Jim Thomas seems a bit grumpy

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  • #20355
    PA Ram
    Participant

    Jim Thomas @jthom1 · 26m 26 minutes ago
    Pretty lame explanations by Snead and Fisher for why Bradford was traded.

    Jim Thomas @jthom1 · 24m 24 minutes ago
    Fisher said Bradford probably wouldn’t have been back even if he had agreed to paycut.

    Jim Thomas @jthom1 · 25m 25 minutes ago
    If that’s the case, why tell everyone how much Bradford means to the franchise for two months?

    Jim Thomas @jthom1 · 24m 24 minutes ago
    Not like there was some huge trade market for Foles and Rams had to disguise their intentions.

    Jim Thomas @jthom1 · 21m 21 minutes ago
    Wonder how that plays in locker room in terms of credibility issue? Heard some Rams players not happy with how whole Bradford thing handled.

    He REALLY just seems unhappy with this whole thing. I think he feels duped and doesn’t appreciate it.

    "Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick

    #20357
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    Jim Thomas @jthom1 ·

    Jim Thomas @jthom1 · 21m 21 minutes ago
    Wonder how that plays in locker room in terms of credibility issue? Heard some Rams players not happy with how whole Bradford thing handled.

    He REALLY just seems unhappy with this whole thing. I think he feels duped and doesn’t appreciate it.

    Yeah, he seems to be taking something personally, there.

    Bradford himself doesn’t seem to have a problem
    with the way it was handled.

    w
    v

    #20358
    Winnbrad
    Participant

    Well Jim did get duped. The Snishers have been saying, forever, how much they love Bradford. Then this happens, with not even a hint dropped beforehand. Jim probably feels like he got played a little. I don’t know. He’s a pro, though, and he knows the NFL is full of misinformation, and disinformation. Everybody gets fooled, once in a while.

    Regarding the trade, people can say whatever they want, but I still think Bradford would be on this team if he had taken a drastic pay cut, but with an incentive laden contract. Bradford and his agent didn’t want to do that. The Rams played the only hand they had left, trade him. That’s the teams only leverage, so they used it.

    IMO, the Rams made a good trade. We’ll see how it plays out.

    #20361
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    Well Jim did get duped. The Snishers have been saying, forever, how much they love Bradford. Then this happens, with not even a hint dropped beforehand. Jim probably feels like he got played a little. I don’t know. He’s a pro, though, and he knows the NFL is full of misinformation, and disinformation. Everybody gets fooled, once in a while.

    Regarding the trade, people can say whatever they want, but I still think Bradford would be on this team if he had taken a drastic pay cut, but with an incentive laden contract. Bradford and his agent didn’t want to do that. The Rams played the only hand they had left, trade him. That’s the teams only leverage, so they used it.

    IMO, the Rams made a good trade. We’ll see how it plays out.

    I always thought the paycut talk was utter nonsense.
    For the life of me, i saw no reason in the world
    why he would take a pay cut. It just seemed like fan-talk
    to me. Now i could see him getting an “extension” with
    lots of incentive clauses — but a “pay cut” — no way.
    Why would he do that?

    w
    v

    • This reply was modified 9 years, 9 months ago by Avatar photowv.
    #20363
    Winnbrad
    Participant

    I always thought the paycut talk was utter nonsense.
    For the life of me, i saw no reason in the world
    why he would take a pay cut. It just seemed like fan-talk
    to me. Now i could see him getting an “extension” with
    lots of incentive clauses — but a “pay cut” — no way.
    Why would he do that?

    w
    v

    I know. We talked about it before. I agree with you. There’s no reason for Bradford to do anything. He knows his own injury risk, and he’s got $13 million guaranteed, coming his way, no matter what. Sure Brady, Manning, etc., have renegotiated contracts to spread out the cap hit, but Bradford was in his final year, and he hasn’t been involved in a regular season game in a year and a half.

    I think money, the cap space, the draft picks, and the fact that the Rams got a starting QB in return, all caused the stars to align just right, and the Rams made the trade.

