Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Rams Huddle › Change it (the Washington team name thread)
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July 9, 2020 at 9:09 am #117755znModerator
Yeah, I’m glad they are keeping the burgandy and gold. I actually think thats important to the fans. And its one of my favorite color schemes. So there’s that.
Snyder is such a piece of shit.
w
vMy high school team (and I played on it for a couple of years–linebacker) was/is burgundy and gold. I’ve always loved burgundy and gold.
We were called the Brebeuf Braves.
The school was named after St. Jean de Brebeuf, who was martyred by the Iroquis.
So “Braves” was an interesting nickname choice.
A rich donor commissioned a painting in the school cafeteria of a patiently enduring St. Jean tied to a stake and being ruthlessly tortured by Iroquis…braves. The painting was wall sized and took up one entire whole end of the room.
Fortunately, another rich donor gifted the school a huge curtain to close in front of the painting, so we could eat in peace.
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The Brebeuf Braves.
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Here’s St. Jean. This is not the painting I referred to obviously but they are of a kind. Our St. Jean had his eyes open looking heavenward in saintly forbearance etc.
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July 9, 2020 at 9:59 am #117775znModeratorAfter giving ~$3.7M to Native American communities in Year 1, the Original Americans Foundation’s giving dropped. The state of VA lists it as "not in good standing" as tribe officials say they've been ghosted, and recently, turned down for COVID-19 relief: https://t.co/rbC3Evamls
— Jenny Vrentas (@JennyVrentas) July 8, 2020
July 11, 2020 at 10:16 am #117852znModeratorMore groups call for complete ban on Native American mascots as momentum shifts https://t.co/7395OjBQoC
— Joe Curley (@vcsjoecurley) July 11, 2020
July 11, 2020 at 3:53 pm #117869znModeratorWith owner Daniel Snyder committed to having a new name firmly in place before the season begins, a new name for the Washington franchise is "imminent" https://t.co/3qzcCeL3gE
— ProFootballTalk (@ProFootballTalk) July 11, 2020
July 12, 2020 at 10:34 am #117888wvParticipantHoly Shit, i hadnt thought of the issues with the Texas Rangers. Damn.
That one went right over my head until now. Oblivious.
————-Texas Rangers:https://www.texasobserver.org/a-new-history-tears-down-the-myth-of-the-texas-rangers/
A New History Tears Down the Myth of the Texas Rangers
Monica Muñoz Martinez’s new book paints a brutally clear picture of the Rangers’ complicity in crimes against minorities.“….Martinez traces the group’s history from its relatively humble beginnings in the 1830s — as a small band of armed men organized by Stephen F. Austin to protect settlers — to what it had become by the late 19th century: a state-sponsored terror squad directed to secure white racial hegemony along the Texas-Mexico border.
Martinez organizes her book around the most egregious extrajudicial killings of Mexicans in Texas in the late 19th to early 20th centuries, incidents that Texas Rangers were either directly responsible for or carried out in cahoots with lynch mobs or local authorities. The 1910 burning-at-the-stake of Antonio Rodriguez in Rocksprings, the double murder of prosperous rancheros Jesus Bazan and Antonio Longoria at Guadalupe Ranch, and the 1918 midnight massacre of 15 unarmed Mexicans by Texas Rangers in Porvenir are the most extensively studied atrocities in the book. But these are just a few of Martinez’s many examples of lynchings, burnings, shootings, proxy killings and other unjustified anti-Mexican violence carried out by Texas Rangers, vigilante mobs, or both.
Martinez’s research posits the height of Texas Ranger violence against Mexicans to have occurred from 1915 to 1919. Some 300 ethnic Mexicans were murdered between 1915 and 1916 alone. These dates coincided with the reign of not only the disgraced governor James “Pa” Ferguson but also, starting in 1917, the often-venerated William P. Hobby. Martinez is appropriately unsparing in her detailing of Hobby’s consistently anti-Hispanic, anti-NAACP agenda: In short, he used the Rangers as his own personal goon squad in instigating intimidation tactics against minorities. Hobby presided over an era that, according to Martinez, saw the “widespread practice of executing landowning [Hispanic] men to force the sale of land by their widows through threats of physical violence”— much of said violence aided and abetted (if not directly perpetrated) by the Rangers with official state consent. Powerful U.S. political elites like Hobby made sure that any serious investigation of Ranger crimes through official legal channels would be doomed to failure.
