Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Public House › Is Trump in trouble?
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wv.
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February 27, 2018 at 9:28 pm #83246wvParticipant
Hard to say given the opposition.
Trump voters speak.
February 27, 2018 at 9:49 pm #83249
JackPMillerParticipantI hope so. I want Trump impeached. I’m voting Kamala Harris in 2020. Just saying.
February 28, 2018 at 7:25 am #83253wvParticipantnewsweek:http://www.newsweek.com/trump-approval-states-rating-poll-805561
Trump’s Net Approval Rating Is Positive in Just 19 States, Half As Many As At the Start of His PresidencyAfter one year in office, President Donald Trump has a positive net approval rating in only 19 U.S. states, half as many as when he first took office in January 2017, according to the latest polling data.
While the Republican has seen a slight increase in overall net approval rating over the past several months, Trump’s work during his first year in office was widely panned by respondents, Morning Consult’s data from all 50 states released Tuesday showed.
Last month, Trump had a 44 percent approval and 51 percent disapproval rating among registered voters. Those numbers still represented a two-point increase in net approval rating—the difference between approval and disapproval ratings—in September and a four-point jump compared to October and November.
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But while Trump’s overall numbers may have improved recently, over the past year he’s lost support from more than a dozen states. When he first entered office in January 2017, Trump had a positive net approval rating in 38 U.S. states. West Virginia, Alabama, Kentucky, Tennessee and Wyoming led the pack, all with a net approval rating of at least 34 percent.
Trump managed to maintain those strongholds but has since seen his net approval drop across the country. Even in West Virginia, Trump went from a 37 percent net approval to 22 percent over 12 months. Similarly, Kentucky and Tennessee both went from 34 percent to 16 percent, while Alabama dropped from 36 percent to 29 percent.
Those drops weren’t the only bad news for the president. The number of respondents who strongly disapproved of Trump’s performance also climbed significantly. A year ago, 28 percent strongly disapproved of Trump, but last month that number had increased to 39 percent. Conversely, 27 percent strongly approved in January of last year, and now only 22 percent have the same feeling.
Still, Trump has managed to rally Republican support as 2018’s midterm elections draw closer. Last month, 48 percent of GOP voters strongly approved of Trump’s work, a significant increase from 43 percent in September.
The data was based on Morning Consult surveys taken between January 20, 2017, and January 29 of this year and drew responses from more than 800,000 voters from all 50 states.
February 28, 2018 at 7:34 am #83254wvParticipant“…Still, only 45% give the President a positive rating on handling the economy and almost three in five (58%) say the country is heading in the wrong direction.
Even worse for Mr. Trump, more voters overall say they are worse off financially today (43%) than say they are better off (35%). And the numbers who say that “having Donald Trump as President makes them pessimistic” are higher today than they were one year ago….”
February 28, 2018 at 10:00 am #83255
snowmanParticipantIt’s a political shitstorm out there and Trump is still in the White House. I think he stays there until he wants out, and his ego probably won’t permit him to just quit. I think he serves the full term and “retires” having made America great again, in his opinion.
February 28, 2018 at 10:37 am #83256
znModeratorI hope so. I want Trump impeached.
Him being in trouble in the polls has nothing to do with being impeached. Bad poll results don’t get you impeached.
February 28, 2018 at 11:08 am #83257
Billy_TParticipantI think this is abundantly clear — and it’s not hyperbole:
No politician in American history has gotten away with as much illegality, immorality, mendacity or personalized viciousness toward others as Trump has. Before and during his presidency. It’s not close. He “trumps” all other politicians in history for scandals, conflicts of interest, despicable words and deeds . . . . and that’s the case even if we put the Russia stuff over to one side and ignore it.
The sheer volume of his heinous words and deeds is, IMO, perversely a kind of advantage for him, as so many Americans, including media pundits, are overwhelmed by the onslaught and tune most of it out. Isolate individual things he or his associates have done, especially regarding business practices and sexual predations, and any one of them would normally be the downfall of a politician. But because Trump and associates produce these things almost daily, and sometimes several times a day, he’s still there. They’re still there.
