Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Rams Huddle › Kroenke ready to show detailed stadium plans … plus other relocation things
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March 22, 2015 at 2:02 pm #21246PA RamParticipant
http://www.latimes.com/sports/nfl/la-sp-nfl-stadium-inglewood-20150322-column.html
Stan Kroenke won’t be empty handed this week when he arrives at the NFL owners meetings in Arizona.
The St. Louis Rams owner will be packing finished schematic plans for the world’s most interactive and integrated football stadium, a futuristic, $1.86-billion, privately financed venue proposed for the Hollywood Park site in Inglewood.
Kroenke is not quite ready to put a shovel in the ground, but the major pieces of the project are now fully drawn, allowing the global sports and real estate billionaire to show the small army of architects and engineers at his disposal have made significant progress.
Representatives of Kroenke and HKS, the architecture firm he’s employed, met with the Los Angeles Times recently in San Francisco to provide a first look at the detailed plans.
The timing of the meeting — days before the NFL convenes Monday at the Arizona Biltmore resort — wasn’t coincidental. The league’s owners will ultimately decide when and where the nation’s No. 1 sport returns to its No. 2 market.
The San Diego Chargers and Oakland Raiders entered the running last month, announcing a joint proposal to build a stadium in Carson. Kroenke hasn’t said he plans to move the Rams, but his intentions seem clear — analysts say it’s highly doubtful he would invest in a stadium and not use it for his own team.
Any NFL franchise that wants to move would need the support of three-quarters of the league’s 32 owners in a vote. It’s unlikely any such vote will take place before the fall, as St. Louis, San Diego and Oakland continue trying to convince their teams to stay put. The league has already said no team would be allowed to move before next season.
The latest renderings show a light metallic, wave-shaped structure featuring a roof that encompasses the stadium and a surrounding plaza, providing weather protection but remaining open on the sides. The stadium could host big indoor events such as a college basketball Final Four.
The roof has metal borders, but the area over the playing field is made of a transparent material called ETFE, which is as clear as a car windshield and strong enough to support the weight of a vehicle. The design allows for breezes to flow through the building, enhancing the outdoor feel.
“This stadium grows out of the DNA of the region,” said Mark Williams, director of sports and entertainment business development for HKS, which designed AT&T Stadium for the Dallas Cowboys and Lucas Oil Stadium for the Indianapolis Colts.
While the roof of the Inglewood stadium would be 275 feet above the playing field, the building would be set into the ground, giving it an above-ground profile of 175 feet, considerably lower than most enclosed stadiums. The proposed venue conforms to the height restrictions imposed on buildings within close proximity to Los Angeles International Airport, and the stadium designers say it also makes for a more attractive neighbor.
“So many stadiums are a big building that’s out in a field somewhere,” said Chris Meany, senior vice president of the Hollywood Park Land Co. “Very few have been integrated into the community.”
Los Angeles has seen impressive renderings before, but hasn’t had an NFL football team since 1994. Over the last two decades, several developers have unveiled all kinds of dazzling drawings and slick video presentations of venues that never came to pass.
What makes Kroenke different is that he is an NFL owner, and the league’s second-richest owner at that. His team also has a deep and nostalgic connection to L.A., and he — along with development partner San Francisco-based Stockbridge Capital Group — has nearly 300 acres of prime stadium land the league itself tried to buy.
HKS estimates the Inglewood project would take less than three years to build, and the first round of construction permits could be obtained by December. Any team relocating here probably would play at the Coliseum or Rose Bowl during the building process.
HKS and its consultants are moving into the design development and construction documentation stages of the project. In essence, the group has basic designs in place, including the various building components such as plumbing and air conditioning, and is now onto developing the detailed building plans.
Why does a Southern California stadium need a roof? Aside from the fact an enclosed venue can play host to a wider range of events, a covering gives Kroenke the ability to create the world’s biggest billboard, one visible to the more than 35 million travelers who fly into and out of L.A. each year. Images or animations could be projected onto the roof, instead of being permanent fixtures. Plans call for a sail-shaped roof structure that’s twice as big as the stadium and shelters the football field, the adjacent 6,000-seat performing arts venue and the “Champions Plaza” in between. HKS is studying perforated metal panels and the mottled shadow patterns those cast on the ground like sunlight through a tree. The playing surface would be artificial turf.
