developments on defense?

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  • #151344
    InvaderRam
    Moderator

    https://www.nbcsports.com/nfl/profootballtalk/rumor-mill/news/rams-rookie-dt-braden-fiske-to-work-out-with-aaron-donald-before-training-camp

     

    The Rams won’t have Aaron Donald on their defensive line this season, but they may still be able to benefit from his experience.

    Donald announced his retirement in March and part of the team’s plan to replace him at defensive tackle came into focus during the second day of the draft. That’s when the Rams traded up to acquire a second-round pick they used to select Braden Fiske, who starred at Florida State after transferring from Western Michigan last season.

    Fiske was never teammates with Donald, but he has spoken to the former Ram since joining the team and has plans “to get some workouts in during the next couple of weeks before training camp.” Fiske has one big lesson down before any meeting, however.

    “I have to be me,” Fiske said, via DJ Siddiqi of Forbes. “I have to build my own legacy and that’s what I’m looking forward to. I don’t feel like I’m really filling shoes, but I have to create my own shoes. That’s kind of what it is. I’m just excited to be a part of it and I know that’ll kind of always be the comparison of who’s going to fill his shoes, but somebody has to do it.”

    Kobie Turner and Bobby Brown will also play key roles on the defensive line for the Rams and they’ll need all three players to thrive in order to replicate anything like the impact Donald had on opposing offenses.

    #151352
    zn
    Moderator

    Some stuff on the Fangio defense that Shula got from Morris/Staley

    from https://theeagleswire.usatoday.com/lists/philadelphia-eagles-vic-fangio-scheme-structure-culture-linebackers/

    Cornerback Chris Harris, Jr, who played for Fangio in Denver in 2019, said this about his defensive philosophy: “It’s versatile. He has a wide variety of defenses. … You have to be smart to know how to play your spot, your zone, and your position. I think that’s why I’ve always liked it. It has so much. He has a lot of different looks he can bring.”

    Fangio employs two high structures, a base 3-4 defensive front, light boxes, and modern defense….The “Fangio Defense” will always employ a two-high shells look before the snap. The two-high structure allows for flexibility in the secondary. The Fangio Defense uses the appearance of simplicity while encompassing a plethora of coverages, pressures, and assignments.

    The safeties are the most critical piece on Vic Fangio’s chessboard…. defensive backs are asked to fill running lanes from a position of depth while being athletic enough to eliminate crossing routes.

     his teams are known to be light on blitzing and with a structure based around two high safeties. These looks are predicated on stopping deep, explosive gains and living with shorter, underneath completions.
    Though the Fangio Defense uses different matching rules and variations within coverage that combine man and zone coverages, a basic understanding of field zones is important as we start to dig into pass coverage. The general zone assignment can turn into a man assignment based on the formation or if certain players cross certain zones. Further, certain offensive looks can give a defender freedom to support another player’s responsibility.
    What makes Fangio’s defense the best response to modern offenses? Its two-high (two deep safeties) structure limits explosive plays and forces offenses to stay patient and throw short. The front mechanics allow the defense to slow down the run with light boxes and commit more resources to coverage. Pre-snap, the defense is committed to showing the same Cover 4 shell for as long as possible so quarterbacks have to make reads after the snap. Even after the snap, it’s hard to draw a bead on what the coverage is because of how the defensive backs disperse from the top down. … From its two-high alignment, the defense can rotate into a variety of zone and man coverages.
    One of the key features of Fangio’s defense is how everything looks similar before the snap. Both safeties align deep, and usually one or both corners play off the line of scrimmage, so it looks like Cover 4 across the board or Cover 6, making it difficult for quarterbacks to identify the coverage. Figuring out the coverage before the snap informs quarterbacks where they should look first and how to progress from read to read. Making the coverage look the same puts more pressure on quarterbacks to compute more information after the snap.
    #151356
    zn
    Moderator

    Keys from/synopsis of last post: focus on the secondary. The collected quotations in this synopsis will get a bit repetitive which is part of the point. This stuff explains why they loaded up on versatile veterans in the seconary: 

    The “Fangio Defense” will always employ a two-high shells look before the snap. The two-high structure allows for flexibility in the secondary. The Fangio Defense uses the appearance of simplicity while encompassing a plethora of coverages, pressures, and assignments. …

    his teams are known to be light on blitzing and with a structure based around two high safeties. These looks are predicated on stopping deep, explosive gains and living with shorter, underneath completions.
    Though the Fangio Defense uses different matching rules and variations within coverage that combine man and zone coverages
    From its two-high alignment, the defense can rotate into a variety of zone and man coverages.
    One of the key features of Fangio’s defense is how everything looks similar before the snap.
    Figuring out the coverage before the snap informs quarterbacks where they should look first and how to progress from read to read. Making the coverage look the same puts more pressure on quarterbacks to compute more information after the snap.

     

    #151370
    zn
    Moderator

    AltiTude Ram

    Quentin Lake interview. Good listen. 26:35 mark talks about Shula and using the same scheme.

    #151374
    zn
    Moderator

    J.B. Long@JB_Long
    We won’t have to wait long to learn what new-look Rams defense is all about.