There’s never been anything like this in our history, and I hope it never happens again.
February 28, 2018 at 11:13 am #83258znModeratorNo politician in American history has gotten away with as much illegality, immorality, mendacity or personalized viciousness toward others as Trump has.
I have to call my own number here. Early in election discussions, some people flirted with the idea that Trump wouldn’t be that much worse than any standard issue dem. My view was, he was going to be far far worse. By a huge margin. I think that’s exactly how it played out.
February 28, 2018 at 11:16 am #83259Billy_TParticipantIt’s a political shitstorm out there and Trump is still in the White House. I think he stays there until he wants out, and his ego probably won’t permit him to just quit. I think he serves the full term and “retires” having made America great again, in his opinion.
The wrench in the gears for that will be if the Dems take the House in November. IMO, if that happens, Trump will be impeached. The Senate, unless it, too, is taken over by the Dems, won’t vote to remove him. But I think the impeachment process will bring out so much Trumpian ugliness, he’ll be forced to step down by his own party.
And then there’s Mueller’s probe. If he’s allowed to continue and present his findings — and there’s no guarantee Trump will let him — Trump and his associates are toast. I have no doubt that Mueller has enough on Trump and company to send at least several more insiders to jail, while making it more than clear that Trump is a crook. While the precedents are pretty shaky regarding indicting a sitting president, I’m guessing that’s his firewall. So Trump probably avoids jail, but his presidency would be, for all intents and purposes, dead.
He’ll be forced out in that case. But it all depends on whether Trump fires Mueller, or somehow blocks the report. We know he tried to get rid of him last summer, and he’s done everything possible to obstruct the investigation, so that’s all still up in the air. But if Mueller gets to make his report . . . . the Trump presidency is dead in the water. I will gleefully rejoice and pour libations to the Goddess on that day.
February 28, 2018 at 11:25 am #83261Billy_TParticipantNo politician in American history has gotten away with as much illegality, immorality, mendacity or personalized viciousness toward others as Trump has.
I have to call my own number here. Early in election discussions, some people flirted with the idea that Trump wouldn’t be that much worse than any standard issue dem. My view was, he was going to be far far worse. By a huge margin. I think that’s exactly how it played out.
We agree, and agreed back then, too. Plus, it was always the case that electing Trump meant America also gets the Ayn Ryan/McConnell agenda. And that’s much worse than the centrist, mushy Dem agenda, which itself is much worse than what Sanders was pushing . . . . which, IMO, didn’t go far enough. It’s a sliding scale of horrors, the further to the right you go, basically.
In short, as annoying and disappointing as the Dems have been for decades, as cowardly, as corporatist, etc. etc. etc. . . . . and I don’t think there exists a leftist who proactively likes what they do . . . they’re still head and shoulders better than the GOP . . . and Trump’s part of that GOP, which is its Alt-Right edge . . . is the worst of the worst.
February 28, 2018 at 12:19 pm #83263wvParticipant< But I think the impeachment process will bring out so much Trumpian ugliness, he’ll be forced to step down by his own party.
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I’d bet the house against that ever happening. Trump step down because of Republican pressure, ugliness or whatever? Never. Ever. His nature is to fight, fight, fight. And then fight some more. His base will never leave him. Ever.
He’d fight impeachment to the end. And so would his base. He’s here for the duration of his term at the very least. Imho 🙂
I always keep in mind, fwiw, that it took actual TAPES for Nixon to be forced out. Nothin else mattered. It was only the existence of the tapes that did him in. He would have and could have stonewalled everything except for the tapes. Aint no tapes with Trump. Just witnesses sayin this or that. He’ll just disagree with them witnesses, play dum, turn it into a political circus, etc.
The upcoming Dem vs Rep elections will be interesting. Maybe the Reps will gain seats. Who knows. This country is a shit-stain country 🙂
w
vFebruary 28, 2018 at 12:30 pm #83264wvParticipantNo politician in American history has gotten away with as much illegality, immorality, mendacity or personalized viciousness toward others as Trump has.