Built to share
Kroenke doesn’t need to partner with another team to finance the stadium, but the NFL sees L.A. as a two-team market and wants venues to be capable of hosting both. The Inglewood plan is two-team compliant, which means it has two home locker rooms, identical sets of office space, and two owners’ suites. Whereas the Carson proposal is based on the Chargers and Raiders simultaneously relocating, it is widely believed Kroenke does not want to share the market with another NFL team right away, and, because he would be assuming the risk of the stadium by himself, would want to reap the benefits of getting his team up and running as L.A.’s sole franchise.
All sides approach
HKS describes the stadium as “four-sided,” which means the venue is accessible and approachable to the public from 360 degrees. There would be no fenced-off areas at ground level such as loading docks, mechanical yards, dumpsters and the like. That would all be below ground and accessible via tunnels located near the stadium. VIP, event-level parking could also be accessed through the tunnels. Counting the underground and surface parking, 9,000 spaces would be dedicated to the stadium alone, with others in the nearby office and retail buildings. Backers of the Inglewood stadium estimate they would need a total of about 21,000 spaces for an NFL game, and say there would be roughly 45,000 spaces within a mile of the stadium on game days.
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
March 22, 2015 at 3:55 pm #21247ZooeyModeratorArtificial turf in Los Angeles.
Count me out.
March 22, 2015 at 5:14 pm #21248wvParticipantMarch 22, 2015 at 6:04 pm #21251bnwBlockedKroenke isn’t a purist he’s a businessman. Artificial turf is cheap and cost effective. If he moves I hope his team is the same.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
March 22, 2015 at 6:15 pm #21252PA RamParticipantIan Rapoport @RapSheet 56s56 seconds ago
Giants owner John Mara says he thinks there will be one or two teams in LA next year. Which teams? Not sure.I’m not sure that’s NEWS but whatever.
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
March 22, 2015 at 6:47 pm #21255ZooeyModeratorIan Rapoport @RapSheet 56s56 seconds ago
Giants owner John Mara says he thinks there will be one or two teams in LA next year. Which teams? Not sure.I’m not sure that’s NEWS but whatever.
The time is now.
I don’t think anybody thinks otherwise. LA is getting a team or two.
March 22, 2015 at 7:10 pm #21258PA RamParticipantI wonder if there will be some sort of “deal” between Spanos and Kroenke where they share the stadium and Oakland’s Davis gets dumped.
Lots of drama to come.
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
March 22, 2015 at 7:27 pm #21261InvaderRamModeratorrams move to la in 2016. chargers move at a later date.
and it sounds like oakland is making progress toward a new stadium.
March 22, 2015 at 7:39 pm #21262wvParticipantKroenke isn’t a purist he’s a businessman. Artificial turf is cheap and cost effective. If he moves I hope his team is the same.
You know you ‘could’ be a Nomad
fan like a lot of us. I live in WV; I
doubt if i ever see the Rams play live.
I dont mind.w
vMarch 22, 2015 at 8:42 pm #21265bnwBlockedI understand but that is not me. When Bidwill flew the coop while bashing St. Louis fans I didn’t watch the NFL for 7 years and delighted in the news of his failure in Phoenix that lasted 20 years. I became a reluctant Rams fan as I really wanted an expansion team and believe to this day the Jags should have been the St. Louis Stallions and this crap wouldn’t be happening today. No doubt the NFL brass thinks so too.
