Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Rams Huddle › Glad to be Back
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January 17, 2016 at 8:00 am #37486GreatRamNTheSkyParticipant
Hi Fellas,
Sorry I’ve been away this past season but my focus was really on the move back to LA and the season actually meant very little to me. Of course I watched every game but I could not wait for the season to be over and for the real fun to begin. And it did and it went the way I thought it would.
I don’t no if you guys followed this as closely as I have but, for the last year my world has been following Vinny Bonsignore of the LA Daily News, Sam Farmer of the Times and Jason Cole on twitter and other forms of media. I don’t know if any of you were ever keyed into this but Fred Roggin a sportscaster out here in Los Angeles has a radio show on a station call The Beast 980 and he pretty much was the only LA Radio personality with in depth coverage. His sources were the best and everything Fred reported came true. He only reported the facts and
he would not say it unless he had vetted the source and confirmed the information.Its been a wild ride. Certain reporters in the sports media would have had you believe that the owners were on Dean Spano’s side. Well, as you saw by the vote that was not quite true.
The owners loved Kroenke’s vision for The City of Champions project in Inglewood and they absolutely spanked both Spanos and Davis. You could see it on Dean and Mark’s faces when the announcement was made last Tuesday. It was a thing of beauty to behold.
As you may know, both the Chargers and Raiders have an option to move to LA. Spanos and Charges have 1st dibs. Spanos has about 2 months to decide if he’ll in LA for 2016 and 1 year to decide if he is moving at all. If Spanos declines the option then the Raiders will have 1 year to decide if they are moving to LA. Either Spanos or Davis if they move to LA would be either a full partner and share in the cost (Which I do not see happening) or they can be Stan’s tenant, which I see as more likely if either come to LA.
The reason I do not see either Davis or Spanos becoming an equal partner with Stan is neither has the capital to pay for their half of the deal. Also if either relocate to LA they have to pay the 1/2 billion dollar relocation fee.
When you look at the Chargers situation it seems Spanos has really boxed himself into a corner. Here is why.
1. Spanos and Fabiana ran a “Scorched Earth” campaign in San Diego. They totally trashed the city government and the fans every chance they got. On the day of the vote a reporter from San Diego asked Spanos if he had anything to say to the fans and he allegedly said I’ve said all I have to say. After he lost, a letter was sent out from the Chargers to their season ticket holders telling them how much Dean loved them. blah, blah, blah. Sure Dean, we know.
2.If Spanos and the Chargers move to LA they will immediately become the LA Clippers of the NFL world. Meaning they will always be number 2 in the market to the Rams and they know this.
3. It is a real possibility the Raiders would move to San Diego and there is nothing Spanos could do to stop the Raiders from moving in. In a poll taken in San Diego many current Charger fans said they would become Raiders fans if the Raiders moved there.
You put all that together and you can see why the Chargers may never move to LA. With the Rams in LA and the Raiders in San Diego, the Chargers would be left whatever scraps are left over in regards to the Southern California football fan base and that is not a pleasant outlook for them. I believe it is very apparent to Dean Spanos that he needs to stay in San Diego for his own good and the welfare of his organization. He had to protect his claim in San Diego or lose it to the Raiders.
My prediction is the Chargers and the city of San Diego will work things out.
Mark Davis and the Raiders really want to stay in Oakland but they currently have no place to play. Their lease is up and the City and County of Oakland have offered nothing to them in all this time. San Antonio Texas is a real possibility for the Raiders. It has been reported the Raiders have somehow procured a plot of land in San Antonio/Austin area that would suit an new stadium. The city of San Antonio is really courting the Raiders heavily and former Minnesota Vikings owner Red McCombs is heavily involved in this.
San Antonio Raiders could happen in 2016 so, stay tuned.
Looks like us LA Rams fans may get our wish and that is Rams only in LA.
Grits
January 17, 2016 at 8:10 am #37488nittany ramModeratorWelcome back, Grits and congrats. I am glad the Rams are back in LA but I hate the pain the move has caused all the St. Louis fans I know and like.
January 17, 2016 at 8:10 am #37489wvParticipantWell, i ‘hope’ the Raiders stay in Oakland
and the Chargers stay in San Diego.
And i hope the league expands some day
and St.Louis gets a new team.Time to start thinking about the team
again, Grits. How can they win
without a QB ?w
vJanuary 17, 2016 at 10:12 am #37511InvaderRamModeratorno way chargers move for 2016 season. 2017 if it happens at all, but i don’t think he does.