Martinez also retrieves from the dustbin of history once-notorious Texas public officials like U.S. Representative Claude Benton Hudspeth, whose racist rhetoric painted Mexicans as “bandits” — an interesting historical precedent for hater-in-chief Donald Trump’s infamous insults. Also not unlike Trump, Hudspeth concocted a phony immigration crisis based on xenophobic fear. With the aid of Governor Hobby, he mobilized the Texas Rangers to end an era of liberalism along the border and secure economic prosperity for white settlers by keeping Mexicans out. Martinez makes the salient point that this border region was once a “semiautonomous” cross-cultural zone characterized by free movement and friendly socioeconomic exchange; yet by around 1915, through Texas lawmakers’ efforts, the region had become a “political and social boundary.” And most Mexicans still living there found themselves “overwhelmingly relegated to manual labor.”…see link
July 12, 2020 at 10:57 am #117889wvParticipantMy high school team (and I played on it for a couple of years–linebacker) was/is burgundy and gold. I’ve always loved burgundy and gold.
We were called the Brebeuf Braves.
The school was named after St. Jean de Brebeuf, who was martyred by the Iroquis.So “Braves” was an interesting nickname choice.
A rich donor commissioned a painting in the school cafeteria of a patiently enduring St. Jean tied to a stake and being ruthlessly tortured by Iroquis…braves. The painting was wall sized and took up one entire whole end of the room.
Fortunately, another rich donor gifted the school a huge curtain to close in front of the painting, so we could eat in peace.
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All very inter esting. So many tribes on this planet, over the centuries. So many issues. Maybe teams should just go with Vegetable names. Vegetable never committed any atrocities as far as i know.
The Wiki story below has Too many Ironies to even begin to unvavel. I am in awe of the many ironies.
And it all ends up on an American high school football helmet.
“….His efforts to develop a complete ethnographic record of the Huron has been described as “the longest and most ambitious piece of ethnographic description in all The Jesuit Relations”.[10] Brébeuf tried to find parallels between the Huron religion and Christianity, so as to facilitate conversion of the Huron to the European religion.[11] Brébeuf was known by the Huron for his apparent shamanistic skills, especially in rainmaking.[12] Despite his efforts to learn their ways, he considered Huron spiritual beliefs to be undeveloped and “foolish delusions”; he was determined to convert them to Christianity.[8] Brébeuf did not enjoy universal popularity with the Huron, as many believed he was a sorcerer.[13] By 1640, nearly half the Huron had died of smallpox and the losses disrupted their society. Many children and elders died. With their loved ones dying before their eyes, many Huron began to listen to the words of Jesuit missionaries who, unaffected by the disease, appeared to be men of great power.[14]
Brébeuf’s progress as a missionary in achieving conversions was slow…
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…..The Jesuits considered the priests’ martyrdom as proof that the mission to the Native Americans was blessed by God and would be successful.[30]Throughout the torture, Brébeuf was reported to have been more concerned for the fate of the other Jesuits and of the captive Native converts than for himself. As part of the ritual, the Iroquois drank his blood and ate his heart, as they wanted to absorb Brébeuf’s courage in enduring the pain.[31] The Iroquois mocked baptism by pouring boiling water over his head.[32]….” Wiki
===========July 12, 2020 at 11:12 am #117890znModeratorThe Wiki story below has Too many Ironies to even begin to unvavel. I am in awe of the many ironies.
Have you seen “Black Robe”?
This trailer is misleading in many respects but does capture the film’s visual style….the trailer sets up the priest/protagonist as a classic hero on a quest, but the truth is the film is about him unlearning many thing the hard way.
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from the wiki
Black Robe was praised as a “magnificently staged combination of top talents delivering a gripping and tragic story”, and has been rated one of the most meticulously researched representations of indigenous life put on film. Notably, the film includes dialogue in the Cree, Mohawk, and Algonquin languages. The French characters speak English in the film.
July 12, 2020 at 7:14 pm #117917wvParticipantNever even heard of that film. I’ll have to check it out.
w
vJuly 12, 2020 at 11:33 pm #117921znModeratorNews: The @Redskins intend to announce Monday that they will be retiring the nickname, per sources. New name still TBA. https://t.co/SHkLlBQpAx
— Ben Fischer (@BenFischerSBJ) July 13, 2020
July 12, 2020 at 11:54 pm #117925JackPMillerParticipantAccording to this guy, It is going to be the Washington Red Wolves. If correct, they are the only NFL team to have two names as a team name, unlike MLB that has the White Sox, Red Sox, Blue Jays & the former Devil Rays for example.
Damn it’s official The Washington @redksins are now the REDWOLVES HAHA wow that made my day #FREE58 pic.twitter.com/wjH4AQzmtS
— SACKMANLIVES (@JuniorGalette93) July 12, 2020
July 13, 2020 at 2:20 am #117926JackPMillerParticipantWashington trademark squatter adds to his portfolio
Posted by Mike Florio on July 12, 2020, 12:20 PM EDTAs Washington prepares to change its name, it may have to deal with a man named Martin McCaulay.