    First 5 Weeks – 2023 Offensive EPA

    atDET – 5th
    atARI – Top 10 once Kyler returned
    SF – 1st
    atCHI – Best offense a 1.1 QB has been drafted into, potentially NFC’s best skill group.
    GB – 3rd from W10 on

    Another way of framing the caliber of the competition: Bill Barnwell just released his annual skill group rankings. The Rams schedule includes games against teams ranked 1st (twice), 2nd, 3rd, 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th (twice).

    #151400
    wv
    Participant

    One of my top question marks this year is Chris Shula, btw.   I have no inkling where he will rank  as a ram DC.   Should be interesting.

    Guess who had the best winning percentage of these DCs ?     Check the link.

    Raheem, Staley, Wade Philips, Greg Williams, Tim Walton, Blake Williams, Ken Flajole, Jim Haslett, Larrie Marmie, Lovie Smith, Peter Giunta, Bud Carson, Willie Shaw, Fritz Shurmur, Herb Patera

    https://pro-football-history.com/franchpos/35/8/los-angeles-rams-defensive-coordinator-history

    #151401
    zn
    Moderator

    Guess who had the best winning percentage of these DCs ?

    It’s tied. Lovie Smith & Wade Phillips, both with 68.8%.

    The worst was Ken Flajole (2009-11), which really means Spagnuola. But Spags dealt with injuries on defense. It got so bad in 2011 that in an arranged online “q&a” type chat with Demoff I asked him if it ever got to point where it was actually getting darkly funny. He said yes.

    #151404
    zn
    Moderator

    from https://ramblinfan.com/posts/how-does-la-rams-gm-les-snead-find-so-many-gems-on-other-nfl-teams-rosters-01j2rt9et911

    Darious Williams off waivers

    Darious Williams signed with the Baltimore Ravens after the 2018 NFL Draft, but was offered only a special teams role. When the Raven released him mid-season to make room to return a player from IR, the Rams pounced and added him to their 53-man roster.

    Williams would play just four defensive snaps in 2018. But in 2019, the Rams secondary would undergo some upheaval. Former All Pro CB Aqib Talib would fall to a devastating injury after just five games. And his teammate, CB Marcus Peters, was ineffective as he allowed three touchdowns over six games. The Rams traded both cornerbacks away, allowing the team to trade for discontented All-Pro cornerback Jalen Ramsey. And as the secondary was recast, the team tried Darious Williams in a starting role to close out the season.

    Williams proved to be the ideal bookend to match Jalen Ramsey. As offenses threw away from Ramsey, Williams found himself getting plenty of work. In 2020, Williams picked off four passes and held opposing receiving to no better than a 54.2 percent completion rate.

    And now, he’s back to do it all over again

    #151554
    wv
    Participant

    Rams defense was about 20th in Rushing yards allowed, and Passing yards allowed last year.

    If Chris Shula is successful he has a chance to say the Rams D finished better AFTER they lost Aaron Donald.   Could lead to big things for Shula.

    Then again the defense might implode without AD.   We shall see.

     

    w

    v

     

    #151571
    InvaderRam
    Moderator

    early returns on fiske seem to be really really positive. from multiple sources. and it seems like everyone makes a point to mention him. players. journalists. fans.

     

    i’m excited.

    #151572
    zn
    Moderator

    early returns on fiske seem to be really really positive. from multiple sources. and it seems like everyone makes a point to mention him. players. journalists. fans. i’m excited.

    Yeah so far the buzz on Fiske is good.

    But I was wondering how they will line up the base 3/4.

    It kind of seems like Turner and Fiske are the same guy. Both 3-techs. Will they have a tradition 5-tech like they did with Donald? Wouldn’t Turner and Fiske be on the field at the same time only in passing down packages?

    So will it be * Turner/Fiske * Brown * [someone at DE ie. a 5-tech…but who] *

    Or is the base 3/4 DL going to be 2 3-techs + a nose? so * Fiske * Brown * Turner * ?

     

     

    #151621
    InvaderRam
    Moderator

    So will it be * Turner/Fiske * Brown * [someone at DE ie. a 5-tech…but who] * Or is the base 3/4 DL going to be 2 3-techs + a nose? so * Fiske * Brown * Turner * ?

     

    that is a question for someone with more football knowledge than me.

    #151630
    zn
    Moderator
    Stu Jackson@StuJRams
    Rams DC Chris Shula on takeaways from joint practice w/ Chargers: Liked how defensive front showed up & competed against “really good” offensive line, physical run scheme and different stuff than they’re using to seeing compared to Rams offense
    .
    Also happy with secondary, noting the “excellent” job Cobie Durant and Tre’Davious White did playing “calm” on the outside at corner
    #151761
    zn
    Moderator

    Chargers game:

    69RamFan

    Our Defensive stats:
    2/Sacks, 4/TFL, 3/QB Hits 1/INT, 5/PD, 99yd/Run defense

    After 2 preseason games:

    ramsman34

    The Rams D has only given up 7 field goals and zero TDs. That speaks to quality players, communication, and depth. And does not take into consideration any scheming which will be in full effect week 1.

