Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Rams Huddle › Greg Robinson – Left Tackle, St. Louis Rams
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December 7, 2015 at 8:30 pm #35292AgamemnonParticipant
Greg Robinson – Left Tackle, St. Louis Rams
Greg Robinson could very well be the most physically gifted offensive linemen in the NFL. It’s obvious he possesses a true love for the game by the style in which he plays. In an era where many offensive linemen aren’t being heralded for their toughness or mean streaks, Greg Robinson approaches the game like a true throwback trench warrior.
Unfortunately, his physical prowess hasn’t yielded the performance threshold the St. Louis Rams were anticipating when they drafted him second overall in the 2014 NFL Draft. This reality has come as a surprise to many, but to those that appreciate offensive line as a craft, his struggles aren’t a shock.
Greg Robinson is merely a byproduct of the current football climate we live in. The proliferation of spread offenses throughout the collegiate ranks has stunted the development of the most coveted position in all of football. Spread offenses demand more from every single player on the field, except offensive line. The quarterbacks, defensive backs, defensive linemen and wide receivers are asked to know more and do more than ever before. On the other hand, offensive linemen are asked to know less and do less, thus are not developing the transferable skill sets required to play in the NFL. In reference to Greg’s collegiate offensive scheme, Paul Boudreau, the Rams offensive line coach, told Greg. A Bedard of Sports Illustrated, “They had four run plays and one protection – slide left, slide right. He didn’t have a snap count.”
We aren’t in a position to tell collegiate coaches what style of offense they should be running. The only possible solution to the perfect storm of inept offensive line play that has been created is to do what all great offensive linemen do very well, adapt. If a player like Greg Robinson who has off the chart measurable’s and a true desire to become the best player he can be can’t be “fixed” within this broken system of development, the game of football is in a ditch that may need to double as a grave.
The Block
StanceAll of Greg’s issues stem from his inconsistencies found in the stance. He’s playing in stance’s that are too narrow or too wide at times, his hips aren’t consistently square to the line of scrimmage and his left heel is off the ground (See Photo’s 1 & 2)
Inconsistent / Run Game
Greg’s narrow or too wide of a base (Feet Alignment) causes significant issues for him on run and passing plays. In the run game, his inconsistent base forces him to “lead with his knee” and “swoop” his left foot upon initial movement (see illustrations). These two mechanical flaws cause him to play with too much weight outside his frame and not distributed properly. This will explain why he is so easily thrown off front side base blocks. He plays too far outside of his landmark’s on the defender. Greg is either going to hit big or miss big because of this mechanical flaw. In regards to backside cutoff’s, his base doesn’t allow him to get his frontside hip as open as it should be. He does a very poor job on backside cutoffs, not because he can’t but because he isn’t in a position to effectively do so.
Inconsistent Base / Pass Protection
Greg has a problem that is called “under-stepping” (see illustration). During his pass set at about the second kick, you will notice how the left foot travels upfield. This happens because his narrow stance causes him to take too big of an initial kick. He’s trying to make up the difference by attempting to cover more ground than he needs to. This is where momentum takes over, that’s not a good thing. That subtle upfield movement by the left foot is his body trying to autocorrect itself at a high rate of speed. The idea of pass protection is for him to keep the left foot in a “catch” position, meaning at any given point he is ready to take on pressure. When the left foot travels upfield he develops a “soft hip” which shortens the edge for the pass rusher. Greg is ungodly strong but he isn’t able to utilize his full strength because of this issue. I akin this to building an oak stool that only has three legs. The wood is strong, it’s well built, but it has no base.
Hips not square to line of scrimmage
Greg isn’t consistent with keeping his hips square to the line of scrimmage (See photos above). If you pay close attention to his waistline or jersey numbers, you’ll see they slightly are turned towards the defender. This may seem to be a minor infraction but it’s a felony in the offensive line performance world. Greg loses the holy grail of offensive line play before the ball is even snapped, leverage. He has created a “soft edge” for the defender. When you couple this with his narrow base and the outlined problems created with it, his hips not being square compounds all of the issues.
Heel off the ground / Run & PassHere you’ll find the performance leak many offensive linemen suffer from. When the heel being off the ground is paired with the other noted problems, there’s gas thrown on the fire. Greg is constantly in a position where his outside knee leads all of his movement (See knee lead illustration). In the pass game this swinging action sets the stage for him turning way too soon during a pass set. In the run game, he loses control of his body because he’s playing under the influence of momentum and that’s illegal in this country. The body of an offensive lineman must always be in a position to fight pressure with pressure. The knee being inside the toe for as long as possible allows this to happen. There’s more musculature activated in this position and joints are more correctly aligned to be more stable.