I have to call my own number here. Early in election discussions, some people flirted with the idea that Trump wouldn’t be that much worse than any standard issue dem. My view was, he was going to be far far worse. By a huge margin. I think that’s exactly how it played out.
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Well, to me this is not an easy analysis or comparison. Because of foreign policy.
I agree totally Trump is the worst prez of my lifetime as far as domestic policies. He’s in a league all his own. And what makes it Beyond-Words, iz that he has the Senate, the House and the Courts. And we know what Chomsky called the Rep-party — something like “the most dangerous organization in the history of the world” or somethin like that.
His-AND-The-REPS domestic policies are gut-wrenchingly, heart-breakingly, heart-stoppingly, heart-stompingly, mind-numbingly deadly for the poor and the oppressed.
Its so bad i rarely even comment on Trump anymore. I mainly stick to his base and the voters in general. I’m more curious about ‘them’ because he is just too much for words.
But on the foreign policy things get tricky for me. ONE way to think about FB is to simply add up the murders. Who killed more in his first year? Nixon? LBJ? Obama? Trump? That gets a little tricky. For me, anyway. For me.
It also gets complicated because domestic environmental policies can kill people abroad…over time. Trumps hideous enviro policies may doom gazillions abroad over the next fifty years or so. So THAT might make him the worst ever. I dunno.
But so far, i would guess Nixon killed more Asians than Trump his killed abroad.w
vFebruary 28, 2018 at 12:37 pm #83266Billy_TParticipant< But I think the impeachment process will bring out so much Trumpian ugliness, he’ll be forced to step down by his own party.
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I’d bet the house against that ever happening. Trump step down because of Republican pressure, ugliness or whatever? Never. Ever. His nature is to fight, fight, fight. And then fight some more. His base will never leave him. Ever.
He’d fight impeachment to the end. And so would his base. He’s here for the duration of his term at the very least. Imho 🙂
I always keep in mind, fwiw, that it took actual TAPES for Nixon to be forced out. Nothin else mattered. It was only the existence of the tapes that did him in. He would have and could have stonewalled everything except for the tapes. Aint no tapes with Trump. Just witnesses sayin this or that. He’ll just disagree with them witnesses, play dum, turn it into a political circus, etc.
The upcoming Dem vs Rep elections will be interesting. Maybe the Reps will gain seats. Who knows. This country is a shit-stain country 🙂
w
vGood point about the tapes. They probably don’t exist regarding his business practices or damning stuff he’s done while in office.
Ironically, it’s long been rumored that there are tapes, far worse than the Access Hollywood tape, regarding his sexual predations and escapades. People who have worked with him on his TV shows say producers have the goods on Trump, but they happen to be his friends. They’ve either destroyed them or refuse to release them.
Bannon said Trump’s lawyers had to pay off hundreds of women, which sounds like hyperbole, but it’s likely at least dozens. What happens if those “agreements” start to unravel, like the one with Stormy Daniels and the Playmate?
Again, it just amazes me, the sheer volume of scandals, lies, nasty words and deeds, coming from this one person . . . and he seems to have gotten away with all of it . . . again, that’s not even counting the Russia stuff.
How long will his incredible luck hold out?
February 28, 2018 at 12:52 pm #83267Billy_TParticipantNo politician in American history has gotten away with as much illegality, immorality, mendacity or personalized viciousness toward others as Trump has.
I have to call my own number here. Early in election discussions, some people flirted with the idea that Trump wouldn’t be that much worse than any standard issue dem. My view was, he was going to be far far worse. By a huge margin. I think that’s exactly how it played out.
====================
Well, to me this is not an easy analysis or comparison. Because of foreign policy.
I agree totally Trump is the worst prez of my lifetime as far as domestic policies. He’s in a league all his own. And what makes it Beyond-Words, iz that he has the Senate, the House and the Courts. And we know what Chomsky called the Rep-party — something like “the most dangerous organization in the history of the world” or somethin like that.