    ME: I liked Morris. But I am beginning to think that Shula has great defensive coaching chops. Yes it’s early and it’s preseason but still…they are playing fast and they look well-coached and prepared. And we’re not even seeing the starters yet.

    The 2 most important assistant coaches on the team right now appear to be Shula at DC and Wendell as OL coach.

     

    #151763
    InvaderRam
    Moderator

    The 2 most important assistant coaches on the team right now appear to be Shula at DC and Wendell as OL coach.

     

    yeah. they certainly are the two most important coaches. how those two perform their duties will be critical to how this team does this year.

    #151797
    zn
    Moderator

    Sean McVay credits Giff Smith for Rams’ growth on defensive line

    Brock Vierra

    Sean McVay credits Giff Smith for Rams’ growth on defensive line

    During Monday’s press conference, Rams head coach Sean McVay was asked about defensive line coach Giff Smith and how Smith has empowered veterans to take up leadership roles within the team.

    Smith was hired by the Rams this offseason after spending eight years with the Chargers. Smith was the interim head coach for the Bolts during their last three games of 2023.

    Here’s what McVay had to say.

    “I’ve known Giff for a long time when he recruited me when I was in high school to Tulane. He was the one who recommended Eric Henderson to me. He’s a great coach. He’s a great mentor. I was even talking to Joey Bosa about it at the Chargers practice because he coached Joey for a handful of years and he was saying, ‘He’s this amazing guy.’ Sometimes you hear the word ‘players’ coach,’ and it can mean they’re not hard on guys. That’s the exact opposite. He loves these guys. He really invests in the relationships. That enables them to know that when he’s going to be challenging and demanding of them. ‘Hey, I’m going challenge you to be what you can be.’ They’re receptive to that. They respond. He has such a great feel for being able to empower guys. I can’t say enough good things about what I’ve witnessed and how grateful I am that he’s here. AC Carter’s another great coach who’s working alongside him. I think that’s why you’ve seen good growth from our young group. A lot of guys have progressed in the right direction, which is a real sign of great leadership from him.”

    Relationships are everything in football and it seems the one Smith and McVay have has helped build new connections within the organization.

    #152002
    InvaderRam
    Moderator

    by the end of the season the rams could have 4 rookies starting on defense. and another two in their sophomore seasons.

     

    hopefully, that means good things for the defense.

    #152066
    zn
    Moderator

    Jourdan Rodrigue, from:
    https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5738891/2024/09/04/los-angeles-rams-observations-preview-week-1/?the best of an already tough situation.

    Safety dance

    I am geeking out over how I’m seeing new defensive coordinator Chris Shula experiment with his deep safeties room. Shula had long had fingerprints on that group, whether as a position coach or as a member of the talent identification committee along with scouts.

    I observed the defense closely all summer to see what “coordinator personality” will emerge from the reserved, soft-spoken longtime position coach and his 2024 defense. So far, it has featured clean, fundamental football, stickier coverage thanks to significant veteran updates in the secondary (this is still a predominantly zone/match zone team, before anyone loses their mind), and cornerbacks and safeties who understand they will need to help out a very young group of pass rushers by covering well to allow the pressure to get home as they develop into their high potential. I am particularly interested in increased safety usage in sub packages such as nickel and dime, including counters to how teams will try to attack the middle of the field and use pre-snap motions and shifts against the Rams. It could be a big year for new captain (and “Star”/big nickel) Quentin Lake. Of course, this is all theory and observation gleaned from practice — things could always change once the real football starts.

    Speaking of which …

    Depending more on safeties instead of extra cornerbacks and inside linebackers may be another reason the Rams felt comfortable moving on from former team captain and starter Ernest Jones late last month. Multiple things are true about that situation: Jones was still getting his legs under him with the rest of the defense and a new coordinator after a knee injury sidelined him all spring. He wasn’t able to truly do football activities until training camp. Because the Rams (publicly) decided they were not going to extend him ahead of his fourth season, they seemed averse to giving him extra time — opting instead for the risk of playing veterans Troy Reeder and/or Christian Rozeboom in the short term, and maintaining belief that rookie Omar Speights will eventually hold an important role in the long term. Coaches were very high on Speights out of camp.

    General manager Les Snead has a saying: If it is inevitable, make it immediate. The Rams had been in conversations with teams on Jones through the later weeks of camp. Real game planning for the opener and beyond begins two weeks before the start of the season. The Rams kept the situation fluid as they took calls, but had to make a final decision after the joint practices in Houston. This was not as “sudden” as it looked (or felt, unless you’re a Rams executive). In fact, the first signal toward Jones possibly not being in as safe a spot as one would think a captain would be was Snead’s willingness to state on the record at league meetings in March that the Rams would let Jones play out his fourth season without an extension. That might as well have been a waving flag to other teams conveying the Rams were open for business. Jones was a true leader for the Rams and a talented blitzer (4 1/2 sacks in 2023) and figures to be a great fit for Dennard Wilson’s blitz-heavy scheme in Tennessee.

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