    Smart move, imo.

    • This reply was modified 9 years, 9 months ago by Winnbrad.
    #20366
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    I know. We talked about it before. I agree with you. There’s no reason for Bradford to do anything. He knows his own injury risk, and he’s got $13 million guaranteed, coming his way, no matter what. Sure Brady, Manning, etc., have renegotiated contracts to spread out the cap hit, but Bradford was in his final year, and he hasn’t been involved in a regular season game in a year and a half.

    I think money, the cap space, the draft picks, and the fact that the Rams got a starting QB in return, all caused the stars to align just right, and the Rams made the trade.

    Smart move, imo.

    This is my own Wild-Speculation. No evidence for it whatsoever,
    but i wonder if Bradford’s “leadership style” just
    didnt quite jive with Fisher. I dunno.

    w
    v

    #20375
    Avatar photoAgamemnon
    Participant

    I don’t especially think Fisher wanted to trade Bradford, but Bradford’s health concerns were holding the team hostage. No way could Fisher go into this season without at least a shot at having a QB. No other QB than Foles seemed to a decent alternative. Nobody would trade Bradford straight up for Foles. imo Then Bradford wouldn’t give the team any relief on his salary and the Eagles added the 2cd round choice, that made the deal the best thing for the team. To bad Fisher didn’t think enough of JT to let him in on it. 😉 It was an offer he couldn’t refuse and it was offer he wanted to take. Some of the players might miss Bradford. I doubt if the locker room has gone sour. I said what Winnbrad said.

    • This reply was modified 9 years, 9 months ago by Avatar photoAgamemnon.

    Agamemnon

    #20384
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    A few of us were talking about Thomas 2 or 3 weeks ago. I think he’s been souring on the Rams for a while. He can’t talk to Kroenke, and he’s not liking the stadium/LA/move stuff, and he posted the day before Bradford’s trade that he had a source he trusted inside the building tell him there was nothing going on with Foles.

    He isn’t happy.

    #20385
    Winnbrad
    Participant

    This is my own Wild-Speculation. No evidence for it whatsoever,
    but i wonder if Bradford’s “leadership style” just
    didnt quite jive with Fisher. I dunno.

    w
    v

    I don’t know. It’s a good question, though. Maybe Fisher wanted a more “firey” leader on the field/locker room. I don’t know. It’s certainly possible.

    So we could add that to the list of stars that aligned to make this deal happen. The Rams also got, from what I have read, a more intense guy in Foles.

    There. Speculation enhanced! That’s exactly what the interwebs are for! 🙂

    #20388
    Avatar photoAgamemnon
    Participant

    A few of us were talking about Thomas 2 or 3 weeks ago. I think he’s been souring on the Rams for a while. He can’t talk to Kroenke, and he’s not liking the stadium/LA/move stuff, and he posted the day before Bradford’s trade that he had a source he trusted inside the building tell him there was nothing going on with Foles.

    He isn’t happy.

    Is this bigger than when equipment manager got fired?

    Agamemnon

    #20391
    Avatar photonittany ram
    Moderator

    A few of us were talking about Thomas 2 or 3 weeks ago. I think he’s been souring on the Rams for a while. He can’t talk to Kroenke, and he’s not liking the stadium/LA/move stuff, and he posted the day before Bradford’s trade that he had a source he trusted inside the building tell him there was nothing going on with Foles.

    He isn’t happy.

    JT’s emotional slant has been evident in his writing ever since the ‘moving to LA’ rumors became more than rumors.

    He’s no Bernie but it’s getting to the point where you can tell when he is feeling slighted or has a personal stake in a subject.

    #20401
    Dak
    Participant

    Fisher said Bradford probably wouldn’t have been back even if he had agreed to paycut.

    I think this is the source of Fisher’s frustration. If we take that statement as truth, then the Rams were basically selling a line of bull the whole time. And, it’s like they were really in Bradford’s camp the whole time. Which is odd, because why wouldn’t you just stay quiet and give out signals that you were shopping Bradford. Maybe you get more offers.