In recent weeks, McCaulay has squatted on several potential names for the team, via applications filed with the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. It’s not a new hobby for McCaulay; back in 2015, FOX5 highlighted McCaulay’s effort to get ahead of the curve.
“I can really see into the future on this issue,” McCaulay told FOX5 at the time. “Now when I look into the future, I see no change for ten years, and then in ten years, I see the name changing to the Washington Warriors. And if not the Warriors, then the Americans.”
McCaulay’s vision was a bit cloudy. Only five years after predicting no change in the next 10, the name is changing.
As of the posting of the FOX5 story in May 2015, McCaulay had registered for trademark protection on the following Washington-based names: Americans, Bravehearts, Federals, Forces, Founders, Gladiators, Monuments, Natives, Pandas, Pigskins, Red-Tailed Hawks, Renegades, Sharks, Veterans, and Tribe. McCaulay told FOX5 that he had spent $20,000 to secure the various trademarks.
A Sunday search conducted by PFT of the USPTO’s public trademark database revealed that Phillip Martin McCaulay (it would be one hell of a coincidence if it wasn’t the same guy) has recently filed applications for the following trademarks: Washington Redtails (July 7 and July 5), Washington Monuments (July 6), Washington Veterans (July 6), Washington Renegades (July 6), Washington Red-Tailed Hawks (July 4), and Washington Americans (June 18).
Other related trademarks applications have been filed in recent weeks by Richard Garrison of Los Angeles (Washington Braves, July 5); David Woods of Alexandria, Virginia (Washington Freedom Fighters, July 5), F1rst World Apparel of Santa Clarita, California (Washington War Hogs, July 5), Raymond Luchi of Santa Rosa, California (Washington Radskins, July 4), and David Howard of Rockville Centre, New York (Washington Potomacs, July 3).
Baseball’s Washington Nationals claimed the name “Washington Senators” in 2008, per the USPTO database. Before the Montreal Expos became the Washington Nationals in 2005, the Washington Senators relocated to Texas and became the Rangers in 1972.
Washington owner Daniel Snyder previously had claimed the rights to “Washington Warriors.” The Washington Times recently reported that the team previously has abandoned that trademark.
The USPTO database shows that McCaulay filed an application for trademark protection of the Warriors name in July 2015.
The name Windtalkers/Wind Talkers and Codetalkers/Code Talkers currently are available. Those names would honor the Native Americans who worked in the Pacific theater during World War II to transmit messages that Japanese forces could not decode. In recent days, however, reports have emerged suggesting that the new name will have no connection to Native Americans.
Likewise, neither Red Wolves nor Redwolves have been claimed. In recent days, it has emerged as a viable option for the team’s new name. Likewise, Presidents currently isn’t claimed.
So, basically, it’s time for Martin McCaulay to get back to work.
July 13, 2020 at 10:05 am #117929znModerator— Washington Redskins (@Redskins) July 13, 2020
July 13, 2020 at 10:41 am #117932znModeratorJoe Yasharoff@JYash
According to the release, the name is not retired until completion of review so saying that the old name is gone is technically inaccurate. It will be gone but it is not currently gone. Leave it to this franchise to make a simple press release unclear.July 13, 2020 at 10:41 am #117933AgamemnonParticipantJuly 13, 2020 at 12:53 pm #117938znModeratorAndrew Siciliano@AndrewSiciliano
Washington’s name change is the first by an @NFL franchise that is NOT, in any way, relocation related since the Pirates became the Steelers in 1940.**(Titans/Jets were AFL in 1963)
July 13, 2020 at 2:33 pm #117946JackPMillerParticipantJuly 13, 2020 at 6:00 pm #117951znModerator#SimpleSolutions @Redskins Who says no? pic.twitter.com/QJ0vP41OSI
— 𝒥𝒾𝓂 𝐸𝓋𝑒𝓇𝑒𝓉𝓉 (@Jim_Everett) July 13, 2020
July 14, 2020 at 2:46 pm #117979znModeratorMcClain: Forced to do right thing, Washington owner profits nonetheless https://t.co/VWr1ywKUMh
— John McClain (@McClain_on_NFL) July 14, 2020
July 14, 2020 at 6:04 pm #117994znModeratorA scientist who’s spent a decade studying red wolves says Washington’s NFL team could help save the species https://t.co/QWgH34p19C
— Dan Steinberg (@dcsportsbog) July 14, 2020
July 15, 2020 at 1:12 pm #118016znModeratorOn the Shameful and Skewed ‘Redskins’ Poll
The Washington Post did a grave disservice by utterly ignoring studies that clearly demonstrate the harm mascotting causes.MAY 25, 2016
https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/on-the-shameful-and-skewed-redskins-poll/
Last Thursday, The Washington Post published a poll on its front page that found that 90 percent of “Native Americans” were “not bothered” by the dictionary-defined ethnic slur “Redskins,” sending shock waves through the sports world and Indian Country. That slur, of course, is also the name of the local NFL franchise that the Post covers.