- This reply was modified 8 years, 11 months ago by InvaderRam.
January 17, 2016 at 11:44 am #37522PA RamParticipantHey, GRITS!
Welcome back! We were just asking about you. Glad everything is okay.
Yeah–I’ve been thinking about San Diego a bit. Soanos really screwed himself a bit in taking on Kroenke. I think he overestimated the loyalty he had of his fellow owners. Now he’s kind of Stan’s “bitch”. He has to negotiate and let’s be honest–Stan’s not just going to GIVE him something.
I don’t know how it plays out. Apparently there is some incentive for Stan by having a second team–with advertisers or some such thing, can’t remember what I read. But still—he didn’t leave himself in the best bargaining position.
And the “scorched earth” policy with San Diego leaves him in a bad spot.
He’s sort of damned if he does and damned if he doesn’t, I guess.
Well, anyway, I know you’re thrilled about the Rams–I expect we’ll get good reports from you during the season. Some of us are all the way on the other coast, you know? Take care, GRITS. 🙂
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
January 17, 2016 at 11:59 am #37525znModeratorApparently there is some incentive for Stan by having a second team–with advertisers or some such thing, can’t remember what I read.
It has to do with PSL sales. I forget the details but they’re findable.
In terms of Spanos screwing himself, I don’t see it that way at all. So we have this situation where 2 teams need help with their stadium situation, and one where the local city IS making efforts to build a stadium. Who won the right to LA? The team whose local city was working on a stadium plan.
Why did they win?
Because the owners chose glitz, “product growth,” and glitter over community.
That’s a choice.
We may naturalize the idea that you choose “product growth” and act like it’s normal, but it’s still a choice.
So oddly again, most of us would be VICTIMS in situations where pure abstract “product growth” counts over community values. For example, paycuts.
But strangely we don’t do the math, and tend to favor “product growth.”
It’s like we’re peasants and we’re happy the Baron has new shiny clothes. Even though we would be better off with no Baron at all, let alone a Baron using the fruits of our labor to improve his wardrobe.
And Grits, I can say all that and still be glad that diehard longtime LA fans got their team. It’s contradictory, but, sometimes on complex issues, one is contradictory. It’s because there are competing values and ideas and feelings at stake. So I take nothing away from LA fans. I feel for St. Louis fans. And as a nomad I don’t care where they play. It really is all those things at once.
…
January 17, 2016 at 12:17 pm #37530wvParticipantApparently there is some incentive for Stan by having a second team–with advertisers or some such thing, can’t remember what I read.
It has to do with PSL sales. I forget the details but they’re findable.
In terms of Spanos screwing himself, I don’t see it that way at all. So we have this situation where 2 teams need help with their stadium situation, and one where the local city IS making efforts to build a stadium. Who won the right to LA? The team whose local city was working on a stadium plan.
Why did they win?
Because the owners chose glitz, “product growth,” and glitter over community.
That’s a choice.
We may naturalize the idea that you choose “product growth” and act like it’s normal, but it’s still a choice.
So oddly again, most of us would be VICTIMS in situations where pure abstract “product growth” counts over community values. For example, paycuts.
But strangely we don’t do the math, and tend to favor “product growth.”
It’s like we’re peasants and we’re happy the Baron has new shiny clothes. Even though we would be better off with no Baron at all, let alone a Baron using the fruits of our labor to improve his wardrobe.
And Grits, I can say all that and still be glad that diehard longtime LA fans got their team. It’s contradictory, but, sometimes on complex issues, one is contradictory. It’s because there are competing values and ideas and feelings at stake. So I take nothing away from LA fans. I feel for St. Louis fans. And as a nomad I don’t care where they play. It really is all those things at once.
…
Well said, dude.
I think.
I dunno.w
vJanuary 17, 2016 at 12:26 pm #37531znModeratorI think.
I dunno.That will be on your tombstone one day won’t it.
Here lies WV.
We think.
Dunno.
It’s complicated.January 17, 2016 at 1:53 pm #37550ZooeyModeratorYeah, Spanos knew he would be the Clippers or Mets or Jets if he shared LA with the Rams. That was the whole point of hooking up with another team and trying to keep the Rams out. It isn’t that he liked the Carson project better; it’s that he didn’t want the Rams in LA at all.