    Or, the statement above is untrue.

    Maybe JT’s just tired of the bull crap. I could see that.

    • This reply was modified 9 years, 9 months ago by Dak.
    #20404
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator

    i bet chris long was one of the guys who wasn’t happy. he’s pretty good friends with sam.

    to jim it probably sucks having to cover a team that most likely won’t be there next season. and then on top of that they make him look a little foolish.

    #20405
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    I think this is the source of Fisher’s frustration. If we take that statement as truth, then the Rams were basically selling a line of bull the whole time. And, it’s like they were really in Bradford’s camp the whole time. Which is odd, because why wouldn’t you just stay quiet and give out signals that you were shopping Bradford. Maybe you get more offers.

    Or, the statement above is untrue.

    Maybe JT’s just tired of the bull crap. I could see that.

    You assume NFL executives rely on ESPN for their information about who’s on the market. They all know that PR is a separate thing. I think we can safely bet that there were few, if any, teams surprised by Bradford’s trade.

    #20406
    Dak
    Participant

    You assume NFL executives rely on ESPN for their information about who’s on the market. They all know that PR is a separate thing. I think we can safely bet that there were few, if any, teams surprised by Bradford’s trade.

    OK, then why lie about it to the local beat reporters? I can see JT’s frustrations.

    #20407
    bnw
    Blocked

    This is my own Wild-Speculation. No evidence for it whatsoever,
    but i wonder if Bradford’s “leadership style” just
    didnt quite jive with Fisher. I dunno.

    w
    v

    Some insight there. I think that is possible.

    The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.

    Sprinkles are for winners.

    #20408
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    I think I read somewhere that Foles is not much of a vocal leader, either.

    #20410
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    OK, then why lie about it to the local beat reporters? I can see JT’s frustrations.

    Because you don’t want rumors of Bradford’s trade being turned into a media circus. And the only way to control that is to control that. The moment it’s a shared secret, you cannot control how or where it is shared.

    #20477
    HighPlainsDrifter
    Participant

    I don’t think the notion of a “pay cut” on Bradford’s part was completely unreasonable. Bradford has collected a LOT of money from the Rams already. I’ve read it’s somewhere in the $65 million range. That may not be completely accurate, but I don’t find it too difficult to believe that it is somewhere not too far from that. That’s a lot of money for a relatively modest list of accomplishments, not to mention a knee that has now been reconstructed twice. Not all of this is Bradford’s fault, of course. But in a salary cap era, teams have to decide if production, both past and potential future, justify the contract. I believe that Foles possesses the same potential for future success that Bradford does. Certainly, Bradford is a substantial risk from a health standpoint. It wouldn’t be sufficient for the Rams to have the typical backup quarterback as insurance against this elevated risk. They need to have a quarterback who can start in the NFL and not experience the kind of fall off that they experienced with Hill and Davis. That, in itself, would cost a fair amount of money. I’m disappointed and a bit sad that the Bradford era in St. Louis is over without the mutual success that I think we all hoped for and expected. But the Rams were in a very difficult position at QB, and I think the Bradford trade was just a means of gaining a more “normal” situation going forward. I do not blame the Rams for wanting that. I do not blame Bradford for that. It’s just the way football plays out sometimes. Although it seems a bit of a reach given the franchises recent history, let’s hope that the Rams experience a rare streak of good fortune with Nick Foles.

    #20480
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    I don’t think the notion of a “pay cut” on Bradford’s part was completely unreasonable.

    It doesn’t matter how much he made. No one can name a single young starting qb in the history of the NFL who “took a paycut,” injured or not. It’s not done. Some older guys do it because they’ve made their money.

    In fact not just qb. I can’t think of any young player who ever did that.

    And besides, Fisher did say directly that the contract didn’t matter. It isn’t what decided things. He said directly that he still would have been traded if he had renegotiated, and that if the Rams did not get the offer they got, they would have lived with the contract.

