Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Public House › Happy Fourth of July
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July 4, 2016 at 8:37 am #47808nittany ramModerator
http://freethoughtblogs.com/pharyngula/2016/07/04/happy-fourth-of-july/#ixzz4DRVllR2E
Happy Fourth of July.
I grew up with the Vietnam war in the background. It wasn’t the hippies, or the protests, or the myth of people spitting on returning veterans that made me doubt my country: it was the National Guard raising their guns and firing into a crowd of students at Kent State. It was a duplicitous Richard Nixon resigning in disgrace. It was Henry Kissinger committing war crimes and being rewarded for it.
The Iranian hostage crisis was the dominant news item when I went off to college. It was wrong, and Iran’s descent into theocracy was a catastrophe. But what troubled me was my country’s long support for the tyrannical Shah of Iran, which had led to this crisis, the way Ronald Reagan stole credit for its resolution, and how that administration smoothly segued into total corruption, trading arms (can we stop doing that?) to Iran to shuffle money under the table to murderous right-wing killers in Nicaragua. It was Oliver North becoming the ‘brave’ face of American policy.
I’ve read the sanitized propaganda we’re given in public schools, and at the same time read the more complex histories. I hear about courageous pioneers bringing civilization west, and I read about Jeffrey Amherst and his genocidal plans, the rabble-rousing hatred that led to the massacre at Wounded Knee — and by the way, did you know that 20 medals of ‘honor’ were awarded for the murder of men, women (excuse me, ‘squaws’: wouldn’t want to humanize them), and children in that event? I lose all respect for the concept of honor. I am instructed in the heroics of the Civil War, and no one explains that the seeds of that brutality were sown in the cowardice of our noble Founding Fathers, who could talk a good game about liberty but but shied away from doing anything that might cost them some property, the human beings they owned as slaves. I had to learn on my own that we whipped around from a war to emancipate the slaves to an era of Manifest Destiny, in which plutocrats declared that they had a right to the lands of uncivilized yellow and brown people.
All my life I’ve been watching fools, criminals, and villains wrapping themselves up in their loud patriotism and being lauded for it. Do you wonder that I find flag and country tainted? Are you surprised that I find little cause to celebrate today? Do you think it’s all the fault of godless commies and leftie lies? No. It’s because the people who most thoroughly embrace that unthinking love of country do not love it for the high-minded principles stated at its founding: liberty and justice are nothing but words. They don’t love it for its past openness to immigrants; we no longer lift the lamp beside the golden door, we’re gonna build a Wall. Our Constitution isn’t about protecting our rights or guaranteeing equality, it’s about making sure everyone gets to own as many guns as they want.
This is what our independence day has become.
This should be our national day of mourning, a day we grieve at how the great has been betrayed by the petty.
- This topic was modified 8 years, 4 months ago by nittany ram.
July 4, 2016 at 8:44 am #47811Billy_TParticipantThanks, Nittany. Good article. That’s PZ Myers, correct? If memory serves, he’s really good on the topic of creationism versus evolution.
July 4, 2016 at 9:18 am #47813nittany ramModeratorThanks, Nittany. Good article. That’s PZ Myers, correct? If memory serves, he’s really good on the topic of creationism versus evolution.
Yeah, he’s a biology professor who is a leading figure in organized atheism, skepticism, feminism and social justice. He writes well and I usually agree with his opinions on stuff. He is not liked by many in the atheist community though. He often openly disagrees with the giants of organized atheism like Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris for their Islamophobic rantings and he attacks organized atheism for its anti-feminist leanings (there are a lot of MRAs and libertarians in movement atheism). So there is an angry rift between those that think the atheist community should embrace social justice causes and those who don’t.
- This reply was modified 8 years, 4 months ago by nittany ram.
July 4, 2016 at 9:31 am #47817PA RamParticipantTo be honest, I don’t see this great celebration of independence on the 4th anyway. I see most people looking at it as a day off from work–cookouts, getting drunk and lighting fireworks. I don’t think the majority of people give the history a second thought unless they’re posting an obligatory flag on Facebook to “prove” their patriotism. Then it’s off for a cold one and the grill.