So now he is in a tough spot. He doesn’t want the Raiders in San Diego, but he doesn’t want the Raiders in LA, either. He’s screwed. He now has to decide if he is better off as the unwanted kid brother in Stanland, and possibly losing a good chunk of his San Diego fan base to the San Diego Raiders, or paint himself in a corner in San Diego while yielding ALL of LA to other teams. He has one year to either get a signed and sealed deal with San Diego, or he is really, really screwed. He has to figure that whatever market he leaves open is going to be filled by the Raiders. Unless he’s lucky.
But the Raiders currently have nothing brewing in Oakland, and I’m pretty sure the Cowboys and Texans both have fans in San Antonio and all of western Texas that they don’t really want to hand over to the Raiders. The Raiders would have to apply for relocation to San Antonio, and they might get approval, and they might not. They probably would, but there is no certainty. It’s much easier for the Raiders to move to LA, and they already have a fan base there, and it wouldn’t require giving up as big a chunk of equity in the team as moving to San Antonio likely would.
So I think Spano has to choose between LA and SD with the assumption that the Raiders take the other spot.
It sucks to be Spanos right now.
January 17, 2016 at 2:06 pm #37552InvaderRamModeratorhe’s better off staying in san diego just to keep another team from moving in. he’ll then have the san diego market as well as part of the orange county market. he’d be dumb to move in with stan.
January 17, 2016 at 2:24 pm #37554ZooeyModeratorhe’s better off staying in san diego just to keep another team from moving in. he’ll then have the san diego market as well as part of the orange county market. he’d be dumb to move in with stan.
I tend to agree that having the Raiders take over San Diego is worse for him than having the Raiders in LA. It would be all uphill in LA to get a fan base. In fact, some of the LA residents who have remained Raiders fans would probably stick with the Raiders, especially if they move to San Diego.
But he needs a deal before he locks himself into San Diego, and that could be tough to pull off. I bet he is going to buy himself time to try to do just that, and he won’t move to LA for 2016.
January 17, 2016 at 2:54 pm #37558wvParticipantI…dont…want..to SHARE,
a stadium.w
vJanuary 17, 2016 at 4:03 pm #37563PA RamParticipantI…dont…want..to SHARE,
a stadium.w
v"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. " Philip K. Dick
January 18, 2016 at 12:48 am #37575ZooeyModeratorApparently there is some incentive for Stan by having a second team–with advertisers or some such thing, can’t remember what I read.
It has to do with PSL sales. I forget the details but they’re findable.
From and article in the LA Times by Sam Farmer:
To encourage the Rams to make a deal with a second team, the resolution barred the Rams from selling personal seat licenses, suites or naming rights until February 2017 unless another NFL team joins them before then.
The advantage, of course, of selling PSLs and naming rights immediately is that Stan can write the checks for building the stadium with other people’s money. Without that, he is going to have to get loans or liquidate his own stuff for the first year of construction.
January 18, 2016 at 1:28 am #37579InvaderRamModeratorI…dont…want..to SHARE,
a stadium.w
vmaybe they could just screw the inglewood plans and play at the coliseum and provide affordable tickets to all rams fans?
- This reply was modified 8 years, 11 months ago by InvaderRam.
January 18, 2016 at 1:38 am #37583HerzogParticipantHate all of this.
San Antonio/Austin area is hungry for a team and would embrace the Raiders if they moved. I live in Austin and I really don’t think people around here care about Houston or Dallas. The Raiders would do VERY WELL here.
I don’t understand how the Raiders could go to San Diego if the stadium sucks just as much as the oakland stadium, than why would they move there?
January 18, 2016 at 1:56 am #37584znModerator. I live in Austin
I didn’t know you lived in Austin. Before she moved here my wife lived in Kerrville. I spent a bit of time there and in San Antonio.
January 18, 2016 at 6:03 am #37586GreatRamNTheSkyParticipantHi Guys,
According to recent reports this weekend the Chargers are negotiating with the Rams to come to LA ASAP. Me, I’d be shocked if they do.
Grits
January 18, 2016 at 11:37 am #37606ZooeyModeratorHate all of this.
I don’t understand how the Raiders could go to San Diego if the stadium sucks just as much as the oakland stadium, than why would they move there?
Because San Diego is at least moving whereas the city of Oakland is doing nothing. There is a willingness to build a new stadium in San Diego. There is something on the ballot. IIRC, the problem for Spanos was location. He wanted a stadium in the heart of the city, and San Diego is proposing something near where the Padres play which, I gather, is more peripheral to the city. I dunno, though, because all I know about the San Diego situation is what I picked up by reading about the Rams’ situation.