His-AND-The-REPS domestic policies are gut-wrenchingly, heart-breakingly, heart-stoppingly, heart-stompingly, mind-numbingly deadly for the poor and the oppressed.
Its so bad i rarely even comment on Trump anymore. I mainly stick to his base and the voters in general. I’m more curious about ‘them’ because he is just too much for words.
But on the foreign policy things get tricky for me. ONE way to think about FB is to simply add up the murders. Who killed more in his first year? Nixon? LBJ? Obama? Trump? That gets a little tricky. For me, anyway. For me.
It also gets complicated because domestic environmental policies can kill people abroad…over time. Trumps hideous enviro policies may doom gazillions abroad over the next fifty years or so. So THAT might make him the worst ever. I dunno.
But so far, i would guess Nixon killed more Asians than Trump his killed abroad.w
vOn foreign policy: Trump didn’t inherit anything like the Vietnam War. So it’s not really an apple to apple comparison. But Nixon escalated the slaughter of the innocents mightily, and we have him on tape, talking to Kissinger, as if it meant nothing to him to kill hundreds of thousands. Which is what happened. Actually, far more than that.
But Trump has already killed more than Obama did in his eight years, according to an article I saw on Business Insider. So, first-year death totals probably go Nixon, LBJ, Trump and then Obama.
Plus, Trump nearly caused a nuclear war with North Korea, rattles his saber constantly against Iran, radically increased bombings and civilian deaths in Syria, radically increased drone strikes and new fronts in Africa. America has also fallen precipitously in world opinion since Trump took over. He gutted the State Department. We don’t have ambassadors in key places like South Korea. And he’s wildly increased defense spending and wants a major increase in our nuclear arms.
If anyone expected Trump to be a kind of Ron Paul on foreign affairs, he’s definitely proven to be quite the opposite. Trump is actually even worse than a neocon, cuz he’s quick to use military force (as they were), but taunts his opponents and says diplomacy is useless — except in the case of Russia.
Clinton was never going to be as bad on foreign affairs as Trump. Too hawkish, definitely. Too quick to push American capitalism down the throats of other nations. But Trump is worse.
February 28, 2018 at 3:32 pm #83277
joemadParticipantHe’s a fucking turd.
February 28, 2018 at 3:40 pm #83278wvParticipantBut Trump has already killed more than Obama did in his eight years, according to an article I saw on Business Insider. So, first-year death totals probably go Nixon, LBJ, Trump and then Obama.
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Ok, so if we are talking about flat-out Killing humans, then Trump is not even close to being the worst president. At least so far. Is that what we are saying?
w
v-
This reply was modified 6 years, 6 months ago by wv.
February 28, 2018 at 3:41 pm #83280wvParticipantFebruary 28, 2018 at 4:38 pm #83283Billy_TParticipantBut Trump has already killed more than Obama did in his eight years, according to an article I saw on Business Insider. So, first-year death totals probably go Nixon, LBJ, Trump and then Obama.
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Ok, so if we are talking about flat-out Killing humans, then Trump is not even close to being the worst president. At least so far. Is that what we are saying?
w
vJust to be clear, I suggested an order for just the four presidents you mentioned.
Beyond all of that, to me, it’s important to put any president in the context of what they inherit. Did they inherit wars, covert ops in the works, proposed coups in the works, known threats, imminent, likely threats and strong drum beats regarding threats that may have been total nonsense?
What did they do under the conditions they inherited? Did they escalate, deescalate, start new wars, end them, start or end torture programs, etc. etc.?
If we’re going to compare them, that context is vital, IMO.
February 28, 2018 at 4:45 pm #83285Billy_TParticipantSo a voter has to ask him or herself, prior to an election, will this person start new wars? Will they escalate or deescalate existing wars? Will they worsen existing relationships between nations, or improve them? What are their views regarding torture, black ops, rendition, the rules of engagement? What are their views regarding the use of diplomacy versus force? What are their views regarding cultural exchange, humanitarian missions, educational outreach and so on?