This article is part of the Edge of Sports series, an ongoing effort to publish new writers on the intersection of sports and politics.
To get this number, the Post’s polling team questioned 504 self-identified Native Americans from all 50 states. Given that I have 50 first cousins who are enrolled in the Navajo and Yankton Dakota Sioux Nations, none of whom likes the team name, I found the results to be curious. When I looked more closely at the methodology of the poll, I was appalled.
First and foremost, the Post states clearly that they did not verify the actual Native American identity or tribal enrollment of its respondents. Unlike most “minorities,” non-Native Americans have often declared themselves Native American with little or no factual evidence or cultural connection whatsoever. Furthermore, 56 percent of those asked said they were not part of any tribal nation or could not name what tribe their ancestors claimed. Imagine asking 500 white Americans for an opinion about Europe and not caring that more than half had no connection to their ancestors’ place of origin.
When asked about this (via e-mail), Scott Clement, the polling director at the Post responded:
We see little reason to suspect respondents would intentionally misreport their racial identity or tribal status to a confidential survey. The overall poll results suggest respondents understood a distinction between racial identification and tribal membership, given that a majority of self-identified Native Americans said they were not enrolled. The substantive questions about the team’s name came at the end of polls on other subjects and after survey respondents already had self-identified, leaving no motive (or even opportunity) for individuals to self-identify as Native American when they learned that the questions would center on the team’s name.
Leaving aside the issues of “self-identification,” there is also a problem with demographics. More than half, 274, were over the age of 50. Native Americans have a median age of 26—nearly 10 years younger than the general American population. The Post claims that they “weighted” the results to make sure that those over 50 were given just 39 percent of the voice. But even with “weighting,” by speaking primarily to people over 50—and then including their quotes in the piece as representative of the survey—the Post presented an inaccurate portrait of who we are as a people.
Male respondents also outnumbered female ones, which was quite a feat as Native American men have the highest mortality rates in the country. I remember when my dad was in his 50s and he went back to his reservation in South Dakota and was shocked to realize he was the only Yankton Dakota man left from his high-school class.
Furthermore, only 76, or 15 percent, of respondents were under the age of 29—and none of the respondents were under 18. Clement said that the Post never polls people under 18. “Our national surveys typically interview the adult population both for its relevance to voting and political participation and practical difficulties in reaching respondents who are younger than that age, i.e. ethical considerations about obtaining parental permission to participate.”
But not polling this segment of the population means the results exclude the Native American students who attend the 2,000 high schools in this country that mascot Native Americans. The White House Initiative on American Indian and Alaska Native Education report [PDF] recounts firsthand experiences of Native youth facing discrimination in their learning environment caused by mascotting.
Aside from demographics, there was also the geographic distribution of the poll. Very few were from areas of the country where most Native American people reside. Only 12 percent of those polled were from the Mountain region where 18 out of 20 of the most heavily populated Native American reservation communities are, according to the US Census. However, 36 percent of the respondents were from the South, where in 1836 most of the Native American population was forcibly marched out on the Trail of Tears. Now, according to the Census, only 13 percent of the total estimated population of Native Americans lives in the South. Clement said that this did not affect their results, e-mailing, “Respondents in the Mountain region were among the most likely to report enrollment with a tribe (67 percent did so), but the share who said the Washington Redskins’ team name was offensive was little different from the overall results (8 percent).”
Brian Pollard, board member of the Native American Journalists Association and former Cherokee Phoenix editor said to me, “What they’ve created is a piece of data that drives a narrative they desired. This is pretty much frowned upon in the world of journalism to create a story in this way. It would be different if Stanford did a poll and The Washington Post covered it. That to me would be much more ethical from a journalistic standpoint. But this was way beyond that. This was something they manufactured from the beginning.”
Even if the poll was conducted perfectly and even if the results had been completely reversed, The Washington Post did a grave disservice by utterly ignoring studies that clearly demonstrate the harm mascotting causes to Native youth—the most vulnerable population in the country by almost any statistic.