As for the Raiders, they have the worst situation there is in the NFL, and no money of their own to address it. But they don’t have any concrete prospects to consider yet, just generalities. They kind of have to wait until Spanos makes his decision before their choices clarify.
January 18, 2016 at 11:47 am #37610InvaderRamModeratoryou’re right. i believe the chargers want a stadium in the gaslamp district which is right where the padres stadium is. lots of bars and restaurants. my guess is spanos feels it will make for a better fan experience and draw more crowds. san diego wants to build where the old stadium is which is more on the outskirts.
January 18, 2016 at 11:50 am #37611InvaderRamModeratori just looked it up. they’re not that far apart. less than 10 miles. but i did go to a rams chargers preseason game awhile back. traffic was absolutely awful.
January 18, 2016 at 12:02 pm #37613Isiah58ParticipantWhile it seems counter intuitive for the Chargers to move in with the Rams knowing that Mark Davis is ready to pounce on their former market, there are also rumors that there is no shortage of investors who are willing to go in with Spanos to split the megatropolis that is the new stadium in LA. They believe that they are going to be printing money, and if that is the case who cares if you have no real fan base? Vinnie B also believes that if Spanos declines, the Raiders absolutely would move to LA. Thus, the Rams will almost certainly be sharing with someone.
The moratorium on beginning their marketing initiatives is kind of a big deal for the Rams, too. We have heard that they will be heavily into promoting the Rams here in Southern California, but none of that can begin until the second team is situated. So while there is a buzz in Southern California about the NFL returning to LA, until they can really start to promote the team there may be a dead period after the initial excitement. By the way, the web site goes online in an hour to put your name on the waitlist for tix. I am going to be the first person on the list! : )
Isiah 58“Marge, don't discourage the boy! Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals! Except the weasel.” - Homer Simpson
January 18, 2016 at 12:30 pm #37618ZooeyModeratorWhile it seems counter intuitive for the Chargers to move in with the Rams knowing that Mark Davis is ready to pounce on their former market, there are also rumors that there is no shortage of investors who are willing to go in with Spanos to split the megatropolis that is the new stadium in LA. They believe that they are going to be printing money, and if that is the case who cares if you have no real fan base? Vinnie B also believes that if Spanos declines, the Raiders absolutely would move to LA. Thus, the Rams will almost certainly be sharing with someone.
The moratorium on beginning their marketing initiatives is kind of a big deal for the Rams, too. We have heard that they will be heavily into promoting the Rams here in Southern California, but none of that can begin until the second team is situated. So while there is a buzz in Southern California about the NFL returning to LA, until they can really start to promote the team there may be a dead period after the initial excitement. By the way, the web site goes online in an hour to put your name on the waitlist for tix. I am going to be the first person on the list! : )
Isiah 58I don’t understand much of what you said there. I agree that the Rams will be sharing that stadium with either the Chargers or Raiders. A tenant seems inevitable.
I don’t understand “there is no shortage of investors who are willing to go in with Spanos to split the megatropolis that is the new stadium in LA.” AFAIK, ownership of the stadium and the surrounds is not on the table. The 2nd team is going to be a tenant, not a landlord. No? The money printing presses are owned by SK and his Hollywood Park partnership – forgotten its name.
Also – the moratorium is on selling PSLs, suites, and naming rights to the stadium – not on marketing. AFAIK. I haven’t seen anything saying they can’t promote the Rams. I mean – they already have with their public press conference and new logo and the ticket sales that you are signing up for this morning.
January 18, 2016 at 12:31 pm #37619wvParticipantWhile it seems counter intuitive for the Chargers to move in with the Rams knowing that Mark Davis is ready to pounce on their former market, there are also rumors that there is no shortage of investors who are willing to go in with Spanos to split the megatropolis that is the new stadium in LA. They believe that they are going to be printing money, and if that is the case who cares if you have no real fan base? Vinnie B also believes that if Spanos declines, the Raiders absolutely would move to LA. Thus, the Rams will almost certainly be sharing with someone.
The moratorium on beginning their marketing initiatives is kind of a big deal for the Rams, too. We have heard that they will be heavily into promoting the Rams here in Southern California, but none of that can begin until the second team is situated. So while there is a buzz in Southern California about the NFL returning to LA, until they can really start to promote the team there may be a dead period after the initial excitement. By the way, the web site goes online in an hour to put your name on the waitlist for tix. I am going to be the first person on the list! : )
Isiah 58What do you have to say about this
past season, I58 ?w
vJanuary 18, 2016 at 12:59 pm #37623InvaderRamModeratorBy the way, the web site goes online in an hour to put your name on the waitlist for tix. I am going to be the first person on the list! : )
Isiah 58i think i’m going to try and go to the first game at the coliseum. i just have to.
so i clicked on the website, and they got this video there. starts out with a deacon jones to aaron donald to eric dickerson to todd gurley montage.