I find it obscene that a billionaire demands the public fund their stadium again after only 20 years then says he will privately finance a much more expensive stadium elsewhere? Busch II was 40 years old and the Arena was at least 70 years old. Such huge investments shouldn’t be treated as disposable. The publicly owned Packers still play fine in Lambeau Field.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
March 22, 2015 at 8:43 pm #21266znModeratorVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
However, Kroenke is a master card player who won’t show cards until he absolutely has to #Rams #Raiders #ChargersVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
At the risk of upsetting L.A. #Rams fans, #NFL has level of confidence St. Louis will figure it out. Don’t think Kroenke will go rogueVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
#NFL officials also concerned whether Oakland/Alameda leaders up to task #Raiders #Rams #ChargersVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
#NFL officials wary of Coliseum City project in hands of real estate developer. Feel stadium is secondary to rest of development #RaidersVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
By the way, sense I get talking to folks here, a lot of skepticism on Oakland Coliseum City project #Raiders #Rams #ChargersVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
Update:Teams already updated Grubman. He will update owners tomorrow. #Raiders #Rams #Chargers will issue new update at May meetingsVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
BTW, Eric Grubman described L.A.situation as “high tension” #Chargers #Rams #RaidersVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
Grubman will then update rest of #NFL owners. As he told me a few minutes ago, smiling: “I’ll be on the hot seat” #Rams #Raiders #ChargrersVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
Little housekeeping: #Raiders, #Chargers and #Rams will update #NFL point man Eric Grubman on home/Los Angeles situations on Monday morningVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
Also some Save the Bolts (#Chargers) fans here in PhoenixVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
Los Angeles #Rams out in force at #NFL owners meetings Phoenix, trying to convince owners belong in Los AngelesVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
#Chargers update will include continued questions/concerns on how SD stadium task force plans to make up $500 to $600 million funding gapVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
#Changers #Raiders presentation will include updates on Carson, Oakland and San Diego #NFLVincent Bonsignore @DailyNewsVinny
Bigger story to come but I’m hearing #Changers #Raiders to present a joint stadium update to #NFL this week at owners meetingsMarch 22, 2015 at 9:38 pm #21267znModeratorAlbert Breer @AlbertBreer ·
On Monday, the NFL will provide an update to clubs on LA. The Rams, Chargers and Raiders won’t present their respective LA projects.
When questions come, clubs will be free to answer. But it’s more likely the league will answer LA questions, clubs on their home markets.
NFL’s dilemma now: The Rams have the strongest project. They’re also the least qualified of the 3 to move, by NFL’s relocation criteria.
At least in the short term, the likely outcome is 2 (not 3) teams in South California. So either 2 in LA, or 1 in San Diego and 1 in LA.
NFL is working to set up April visits to San Diego, Oakland and St. Louis. League is doing its own market assessment on those 3 cities.
There are about 10-12 possible scenarios that could play out. 1 interesting one: Rams to LA; Raiders to StL; SD stays put for time being.
If that scenario played out, Rams would get head start, Raiders get fresh start, Chargers set a deadline for SD to get stadium done.
NFL is in a good spot in regards to LA. Competing projects = Better projects. Good likelihood, as Mara said, there’s a team there in ’16.
Among the things NFL pays attention to — A club’s popularity in LA. Per LA Times polling, Rams win that one
We won’t get answers this week. But at this point, those involved believe there’s a good chance things crystallize on LA in Oct or Nov.
Dodger Stadium remains under consideration, along with the Coliseum and Rose Bowl, as a potential temp NFL home
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March 22, 2015 at 10:18 pm #21268znModeratorNFL official: Los Angeles situation is “High tension”
by Vincent Bonsignore
http://www.insidesocal.com/nfl/2015/03/22/nfl-official-los-angeles-situation-is-high-tension/
PHOENIX – The lush, manicured landscape and desert oasis ambiance of the luxurious Arizona hotel the National Football League has gathered this week seems like a curious place to stage a game of demolition derby.
On the other hand, considering the hundreds of millions of dollars resting in the outcome, the opulence and indulgence offers the ideal setting for such a greedy, high-stakes competition to decide what NFL will land the golden goose known formally as the vacant Los Angeles market.
“High tension,” is how NFL vice president Eric Grubman described situation.
He should know. As the league point man on relocation to Los Angeles and retaining teams in their current markets, Grubman will stand before league owners tomorrow to deliver updates on the quagmire that Los Angeles is becoming.
That means bringing owners up to date on what’s going on with the Raiders and Chargers fights to get new stadiums in Oakland and San Diego – the league seems skeptical of either getting it done – and their partnership in a shared stadium in Carson.
In addition to giving updates on the Rams situation in St. Louis and owner Stan Kroenke’s plan to build a stadium on the old Hollywood Park race track in Inglewood.
Presumably to be the new home for the Rams.
Unless Missouri steps up with a plan to keep them in St. Louis – something the NFL has a noticeable level of confidence in, despite the uphill climb squeezing public money out of cities and states these days.
Or maybe in spite of that plan, if Kroenke’s wish is to simply move to Los Angeles.
“Stan will turn his card over when he has to,” Grubman said, not sure himself what Kroenke’s end game is.
Grubman doesn’t believe owners would OK Kroenke walking away from $500 million in public assistance. And he doesn’t think Kroenke would disobey them by going rogue.