The fact is, most people don’t care about the history good or bad.
“Murica!
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
July 4, 2016 at 9:33 am #47818bnwBlockedNoticed a lot of last minute blackberry picking here this morning. Lots of last minute blackberry cobbler to be baked today. From the lone hubby to grandpa and grandma with the grandkids picking high and low the blackberry picking is getting done. Not even mid season too. Lots of syrup to be made also.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
July 4, 2016 at 9:51 am #47821Billy_TParticipantNittany,
From your description of his stance versus people like Dawkins, whom I’ve read (The God Delusion), I’d side with Myers. Atheism should definitely be a part of the “social justice” movement, and embrace feminism and be against Islamophobia, etc. Seems like a slam dunk to me.
- This reply was modified 8 years, 4 months ago by Billy_T.
July 4, 2016 at 10:03 am #47827wvParticipantJeffrey Amhurst wiki
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeffery_Amherst,_1st_Baron_AmherstBiological warfare involving smallpox
One of the most infamous and well documented issues during Pontiac’s War was the use of biological warfare against the Native Americans. The suggestion was posed by Amherst himself in letters to Colonel Henry Bouquet.[20] Amherst, having learned that smallpox had broken out among the garrison at Fort Pitt, and after learning of the loss of his forts at Venango, Le Boeuf and Presqu’Isle, wrote to Colonel Bouquet:[21]
Could it not be contrived to send the small pox among the disaffected tribes of Indians? We must on this occasion use every stratagem in our power to reduce them.
Bouquet, who was already marching to relieve Fort Pitt, agreed with this suggestion in a postscript when he responded to Amherst just days later on 13 July 1763:[22]
P.S. I will try to inocculate [sic] the Indians by means of Blankets that may fall in their hands, taking care however not to get the disease myself. As it is pity to oppose good men against them, I wish we could make use of the Spaniard’s Method, and hunt them with English Dogs. Supported by Rangers, and some Light Horse, who would I think effectively extirpate or remove that Vermine.
In response, also in a postscript, Amherst replied:[22]
P.S. You will Do well to try to Innoculate [sic] the Indians by means of Blankets, as well as to try Every other method that can serve to Extirpate this Execrable Race. I should be very glad your Scheme for Hunting them Down by Dogs could take Effect, but England is at too great a Distance to think of that at present.
Historians Elizabeth Fenn and Benedict Kiernan have shown, “Fort Pitt had anticipated these orders. Reporting on parleys with Delaware chiefs on June 24, a trader [William Trent] wrote: ‘[We] gave them two Blankets and an Handkerchief out of the Small Pox Hospital. I hope it will have the desired effect.’ The military hospital records confirm that two blankets and handkerchiefs were ‘taken from people in the Hospital to Convey the Smallpox to the Indians.’ The fort commander paid for these items, which he certified ‘were had for the uses above mentioned.’ Historian Elizabeth Fenn has documented ‘the eruption of epidemic smallpox’ among Delaware and Shawnee Indians nearby, about the time the blankets were distributed.”[23][21]
[show]v t e
Seven Years’ War in North America: The French and Indian War, St. Lawrence and Mohawk theater
Amherst was summoned home, ostensibly so that he could be consulted on future military plans in North America, and was replaced pro tem as Commander-in-Chief, North America by Thomas Gage. Amherst expected to be praised for his conquest of Canada, however, once in London, he was instead asked to account for the recent Native American rebellion.[24] He was forced to defend his conduct, and faced complaints made by William Johnson and George Croghan, who lobbied the Board of Trade for his removal and permanent replacement by Gage. He was also severely criticised by military subordinates on both sides of the Atlantic.[25] Nevertheless, Amherst was promoted to lieutenant-general on 26 March 1765,[26] and became colonel of the 3rd Regiment of Foot in November 1768.[27]
On 26 March 1767 Jeffrey Amherst married Elizabeth, daughter of General George Cary (Joshua Reynolds, 1767)
Jeffrey Amherst, 1st Baron AmherstOn 22 October 1772, Amherst was appointed Lieutenant-General of the Ordnance,[28] and he soon gained the confidence of George III, who had initially hoped the position would go to a member of the Royal Family.[29] On 6 November 1772, he became a member of the Privy Council.[30]
American Revolutionary War
=================July 4, 2016 at 10:06 am #47828wvParticipantThanks, Nittany. Good article. That’s PZ Myers, correct? If memory serves, he’s really good on the topic of creationism versus evolution.