Poor Hand UsageGreg Robinson has issues with his upper body as well. His hand placement in the run game is poor and in pass protection he punches himself “open” far too often. These issues are symptoms, they aren’t the ailment. The ailment is all that has been outlined. Offensive line play begins from the ground up! His hands will be fixed when his lower body is addressed. Investing time into working on his hands while ignoring the obvious issues below the waist is like putting a new paint job on a car with no wheels. It’s a poor investment.
Bottom Block
There’s nothing going on with Greg Robinson that can’t be fixed. I believe Greg can be one of the greatest offensive linemen to ever play in the NFL. I hear the notion that he’s not cut out to be a left tackle because he’s not “athletic” enough. If Andrew Whitworth is “athletic” enough to play left tackle in the NFL, Greg Robinson can. If he’s moved to guard without addressing the root issues, his career will be shortened. He will play guard as if he’s in a street fight, that’s a good and bad thing. The bad, it’s only a matter of time before something breaks. You can’t run away from bad mechanics. There needs to be more attention to detail in his understanding of how his body is supposed to work as an elite offensive lineman and to how it is prepared to perform at an elite level.
http://www.lbolineperformance.com/greg-robinson-block-report/
Go to the link to see example gifs. It is too much trouble to bring all of them here.
December 7, 2015 at 9:34 pm #35297InvaderRamModeratori hope he can be. i hope he can reach his potential. don’t want to have to replace yet another position.
i still give him until next year, but i’m disappointed so far.
December 7, 2015 at 10:56 pm #35301DakParticipantIt’s been two years. He should be a lot better by now. Maybe it’s time to replace the OL coach, too. I know that Boudreau has a great reputation. Maybe he’s lost a step as a coach.
December 8, 2015 at 12:07 am #35304PA RamParticipantI remember when they made this pick I wasn’t thrilled.
I wanted Watkins but if they were going to go OT I was okay with Matthews. Yes–they raved about Robinson’s upside but at least with Matthews you knew what you were getting. While he struggled a bit his rookie season he has had an excellent second year. Robinson is still lost.
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
December 8, 2015 at 2:11 am #35307AgamemnonParticipantDecember 8, 2015 at 9:16 am #35314znModeratorIt’s been two years. He should be a lot better by now.
No not necessarily.
First, he had off-season surgery. That means there’s a big patch of time there when he couldn’t practice technique.
Besides, as the article says it’s college line play. Guys are coming to the NFL greener.
You want some evidence of that? Look at the linemen taken in the first round from say 2012 on and see how many do well in their first year, and then how many do well in their 2nd year.
According to PFF, right now only TWO of the tackles taken in the 1st round from 2012 to 2015 is ranked higher than Havenstein is right now. (Hav had a lot of playing experience in a pro style college offense. That’s one reason they drafted him.)
Combine that with the new CBA, which limits practice time and the amount of contact coaches can have with players before training camp, and the challenge of coaching up linemen is just greater.
It’s not just Robinson.
…
December 8, 2015 at 9:50 am #35316nittany ramModeratorThe NFL needs to stop drafting players from these spread offenses. Top recruits want to play for programs that give them the best shot to get to the pros so they’ll gravitate towards those that utilize more traditional styles.
December 8, 2015 at 12:27 pm #35319snowmanParticipantMaybe he could wear a wrist band like QBs do that says, “put left heel on the ground” and “be square to the LOS” and read it to himself before every play. 🙂
December 8, 2015 at 4:03 pm #35326wvParticipantWell, seems to me, GR gets beat in a multitude of ways.
Sometimes I swear, it just looks like he is not a true LT.
Maybe the “spread offense theory” (SOT) will turn out
accurate, and he’ll blossom in year THREE,
but I’m skeptical. He looks like he gets beat
physically too much, to my untrained eyes.Let us all hope the SOT is true, and they do not
need to draft another LT. It would be great
if they could spend that high pick on a WR
or DE or QB.w
vDecember 8, 2015 at 5:35 pm #35334AgamemnonParticipantDecember 8, 2015 at 6:18 pm #35335InvaderRamModeratori’m just worried he’s another cook/britt jeff fisher special. loads of talent but just mentally not into it.
i’m surprised cuz i read somewhere he was sec all-american. of course who knows with all the shenanigans that happen at those schools. he very well could have earned none of those grades.
i hope my fears are wrong and his third year is his breakout year.
December 8, 2015 at 7:23 pm #35337znModeratori’m just worried he’s another cook/britt jeff fisher special. loads of talent but just mentally not into it.
But then the writer in the original post says
It’s obvious he possesses a true love for the game by the style in which he plays. In an era where many offensive linemen aren’t being heralded for their toughness or mean streaks, Greg Robinson approaches the game like a true throwback trench warrior.
I think people sometimes mistake being awkward and undeveloped at the level of technique for a lot of other things.
But I will say this again. MOST 1st round OL in the last few years struggle at first.
We just haven’t seen it with the Rams so we think it’s abnormal. It’s the norm, actually.
.