Although he isn’t 100 percent certain.
No one is.
Kroenke holds all the cards at the moment.
What we do know is, St. Louis, Oakland and San Diego essentially have until the end of 2015 to put together approved stadium plans.
If not, their teams are fee to file for relocation to Los Angeles beginning January 1.
All of which should make for an interesting Monday for Grubman, who will tell owners Kroenke’s Inglewood project is entitled and ready to be built and that the Chargers and Raiders are on target for an approved Carson project by May.
But that St. Louis, Oakland and San Diego remain quite a distance from figuring out their situations.“I’ll be on the hot seat,” he said, wearing a wry smile.
It doesn’t have to be this way. With just a little bit of common sense and a tad bit of decency we can pave a much smoother road back to Los Angeles.
And in the process, avoid the ugly bloodletting we’ll witness over the next six or seven months in which the Rams, Raiders and Chargers are pitted against each other while far too much time, energy, rhetoric and money will be spent deciding an outcome.But then, that would mean the NFL actually being in front of the process rather than playing catch up.
As one league official told me on Sunday, that would contradict just about everything that’s happened during the league’s feeble two-decade long march back to the City of Angels.
Culminating with the ugly situation we now face in which three of the league’s 32 teams – or roughly 10 percent of the NFL – have become lame ducks in their home markets and all three are officially attached to a pair of competing stadium plans in the Los Angeles area.
With one owner – Kroenke – essentially a step ahead of everyone, including the league.
“It’s been 20 years of pretty much unrelenting incompetence by the NFL in the LA market,” the league official said.
Unless the league takes control between now and the end of the calendar year, it’s likely to get much worse.
“The question is, who really believes the NFL knows what it’s doing at this point regarding L.A?,” a league official asked.
Grubman will stand before the owners Monday hoping to shed some light on things.
The reality is, the 20-year mess the NFL has made of Los Angeles is headed to a fascinating finish.
And maybe even an ugly one.
March 22, 2015 at 10:49 pm #21269InvaderRamModeratorso is accommodating 2 teams in the stadium something kroenke is doing on his own or was that something that was said to him by the league?
i’m guessing it was grubman who told him to include that.
March 22, 2015 at 11:00 pm #21270InvaderRamModeratorsome more pictures.
March 23, 2015 at 4:28 am #21280znModeratorI understand but that is not me. When Bidwill flew the coop while bashing St. Louis fans I didn’t watch the NFL for 7 years and delighted in the news of his failure in Phoenix that lasted 20 years. I became a reluctant Rams fan as I really wanted an expansion team and believe to this day the Jags should have been the St. Louis Stallions and this crap wouldn’t be happening today. No doubt the NFL brass thinks so too.
I find it obscene that a billionaire demands the public fund their stadium again after only 20 years then says he will privately finance a much more expensive stadium elsewhere? Busch II was 40 years old and the Arena was at least 70 years old. Such huge investments shouldn’t be treated as disposable. The publicly owned Packers still play fine in Lambeau Field.
But you’re part of the gang. You would have to at least check in. Or, the mods will be forced into extreme measures. Though I should explain—here, the way banning works, it means YOU CAN NEVER LEAVE.
(Watch the smiley, it morphs.)
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March 23, 2015 at 6:45 am #21281WinnbradParticipantIMO, Stan is moving this team to LA. I don’t know how long that process will take, or how he’ll do it, but it’s happening.
The NFL has no credibility at all on this issue. They have power, of course, but they haven’t had a team in LA in 20 years. Then along comes Stan, and now the rest of the owners are pitching in their 2 cents worth on every scrap of info that leaks or gets released.
I, personally, don’t care where the Rams play. But I think Stan does. And he seems to be a rather shrewd fellow.
March 23, 2015 at 8:21 am #21282wvParticipantI understand but that is not me. When Bidwill flew the coop while bashing St. Louis fans I didn’t watch the NFL for 7 years and delighted in the news of his failure in Phoenix that lasted 20 years. I became a reluctant Rams fan as I really wanted an expansion team and believe to this day the Jags should have been the St. Louis Stallions and this crap wouldn’t be happening today. No doubt the NFL brass thinks so too.