What is their general demeanor? Are they quick to go into a rage? Do they seem thoughtful, knowledgeable about the world? Do they know American and world history? Does their base appear to demand military solutions or diplomatic ones?
And so on . . .
February 28, 2018 at 9:04 pm #83294
ZooeyModeratorNo politician in American history has gotten away with as much illegality, immorality, mendacity or personalized viciousness toward others as Trump has.
I have to call my own number here. Early in election discussions, some people flirted with the idea that Trump wouldn’t be that much worse than any standard issue dem. My view was, he was going to be far far worse. By a huge margin. I think that’s exactly how it played out.
Yeah, but…that wasn’t the complete argument.
Speaking for myself (and ultimately I WOULD have voted for Clinton if California had been in single digits), I weighed not only who would be WORSE (clearly Trump), but what the likely long term voter outcome would be.
I.E. Trump was always going to be worse. No question. But he was always going to be THIS. What we are seeing. He was always going to be THIS bad. So bad that it is obvious to the entire nation that he is terrible.
VS.
Hillary. Who would have been less bad, but bad. Very bad. In all kinds of less obvious ways.
AND…
Americans are stupid. They make corrections by turning the other way. So the reaction to Trump was always going to be to pull the damn thing to the Left.
But a reaction against Hillary was going to be to pull it to the Right. And into the arms of some shithole like Pence. Or Marco fucking Rubio.
The question was…was it better to suffer bigly under Trump and hope for a hard correction to the Left…or suffer in lesser ways under Clinton and just continue to suffer with no possibility of moving to the Left of her?
And that wasn’t clear to me…although…as I said…I would voted for her if California had the least tiny chance of going to Trump.
But now I dunno. This country looks to me to be Pretty Pissed Off with Republicans right now. It wouldn’ta been this pissed with them if Hillary had won.
February 28, 2018 at 9:25 pm #83297znModeratorNo politician in American history has gotten away with as much illegality, immorality, mendacity or personalized viciousness toward others as Trump has.
I have to call my own number here. Early in election discussions, some people flirted with the idea that Trump wouldn’t be that much worse than any standard issue dem. My view was, he was going to be far far worse. By a huge margin. I think that’s exactly how it played out.
Yeah, but…that wasn’t the complete argument.
Speaking for myself (and ultimately I WOULD have voted for Clinton if California had been in single digits), I weighed not only who would be WORSE (clearly Trump), but what the likely long term voter outcome would be.
I.E. Trump was always going to be worse. No question. But he was always going to be THIS. What we are seeing. He was always going to be THIS bad. So bad that it is obvious to the entire nation that he is terrible.
VS.
Hillary. Who would have been less bad, but bad. Very bad. In all kinds of less obvious ways.
AND…
Americans are stupid. They make corrections by turning the other way. So the reaction to Trump was always going to be to pull the damn thing to the Left.
But a reaction against Hillary was going to be to pull it to the Right. And into the arms of some shithole like Pence. Or Marco fucking Rubio.
The question was…was it better to suffer bigly under Trump and hope for a hard correction to the Left…or suffer in lesser ways under Clinton and just continue to suffer with no possibility of moving to the Left of her?
And that wasn’t clear to me…although…as I said…I would voted for her if California had the least tiny chance of going to Trump.
But now I dunno. This country looks to me to be Pretty Pissed Off with Republicans right now. It wouldn’ta been this pissed with them if Hillary had won.
Not talking about who voted for whom or why. That’s a separate discussion IMO. I get that one.
Just saying, at one point, some of us entertained the idea that maybe Trump would not be as bad as people feared.
March 1, 2018 at 4:27 am #83302
Eternal RamnationParticipantToo many to quote but I disagree that Trump is clearly worse than Hillary would have been. I don’t think we’ll ever know but don’t forget she was for a no fly zone in Syria and Russia said if she was elected it was war. Don’t get me wrong Trump is worse than I imagined but Hillary is no garden variety dem , she’s a genius level Dr.Evil lawyer and had she got all that power there’d be no stopping her.Trump has exposed his newly adopted party for what it is. I am on rooting for the tipping point. No more business as usual . Something good could come out of it, meaningful change.