December 8, 2015 at 7:39 pm #35338InvaderRamModeratorwe’ll see. but the exact opposite could be true as well. we’ve also heard that up until recently he was doing the bare minimum in terms of preparation. he’s got to take that love for the game and transfer it to his off field preparation. so far he’s saying the right things. so we’ll see.
December 9, 2015 at 2:00 am #35356znModeratorRobinson can still live up to potential with Rams
Ben Frederickson
Dennis Lorio’s Louisiana drawl doesn’t sugarcoat.
He knows the highest-drafted offensive lineman from his home state is taking his lumps in the league.
But the former Thibodaux High football coach makes a reasonable plea for patience in the case of Greg Robinson.
Lorio is one of the people the Rams called when they were vetting the All-SEC left tackle out of Auburn, whom they drafted No. 2 in 2014.
He’s the guy who moved Robinson from defensive end to the other side of the ball before Robinson started his junior season of high school, a switch that resulted in the emergence of a top-10 recruit among O-linemen in the 2011 class.
He’s hoping you don’t make up your mind on his former player after 24 NFL starts.
“Of course I’m biased,” Lorio admitted over the phone. “I just think Greg has a great potential, great future. Is he going to be where he and the Rams need him to be? It doesn’t sound like it’s there yet. But, I think he’s capable of doing it.”
Team owner Stan Kroenke is trying to move the franchise. Coach Jeff Fisher and general manager Les Snead have posted a 24-35 record since they took over in 2012. The Rams (4-8) have lost five straight. So much to get mad about, but some fans are focused on a second-year lineman.
I get it. So far Robinson has been a microcosm of the Rams. So much hope. Such little production. The delayed angst of draft disappointment is one this fan base knows too well. Especially when it comes to offensive tackles.
On Monday, former NFL linemen LeCharles Bentley and Max Starks published a detailed breakdown of Robinson’s breakdowns on their Block Report website. The bad news: Sometimes Robinson’s stance is too wide. Sometimes it’s too narrow. His footwork is consistently inconsistent. And his leverage is lacking. The good news: His raw power is undeniable. These are mechanical flaws that should be fixable. Together, everyone screams: “Then fix it!”
According to the analysts at ProFootballFocus.com, Robinson and Kansas City’s Jah Reid rank 72nd among the NFL’s offensive tackles. Robinson’s pass blocking ranks 71st. His run blocking ranks 69th. The PFF grading system sets three categories: 0-59 (replaceable), 60-69 (backup), 70-84 (starter), 85-89 (Pro Bowler), 90-100 (elite). Robinson checks in at 29.2. Ouch.
Even a casual fan who overlooks line play knows of Robinson’s struggles. He has surrendered 3.5 sacks this season after allowing 6.5 as a rookie. When there is a penalty against the Rams’ offense, he is often the reason. After six holding penalties last season, he’s had eight this year. That doesn’t include the two that were declined. No other tackle in the league has more than five. Robinson also has three false starts. Sigh.
I expressed fans’ frustration to Lorio, the football coach who knew Robinson way back when. He didn’t make excuses. He did offer some theories.
He wondered if Robinson’s weight — he’s now listed at 332 pounds — might be affecting his speed. He explained how the offenses Robinson ran in high school and at Auburn rarely asked him to set the edge for a true drop-back passer. He said these two seasons have probably been the first time in Robinson’s life when football is truly hard. And Robinson is figuring everything out while in the spotlight only left tackles know.
“It’s just going to take some time,” Lorio said. “But look, in the NFL, now is the time. Nobody wants to say, in a year or two, this guy is going to be ready. They want you to be ready now. That’s why they drafted you. That’s why they paid you. Maybe he got put in a position that he was really not quite ready for. But hey, you do what is best for the team. He does have the ability.”
There’s another aspect in play here. The elephant in the offensive line room. Since Orlando Pace, the No. 1 pick in the 1997 draft, anchored the Greatest Show on Turf, the Rams tend to strike out every time they swing big on a tackle in the draft.
There was penalty-prone Alex Barron (No. 19 in 2005), sack-facilitator Jason Smith (No. 2 in 2009), and oft-injured Rodger Saffold (No. 33 in 2010).
Of course, none of these picks had anything to do with Snead, Fisher or Robinson. But Robinson’s selection has extended an unpleasant narrative. And here’s another twist of the knife: Two highly touted tackles the Rams passed over in that 2014 draft — Jake Matthews (No. 6, Falcons) and Taylor Lewan (No. 11, Titans) — have settled in just fine. Snead and Fisher tend to draft potential, not polish. And now they’re here.
“The top draft choices are projections of how good they can be,” Lorio said “The question is, ‘When will Greg be as good as he can be?’”
Let’s hope it’s soon, for the sake of Robinson and the Rams. Otherwise, he is on track to go down as yet another post-Pace tackle disaster. Potentially the biggest.
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