Yeah, he’s a biology professor who is a leading figure in organized atheism, skepticism, feminism and social justice. He writes well and I usually agree with his opinions on stuff. He is not liked by many in the atheist community though. He often openly disagrees with the giants of organized atheism like Richard Dawkins and Sam Harris for their Islamophobic rantings and he attacks organized atheism for its anti-feminist leanings (there are a lot of MRAs and libertarians in movement atheism). So there is an angry rift between those that think the atheist community should embrace social justice causes and those who don’t.
=============
Why would atheists be anti-feminist?w
vJuly 4, 2016 at 10:07 am #47829nittany ramModeratorNittany,
From your description of his stance versus people like Dawkins, whom I’ve read (The God Delusion), I’d side with Myers. Atheism should definitely be a part of the “social justice” movement, and embrace feminism and be against Islamophobia, etc. Seems like a slam dunk to me.
I like Dawkins as a science communicator, but beyond that I have little use for him. He is the embodiment of English ruling class privilege and his arrogance is intolerable.
July 4, 2016 at 10:11 am #47832nittany ramModeratorWhy would atheists be anti-feminist?
w
vThere is a contingent of MRAs (Men’s Rights Activists) in organized atheism. Most of them are neckbeards living in their parents’ basement but they are vocal.
July 4, 2016 at 11:28 am #47837znModeratorGetting the facts straight about the Founding Fathers
Invoking the Founding Fathers on Independence Day to celebrate our nation’s birth is a fine thing to do.
Invoking them to score political points? Watch out.
Take, for example, a Facebook post about Benjamin Franklin that circulated in May, a post that was actually aimed at making fun of tea party favorite Rep. Michele Bachmann, R-Minn. The meme quotes Bachmann as saying, “This country could use a president like Benjamin Franklin again.” Of course, Franklin was never president. And we think Bachmann knows that, as well, because she never actually said the quote. We rated the fabricated Facebook meme Pants on Fire.
It’s not just claims on social media. Pundits and politicians get things wrong time and time again when they use the Founding Fathers to support their political views. Over the years, PolitiFact has found numerous errors about what the Founding Fathers supposedly said or did, especially when it comes to constitutional issues and civil rights.
Talking about the First Amendment, radio host Bryan Fischer of American Family Radio said that “by the word ‘religion’ in the First Amendment, the founders meant Christianity.”
Our research and interviews with historians showed that the Founding Fathers pretty clearly meant all religion. For example, we found that both Benjamin Franklin and John Adams referred to Islam when discussing religious freedom, typically referring to Muslims as Mahometans. We rated the claim Pants on Fire.
On the other side of the political aisle, Keith Olbermann — at the time a commentator on the liberal network MSNBC — said that Adams as president signed the Treaty of Tripoli as an “outreach to Muslims.” That claim went too far. Olbermann downplayed the overriding purpose: to protect American ships from pirates that happened to be Muslim. We rated his statement Half True.
On the Second Amendment, we’ve looked into comments from U.S. Rep. Louie Gohmert, R-Texas, about George Washington. According to Gohmert, Washington said that a free people “should be an armed people. It ensures against the tyranny of the government.” We rated that claim False, because Washington was actually talking about developing a militia to protect the new nation — on behalf of the government, not against it.