March 1, 2018 at 7:48 am #83304wvParticipant… I am on rooting for the tipping point. No more business as usual . Something good could come out of it….
=========================
So many of us have or have-had this thot/notion/idea/hope^^^
I’ve read this same idea from some many people. See the vid below. I set it up to run at the point where ‘this’ point is discussed…Fwiw.March 1, 2018 at 8:56 am #83307Billy_TParticipantToo many to quote but I disagree that Trump is clearly worse than Hillary would have been. I don’t think we’ll ever know but don’t forget she was for a no fly zone in Syria and Russia said if she was elected it was war. Don’t get me wrong Trump is worse than I imagined but Hillary is no garden variety dem , she’s a genius level Dr.Evil lawyer and had she got all that power there’d be no stopping her.Trump has exposed his newly adopted party for what it is. I am on rooting for the tipping point. No more business as usual . Something good could come out of it, meaningful change.
Personally, I think Clinton was just a garden-variety corporatist Dem, who, unfortunately, managed to convince enough powerful Dems it was “her turn” and was coronated before the primaries even began. I don’t see her as a “Doctor Evil” at all, and certainly not a genius. Just a typical Wall Street Dem, but more hawkish than most.
Just some dime-store psychology here, but I think MOST of that hawkishness comes from her being a woman, and feeling the need to be tougher than the next guy to avoid a whole range of gender-based critique.
Beyond all of that, if she had won the White House, the Republicans would have blocked her from doing pretty much anything, accelerating what they did to Obama . . . and I have no doubt they’d have umpteen investigations into her and likely try to impeach her, and early.
It would have been a mess.
IMHO, Trump was always going to be worse on all counts, in all areas. Perhaps the only benefit of his election is that it caused a major reaction, which would not have been there if Clinton had won. No women’s march. No metoo movement. Likely, no new gun safety push.
As you mention, no way to know, of course. But the above is just my guess.
March 1, 2018 at 9:00 am #83308Billy_TParticipantThe above said . . . she was a terrible candidate. I didn’t vote for her. I couldn’t vote for her. I don’t like the Clintons — at all.
She also ran a terrible campaign, was disliked, for good reason, by too many voters . . . and the Dems have hurt themselves tremendously for decades by basically turning their backs on the working class. Goes back to the early 1970s, at least.
Both parties suck, and have proven, time and time again, that they don’t deserve their power and should NOT be in control of government. But I think it’s abundantly clear that the GOP is worse. Much worse.
Two horrible choices. But one is much worse. Both need to go away.
March 1, 2018 at 10:53 am #83314ZooeyModeratorShe also ran a terrible campaign, was disliked, for good reason, by too many voters . . . and the Dems have hurt themselves tremendously for decades by basically turning their backs on the working class. Goes back to the early 1970s, at least.
I have often tried to escape this conclusion, but I can’t: I think Nixon was the last president who gave a rat’s ass about the working people in this country.
March 1, 2018 at 1:24 pm #83318wvParticipantNixon was the last president
who gave a rat’s ass about
the working people.============
Well.
I think if we are now missing Richard Nixon
these may not be the best of times.w
vMarch 1, 2018 at 2:38 pm #83321ZooeyModeratorNixon was the last president
who gave a rat’s ass about
the working people.============
Well.
I think if we are now missing Richard Nixon
these may not be the best of times.w
vIt’s a bit of a sobering thought, isn’t it? Since Nixon, it’s been about escalating the arms race and becoming the greatest imperial power in foreign affairs, and deregulating finance, weakening unions and the social safety net, and running up the score on Wall Street.
March 1, 2018 at 7:02 pm #83341wvParticipantIt’s a bit of a sobering thought, isn’t it? Since Nixon, it’s been about escalating the arms race and becoming the greatest imperial power in foreign affairs, and deregulating finance, weakening unions and the social safety net, and running up the score on Wall Street.
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