I find it obscene that a billionaire demands the public fund their stadium again after only 20 years then says he will privately finance a much more expensive stadium elsewhere? Busch II was 40 years old and the Arena was at least 70 years old. Such huge investments shouldn’t be treated as disposable. The publicly owned Packers still play fine in Lambeau Field.Ok, but i can tell you from personal experience,
its quite possible to loathe an Owner
and still like the ‘team.’
I loathed Carroll Rosenbloom.
And then I loathed Georgia F.
And now i loathe Kroenke.Owners tend to be loathsome.
w
v
Honore de Balzac (1799-1850): “Behind every great fortune is a crime.”March 23, 2015 at 9:45 am #21285bnwBlockedNo my friend liking the team is still supporting the owner. If you have no skin in the game then perhaps the mental charade seems clear cut? Most tax payers and PSL owners in St. Louis may think differently. I think zn posted the attendance figures for LA in the final years of the Rams and the final years of the Big Red in St. Louis and St. Louis substantially outdraws LA with a population a mere fraction the size of LA. The attendance in St. Louis over the past 10 years bears that out too. The NFL has no justifiable cause to let Kroenke carpetbag elsewhere.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
March 23, 2015 at 10:49 am #21287znModeratorI think zn posted the attendance figures for LA in the final years of the Rams and the final years of the Big Red in St. Louis
Wasn’t me. I don’t like doing attendance figures. You stand there and count, and then somewhere past 10,000 you forget what number you’re on and have to start over….
March 23, 2015 at 11:32 am #21293bnwBlockedI think zn posted the attendance figures for LA in the final years of the Rams and the final years of the Big Red in St. Louis
Wasn’t me. I don’t like doing attendance figures. You stand there and count, and then somewhere past 10,000 you forget what number you’re on and have to start over….
Or you vault over the turnstile when the ticket takers back is turned and watch the game at your 50 yard line seat and write down the announced attendance.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
March 23, 2015 at 11:38 am #21294wvParticipantNo my friend liking the team is still supporting the owner. If you have no skin in the game then perhaps the mental charade seems clear cut?…
Well, i suppose its a lot easier to support the team and not the owner
if you live in West Virginia. I mean, i dont spend any money on the team,
that would filter to the owner. Except maybe on NFL-Rewind.We can agree to disagree, i guess.
But i still say…if you give up on the Rams,
the TERRORISTS WIN !w
vMarch 23, 2015 at 11:39 am #21295znModeratorOr you vault over the turnstile when the ticket takers back is turned and watch the game at your 50 yard line seat and write down the announced attendance.
Yeah yeah right. College kids think they know everything.
March 23, 2015 at 2:46 pm #21314rflParticipant2 quick responses.
1) Stan is taking the Rams to LA. Nothing will beat that proposal.
2) The skylights look great … but, my Lord, in So Cal? What will be the energy costs of keeping that place cool?
Maybe there are geothermal solutions? I dunno. Looks energy-expensive, though.
By virtue of the absurd ...
March 23, 2015 at 3:06 pm #21317joemadParticipantartificial turf is a bummer….., but given that California is in it’s 4th straight year of drought, i’m ok with carpet for now…….
March 23, 2015 at 3:12 pm #21319wvParticipantartificial turf is a bummer…..,
but given that California is in it’s 4th straight year of drought,
i’m ok with carpet for now…….…I am old. I miss the days of cow-pasture fields
and manual score-boards where guys leaned out a window
and changed the score with a big cardboard number.And dont even get me started on all these
gizmos and gadgets you kids today are
carryin around…wv-luddite-ram
March 23, 2015 at 3:26 pm #21321HerzogParticipantIt looks great, but I dont’ get it. Open on the sides but covered on top with glass? so it’s an open air stadium with a roof that you can’t air condition? What am I missing?
March 23, 2015 at 4:37 pm #21323wvParticipantIt looks great, but I dont’ get it. Open on the sides but covered on top with glass? so it’s an open air stadium with a roof that you can’t air condition? What am I missing?
Well…just picture a stadium incorporating
all that Walmart stands for and all that Disney stands for,
and you will then get it.I bet they even screw up the ‘blue and white’ thing.
They’ll make the blue some sort of flashing neon-blue.w
vMarch 23, 2015 at 5:14 pm #21325ZooeyModeratorOn the bright side, this will NEVER happen again.
March 23, 2015 at 5:15 pm #21326ZooeyModeratorOn the bright side, this will NEVER happen again.
On the bright side, this will NEVER happen again.
Actually. Everything was right about that except the final score.
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