Our young people have a rate of suicide 2.5 times higher than average. According to the American Psychological Association, which has called for the ending of the practice of mascotting, Native youth suffer measurably lower self-esteem after exposure to a Native American mascot. It also found that Native respondents who claim to be okay with Native mascots actually experience a greater drop in self-esteem. This finding is particularly relevant to the Washington Post poll, which has been widely interpreted as proof that there’s no harm in using the slur for a $2 billion NFL franchise in the nation’s capital.
On Friday the Native American Journalist Association in conjunction with UNITY: Journalists of Diversity issued a statement criticizing the poll for violating the tenet to “minimize harm” in reporting.
The reporters and editors behind this story must have known that it would be used as justification for the continued use of these harmful, racist mascots. They were either willfully malicious or dangerously naïve in the process and reporting used in this story, and neither is acceptable from any journalistic institution…. It is NAJA’s position that journalism should only be practiced when it is in the interest of public enlightenment and democracy, and should never be used as a tool of racial oppression or corporate cheerleading.
Scott Clement responded to NAJA, writing:
The Post pursued this poll without any idea as to how it would turn out and had no vested interest in the outcome. When activists argue that Native Americans are offended by the name—and when debate over the name is at the center of a major public-policy debate—it’s entirely appropriate for a news organization to conduct a survey to test any assertions made about the breadth and depth of offense among Native Americans. This is customary for any other public policy issue.”
But is this really customary? Are pollsters judging the “breadth and depth” of how offensive other dictionary-defined slurs are? Tragically, it is only Native Americans who have to suffer this kind of humiliation, especially when the multibillion-dollar brand of the paper’s local football team hangs in the balance.
Jacqueline KeelerTWITTERJacqueline Keeler is a Navajo/Yankton Dakota Sioux writer living in Portland, Oregon and co-founder of Eradicating Offensive Native Mascotry (creators of the hashtag #NotYourMascot). She is finishing a collection of essays called Not Your Disappearing Indian and editing an anthology of Native voices for Torrey House Press on preserving sacred lands.
July 19, 2020 at 11:55 am #118138wvParticipantJuly 20, 2020 at 2:35 pm #118166znModeratorNever even heard of that film. I’ll have to check it out.
w
vActually the whole film is on youtube.
July 23, 2020 at 12:28 pm #118294znModeratorEffective immediately, Washington will call itself the “Washington Football Team”, pending adoption of a new name, sources tell ESPN.
This is not a final renaming and rebranding for team; this is the name it wants to use until pending adoption of a new name in the future. pic.twitter.com/sBs0Uo0ICm
— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) July 23, 2020
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Washington will not have any change to its color scheme. It will still use burgundy and gold. The Redskins logo on the helmet will be replaced by the player’s number in gold. The Washington Football Team will debut its home uniforms in week 1 against the Eagles. pic.twitter.com/8DpC6b0Tyj
— Adam Schefter (@AdamSchefter) July 23, 2020
July 24, 2020 at 11:30 am #118339znModerator.@WashingtonNFL Head Coach Ron Rivera says the team's colors will not change.
"To change the colors would kind of distract from what this team has done in terms, of its past history, with the championships that its won." — @RiverboatRonHC pic.twitter.com/xmGGEjk4vE
— CBS This Morning (@CBSThisMorning) July 24, 2020
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Ron Rivera: Washington NFL team 'not close' on new name, process will take 16-18 months https://t.co/S3b3HQvlJk
— Joe Curley (@vcsjoecurley) July 24, 2020
July 29, 2020 at 4:34 pm #118588znModeratorJuly 29, 2020 at 7:28 pm #118602wvParticipantI’d like to know WHY it takes 18 months to figure out a name
for a football team?Its a football team.
w
vAugust 2, 2020 at 10:14 pm #118804znModeratorHave you seen “Black Robe”?
I of course put the whole actual movie in this thread. But either way here’s a better trailer.
August 5, 2020 at 4:21 pm #118900znModeratorthe numbers are being added to new helmets 🔥🔥🔥 pic.twitter.com/feCyO2sBqG
— Washington Football Team (@WashingtonNFL) August 5, 2020
August 7, 2020 at 2:33 am #118975znModeratorThe Washington Football Team is removing the word "Redskins" from their stadium.pic.twitter.com/NjYZoyQT7a
— Dov Kleiman (@NFL_DovKleiman) August 6, 2020
August 13, 2020 at 4:31 pm #119234znModeratorMinority owners of the Washington Football Team are reportedly pressuring owner Dan Snyder to sell the franchise https://t.co/0f7TFoY3pD
— Sports Illustrated (@SInow) August 13, 2020
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