January 18, 2016 at 1:19 pm #37625Isiah58ParticipantWhile it seems counter intuitive for the Chargers to move in with the Rams knowing that Mark Davis is ready to pounce on their former market, there are also rumors that there is no shortage of investors who are willing to go in with Spanos to split the megatropolis that is the new stadium in LA. They believe that they are going to be printing money, and if that is the case who cares if you have no real fan base? Vinnie B also believes that if Spanos declines, the Raiders absolutely would move to LA. Thus, the Rams will almost certainly be sharing with someone.
The moratorium on beginning their marketing initiatives is kind of a big deal for the Rams, too. We have heard that they will be heavily into promoting the Rams here in Southern California, but none of that can begin until the second team is situated. So while there is a buzz in Southern California about the NFL returning to LA, until they can really start to promote the team there may be a dead period after the initial excitement. By the way, the web site goes online in an hour to put your name on the waitlist for tix. I am going to be the first person on the list! : )
Isiah 58What do you have to say about this
past season, I58 ?w
vGreetings WV. Its good to see you digitally speaking.
I thought progress was made this year. But I am always the optimist. Snead and Fisher have built a team that can go into Arizona and Seattle and beat those teams. Not fluke wins, but really beat those teams. That is progress. But the losses to Baltimore and Chicago were also signs that they are not ready to compete on the big stage until they get real QB play. We all know this, and we all demand this, but the realization is that there is no obvious answer to the obvious problem. When we scored 20 points, we were 7 – 0. Its not that high of a bar.
I am optimistic that the Rams are on an upward progression, but I understand those that disagree. The Rams played 9 games against playoff teams this past year. That is a lot. The Redskins played 2 games against playoff teams. But everyone can point to excuses, etc. when evaluating a team. For me personally, I like the progression and the improvement over where they were. I hope that the defense can improve even more when E.J. Gaines and Alec Ogletree and Robert Quinn are healthy, and I think the O-line had to cut their teeth this year but getting back Saffold and Brown back healthy will make this running game even better next year. We all know what they need on O – reliable pass catchers and a guy who can get them the ball. Here’s hoping they can get it done this year.
Isiah 58
“Marge, don't discourage the boy! Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals! Except the weasel.” - Homer Simpson
January 18, 2016 at 1:28 pm #37628znModeratorFor me personally, I like the progression and the improvement over where they were.
You win the “zn would say the same thing” prize for the day.
Translation: we agree pretty much.
.
January 18, 2016 at 2:09 pm #37632wvParticipantI thought progress was made this year. But I am always the optimist. Snead and Fisher have built a team that can go into Arizona and Seattle and beat those teams. Not fluke wins, but really beat those teams. That is progress. But the losses to Baltimore and Chicago were also signs that they are not ready to compete on the big stage until they get real QB play. We all know this, and we all demand this, but the realization is that there is no obvious answer to the obvious problem. When we scored 20 points, we were 7 – 0. Its not that high of a bar.
I am optimistic that the Rams are on an upward progression, but I understand those that disagree. The Rams played 9 games against playoff teams this past year. That is a lot. The Redskins played 2 games against playoff teams. But everyone can point to excuses, etc. when evaluating a team. For me personally, I like the progression and the improvement over where they were. I hope that the defense can improve even more when E.J. Gaines and Alec Ogletree and Robert Quinn are healthy, and I think the O-line had to cut their teeth this year but getting back Saffold and Brown back healthy will make this running game even better next year. We all know what they need on O – reliable pass catchers and a guy who can get them the ball. Here’s hoping they can get it done this year.
Isiah 58
————————
Yup. Agreed.
w
vJanuary 18, 2016 at 2:28 pm #37633Isiah58ParticipantFor me personally, I like the progression and the improvement over where they were.
You win the “zn would say the same thing” prize for the day.
Translation: we agree pretty much.
.
Well, then, I suppose my work here is done : )
Looking forward to the draft already.
“Marge, don't discourage the boy! Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals! Except the weasel.” - Homer Simpson
January 18, 2016 at 2:28 pm #37634InvaderRamModeratori’m not sure they were any better than they were last year. but i do believe the team is close to a breakthrough. of course i believed that last year as well.
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