Quite a few people have made claims about Washington’s commitment to Christianity. Talk show host Rush Limbaugh, for example, said, “You can’t read a speech by George Washington … without hearing him reference God.” In fact, several of his important speeches — such as his second inaugural address and annual message to Congress — didn’t mention God. We rated Limbaugh’s statement False.
In fact, Washington was not a particularly devout Christian. Rep. Duncan Hunter, R-Calif., once got a False from PolitiFact for saying, “Our first president and our first commander in chief prayed every day. He had a field manual of prayers.” Scholars say Washington was more of a deist than a Christian, and the book of prayers’ connection to Washington has been debunked.
We’ve also seen the Founding Fathers portrayed as fervent champions of the free market. In November 2010, Florida Gov.-elect Rick Scott said complaints about government regulations are “so old that Thomas Jefferson listed this problem among his charges against the King of England in the Declaration of Independence.” Scott correctly quoted Jefferson, but we found that Jefferson’s grievances in this case were directed at King George’s interference in the colonies, rather than government regulation in general. We rated that claim Half True.
The Declaration of Independence was adopted on July 4, 1776, but at least one former presidential candidate got it mixed up with the Constitution. Herman Cain said that “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” and “the right of the people to alter or abolish (the government)” were part of the Constitution. Both clauses are in the Declaration of Independence. We rated his statement False.
Other have claimed that President Barack Obama misquoted the Declaration of Independence. A political action committee called The Government is Not Good put out an advertisement that said Obama was the “only president in history who has deliberately removed the words ‘endowed by their Creator’ when referring to the Declaration of Independence.” However, Obama has used the phrase multiple times, and we found that former President Ronald Reagan left it out sometimes, too. We rated that claim False.
When PolitiFact named Obama’s claim that “if you like your health care plan, you can keep it” the Lie of the Year for 2013, a reader tweeted: ” ‘Half a truth is often a great lie.’ – Benjamin Franklin.” The reader accurately quoted Franklin, whose sayings on truth don’t end there. In his iconic text Poor Richard’s Almanack, Franklin also said, “A lie stands on one leg, a truth on two,” and, “When the wine enters, out goes the truth.”
July 4, 2016 at 11:51 am #47839bnwBlockedNoticed a lot of last minute blackberry picking here this morning. Lots of last minute blackberry cobbler to be baked today. From the lone hubby to grandpa and grandma with the grandkids picking high and low the blackberry picking is getting done. Not even mid season too. Lots of syrup to be made also.
Corn is coming in fast too. First planting was Mirai, second year seed. Over 90% germination. Well worth the price.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
July 4, 2016 at 12:31 pm #47848Billy_TParticipantCorn is coming in fast too. First planting was Mirai, second year seed. Over 90% germination. Well worth the price.
Are you a farmer? I respect that line of work a great deal. Small farmers, especially. Not that I have anything against really tall farmers. Or care about that one way or another.
;>)
Anyway, I wish America could go back to being a nation of small, family farms, self-employed artisans, craftspersons and direct producers.
July 4, 2016 at 1:39 pm #47853bnwBlockedCorn is coming in fast too. First planting was Mirai, second year seed. Over 90% germination. Well worth the price.
Are you a farmer? I respect that line of work a great deal. Small farmers, especially. Not that I have anything against really tall farmers. Or care about that one way or another.
;>)
Anyway, I wish America could go back to being a nation of small, family farms, self-employed artisans, craftspersons and direct producers.
I’ve always had a garden. Almost always raised beds. Other than chemical fertilizers no pesticides, herbicides, fungicides. Scratched it all out of nothing. Terrible soil to start with. Been working on it for 20 years. Over 30 fruit trees, grapes, thornless blackberries, asparagus, hops.
The upside to being a Rams fan is heartbreak.
Sprinkles are for winners.
July 4, 2016 at 1:55 pm #47855znModeratorScratched it all out of nothing. Terrible soil to start with. Been working on it for 20 years. Over 30 fruit trees, grapes, thornless blackberries, asparagus, hops.
Put up pics if you can.
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