at these little things that don’t matter. Non-issues.”
Well, they’re not non-issues to the minority. Or, at least, to significant members of the minority. There will of course always be diversity of response. Snyder can certainly find individual Native Americans willing to express an affirming reaction. That’s fine. They can do that.
It doesn’t change the fact that many Native Americans feel quite differently about it. Indeed, it doesn’t change the fact that many AMERICANS feel differently about it. Many members of the mainstream are offended. I am. WV is. Apparently, significant numbers of professional journalists are, so much so that they are changing their behavior.
It is an issue, a significant issue, because many Americans feel it is a significant issue. You are perfectly free to feel personally that it shouldn’t be. Your experience may tell you that it would be a non-issue to certain individuals you know. But for many Americans, it is a highly significant issue. And they are free to feel that.
What one cannot honestly do is to say that, since it didn’t pop up in mainstream discourse previously, it was never a matter for anyone. That’s like saying that, because we never hear on mainstream media or common conversation about how Sikhs or Basques or Innuits or Tagalogs or stamp collectors or train spotters or Hmongs or calligraphers or chess players feel that their concerns are non-issues.
American society changed significantly in the mid-1960s. It did not stop being racist. Issues of prejudice and discrimination were not eliminated. But something changed.
What happened was quite simply that minorities discovered that they could speak up for their perspective. That’s the biggest difference between now and a time in which a fictional North Carolina town called Mayberry could simply erase all the black faces from its streets. It simply isn’t easy any more to silence the voices of those who take offense at being disrespected and alienated by the mainstream. They don’t suffer in silence any more.
What that means is that, as the decades roll by, sources of suffering which had long remained invisible, “non-issues” to the mainstream get brought forward so that their seriousness has to be dealt with. The suppressed non-issue becomes perceived as the issue it always was.
Again, you can decide if you wish that this should not be so. But you can’t say it has never been an issue or that the thousands of Americans who feel it is an issue don’t have every bit as much right to tell you when they’re pissed off. And guess what–Native Americans have a LOT of good reason to be pissed off! Hell, I’m pissed off with them.
By virtue of the absurd ...
December 9, 2014 at 12:33 pm #13484December 9, 2014 at 3:21 pm #13502DakParticipant<div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Rams4life wrote:</div>
It’s just to me this should be a non issue. No one minded calling them the redskins for all those years. And now, some people who aren’t even Indian thinks it’s offensive. Hell, Snyder even had some native Americans in the booth with him sporting redskins gear a couple of weeks ago.People that say “the r word” or the “Washington team” are just adding fuel to the fire imo. It’s only derogatory if used that way, and in 44 years of living i have never used it or heard it used that way. My grams was full blooded Cherokee and i never heard get say anything about a redskin or say that it offended her. Just my 2 cents worth.
I’ll just point this out.
In the mainstream world of the American majority … no one minded the name for decades. Not on the surface. Not in mainstream public discourse.
That is a long way away from saying that “no one minded.” What bothers minorities is virtually always invisible to majorities … until the minorities are allowed to express themselves. Indeed until they learn HOW to express themselves. Generally, when that begins to happen, the majority is shocked. “Where has all this come from?” And it instinctively trivializes disaffection and alienation expressed by the minority. “Suddenly everyone is taking offense at these little things that don’t matter. Non-issues.”
Well, they’re not non-issues to the minority. Or, at least, to significant members of the minority. There will of course always be diversity of response. Snyder can certainly find individual Native Americans willing to express an affirming reaction. That’s fine. They can do that.
It doesn’t change the fact that many Native Americans feel quite differently about it. Indeed, it doesn’t change the fact that many AMERICANS feel differently about it. Many members of the mainstream are offended. I am. WV is. Apparently, significant numbers of professional journalists are, so much so that they are changing their behavior.
It is an issue, a significant issue, because many Americans feel it is a significant issue. You are perfectly free to feel personally that it shouldn’t be. Your experience may tell you that it would be a non-issue to certain individuals you know. But for many Americans, it is a highly significant issue. And they are free to feel that.
What one cannot honestly do is to say that, since it didn’t pop up in mainstream discourse previously, it was never a matter for anyone. That’s like saying that, because we never hear on mainstream media or common conversation about how Sikhs or Basques or Innuits or Tagalogs or stamp collectors or train spotters or Hmongs or calligraphers or chess players feel that their concerns are non-issues.
American society changed significantly in the mid-1960s. It did not stop being racist. Issues of prejudice and discrimination were not eliminated. But something changed.
What happened was quite simply that minorities discovered that they could speak up for their perspective. That’s the biggest difference between now and a time in which a fictional North Carolina town called Mayberry could simply erase all the black faces from its streets. It simply isn’t easy any more to silence the voices of those who take offense at being disrespected and alienated by the mainstream. They don’t suffer in silence any more.
What that means is that, as the decades roll by, sources of suffering which had long remained invisible, “non-issues” to the mainstream get brought forward so that their seriousness has to be dealt with. The suppressed non-issue becomes perceived as the issue it always was.
Again, you can decide if you wish that this should not be so. But you can’t say it has never been an issue or that the thousands of Americans who feel it is an issue don’t have every bit as much right to tell you when they’re pissed off. And guess what–Native Americans have a LOT of good reason to be pissed off! Hell, I’m pissed off with them.
That pretty much crystallizes my thoughts.
My personal feeling is that once I knew about the controversy, I wanted to learn more. And, I hope that Washington changes its names to something else. But, because they have such a strong brand that resonates with long-time fans, that’s more important to Daniel Snyder.
I also wish more Americans would look more deeply into issues that are bothering marginalized Americans just to understand the WHY and HOW the issue is a problem, and to open a discussion. And, that’s my biggest wish: That Americans could have open, civil discussions about controversial subjects. I’m proud of this board for having those discussions. So, I’m OK with this topic staying on the football board.
December 9, 2014 at 11:52 pm #13530znhaterBlockedThis has officially become a political post. Time to move it i think.
December 10, 2014 at 12:05 am #13538znModeratorThis has officially become a political post. Time to move it i think.
I think you’re right…there were several posts in a row that did not even mention the Washington team name issue, and were more about race fractures in the USA today.
For the time being I compromised, and moved those posts to a new thread in the Public House forum. It actually reads as a free-standing, coherent, distinct and separate thread. —>
http://theramshuddle.com/topic/race-issues-depressing/
What remains is at least about the Washington team name issue. It is still an open question whether that belongs on this board or the Public Forum.
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