    On the other hand I agree with this:

    I’m disappointed and a bit sad that the Bradford era in St. Louis is over without the mutual success that I think we all hoped for and expected.

    #20481
    sdram
    Participant

    I never thought a “Pay Cut” was going to happen. But, I did think a short term extension that gave Sam incentive money if healthy might work for him and the Rams would get short term cap relief and injury protection relief. His agent and Sam obviously didn’t think he “owed” the Rams any kind of a deal to stay in a Ram uniform such as what Manning did to stay in Denver. And, I really think they knew what QB market was for Sam.

    But, what do I really know about this? Sam and Fisher might have gotten sick of each other for who knows what reason. It appears that Snisher drew a line in the sand regarding Sam’s contract\injury assurance and Chip Kelly helped them out.

    So, again it seems like it’s all about the money.

    #20482
    HighPlainsDrifter
    Participant

    And besides, Fisher did say directly that the contract didn’t matter.

    That’s exactly my point in saying that the Rams were just seeking a more “normal” situation at QB. One that didn’t necessarily mean having a backup that represented a long term solution should Bradford go down again. And, for what it’s worth, I think roughly $65 million over four seasons might suggest that Bradford had “made his money”, and could’ve considered taking a bit less. I have read that Bradford, in fact, was willing to renegotiate. Don’t know the viability of that report, but there it is. I think the Rams just felt that it was time to move on from a very tenuous situation and the offer of Foles in making that a reality was just something that they couldn’t pass up.

    #20484
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    I think roughly $65 million over four seasons might suggest that Bradford had “made his money”, and could’ve considered taking a bit less.

    I never entertain sentiments like that. I don’t judge NFL players and their money that way. It’s not up to me what the market gives a player. I don’t tell them how much they are supposed to have before it’s not right. Bradford got his contract because he was the last #1 pick before the new CBA. That’s all I see and all I care about. In fact, ironically, if they HAD kept him, 16 M would have been a bargain for a young starting qb in his 6th year. Under the new CBA, players come up sooner, they don’t get 6 year deals. The young starting qbs coming up for their 2nd contracts after 4 years are getting 19 M (that’s the average the market is dictating, and Wilson is about to raise the avg.) That would mean that if Bradford played as a Ram–and I assume if he did he would have played well–he would have been getting less than Kaepernick or Dalton. In fact, that means he IS a bargain for the Eagles.

    I just think of all those things differently.

    .

    #20495
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    from off the net

    ===

    FrankenRam

    I don’t think it’s too hard to understand why JT might be a little miffed. As the local beat writer, I’m sure there have been more than a few times that he’s been told something by someone in the FO, be it Snead, Fisher, or Demoff, but was asked to keep it quiet for some period of time. And chances are he probably went along with their wishes rather than turning around and letting the cat of the bag in a column or chat.

    IF that’s an accurate assessment, he probably feels he had demonstrated he could be trusted by the org to not be a blabbermouth about every little tidbit thrown his way. And then to be as totally shut out of the Bradford trade rumors as us fans, I think I’d be a little miffed also.

    IMO, being a beat writer for any team in any sport is probably a bit of a PITA job these days. It’s their job to report what they know about the team, but yet they have to establish a relationship with the FO of that team, and the players, as well. And it would be difficult to build that relationship if you publicly disclosed every little tidbit that came out of someone’s mouth in the org.

    Interestingly enough, it sounds like Chip Kelly contacted Bob Stoops and at least one other Oklahoma coach about Bradford in the time leading up to the trade. And ya KNOW that had to get back to at least Sam at some point. So, perhaps JT could have done a little more digging along those lines and put 2&2 together rather than (apparently) being so reliant on his ‘insider’ status. But still, I could see him being upset at being treated like a complete outsider.

    #20521
    Avatar photoAgamemnon
    Participant

    The fact that JT isn’t a blabbermouth, doesn’t mean that the Rams are obligated to tell every news worthy thing they are doing. And the fact that they trust him on some things doesn’t mean that JT can’t find stuff out on his own. imo

    Agamemnon

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