Bucs fire Lovie, Coughlin resigns, which naturally leads to Fisher discussion

The Bucs are an embarrassment. Lovie should have gotten a third year. Even worse, Jeff Fisher, who should be fired, is still the Head Coach.

zn wrote:

JackPMiller wrote:

The Bucs are an embarrassment. Lovie should have gotten a third year. Even worse, Jeff Fisher, who should be fired, is still the Head Coach.

My bet is that Fisher works out just fine this year.

Unless of course he once more has to deal with both a qb problem and OL issues (including youth and injuries). Cause those were the real cause of the record. IMO scapegoating the coach for that isn’t good football business.

Furthermore, I think there is value in continuity. Teams that constantly start over win less than teams that have continuity. And it’s Kroneke’s style to keep his team stable, so I never thought he WOULD fire Fisher. Whether he should or not is a fair question, but I’m still in favor of keeping Fisher and Snead. They have put together a lot of talent, and it hasn’t produced a winner because of the QBs. And even if you want to blame Snisher for the Foles disaster, I think that’s the only thing that they’ve really screwed up in four years.

I thought Fisher did a good job his first year here, but that must have been due to a weak schedule, because the team hasn’t done better since.

7-8-1
7-9
6-10
7-9

Now, if we look back at his days with the Oilers/Titans, he started out:

7-9
8-8
8-8
8-8

His fifth year was the turnaround. That was 1999. 13-3 and a trip to the Super Bowl thanks to that miracle special teams play. Then, one yard away from forcing OT for the championship.

So, maybe 2016-2017 is the season the Rams go back to the Super Bowl … if only they hang on to Fisher.

I think they are going to trade Foles and draft Cook. Cook had a bad playoff game and is falling a bit. Treadwell’s draft status is probably linked to his 40 time at the combine. We should interview all the OCs that out coached GW.

Irony: Fisher breaks 8 wins and gets fired next year. 😉

wv wrote:

Well, I think we’d all love a Foles trade-away.
But who is gonna want him? I mean would ‘you’
give a 7th round pick for him? I wouldn’t.

I imagine the Rams would have to agree to pick
up half his salary or somethin.

I dont want anymore players named Cook.
The last good cook who played in the NFL
was the Bengals Greg Cook. Now ‘there’
was an old-school football player.

w
v

He would be incredibly cheap for another team, cause we are on the hook for almost all of is salary. Coaches always think they can fix a player.

Eternal Ramnation wrote:

. If a coach has no accountability

This is all “record” v. “context.” In my view he DID turn the corner, but 2014’s OL and qb injuries, plus the 2015 qb meltdown, delayed that.

That’s not not holding him accountable, that’s looking realistically at what happened. I am a context guy and always have been. To me the “just look at the record and shoot” method is just…nothing. I’m like Will Smith in the first Men in Black, during the test to determine who gets to be a MiB. Remember the shooting scene with the simulation? Quote below.

And Jack, I don’t see how inappropriately racializing the issue is even a tiny bit relevant. That’s just some talking head going off the rails.

Well, first I was gonna pop this guy hanging from the street light, and I realized, y’know, he’s just working out. I mean, how would I feel if somebody come runnin’ in the gym and bust me in my ass while I’m on the treadmill? Then I saw this snarling beast guy, and I noticed he had a tissue in his hand, and I’m realizing, y’know, he’s not snarling, he’s sneezing. Y’know, ain’t no real threat there. Then I saw little Tiffany. I’m thinking, y’know, eight-year-old white girl, middle of the ghetto, bunch of monsters, this time of night with quantum physics books? She about to start some shit, Zed. She’s about eight years old, those books are WAY too advanced for her. If you ask me, I’d say she’s up to something.

PA Ram wrote:

Fisher is what he is.

He’s a .500 coach.

I don’t agree with that. Calling Fisher a .500 coach ignores the shape of the actual record. His record worked this way, from the start: longish valleys of .500 or below, but always with a reason (like, moving from Houston with no home when they moved, or later, being hit by a combo of injuries plus cap issues). The valleys are followed by peaks of consecutive winning seasons. To me, just averaging that all together without making distinctions provides you with nothing but an empty abstraction.

Once again, it’s record v. context.

I will always be a context guy. IMO just looking at the record by itself tells you nothing.

Watching the Rams the last couple of years tells me that if they had A qb (any decent starting qb) they would have won more games in 2014 and 2015. That is so self-evident I am not sure who would deny it. The OL ups and downs don’t help either.

Fisher HAS built contenders, so I don’t see why he won’t again.

..

zn wrote:

Eternal Ramnation wrote:

. If a coach has no accountability

This is all “record” v. “context.” In my view he DID turn the corner, but 2014’s OL and qb injuries, plus the 2015 qb meltdown, delayed that.

That’s not not holding him accountable, that’s looking realistically at what happened. I am a context guy and always have been. To me the “just look at the record and shoot” method is just…nothing. I’m like Will Smith in the first Men in Black, during the test to determine who gets to be a MiB. Remember the shooting scene with the simulation? Quote below.

And Jack, I don’t see how inappropriately racializing the issue is even a tiny bit relevant. That’s just some talking head going off the rails.

Well, first I was gonna pop this guy hanging from the street light, and I realized, y’know, he’s just working out. I mean, how would I feel if somebody come runnin’ in the gym and bust me in my ass while I’m on the treadmill? Then I saw this snarling beast guy, and I noticed he had a tissue in his hand, and I’m realizing, y’know, he’s not snarling, he’s sneezing. Y’know, ain’t no real threat there. Then I saw little Tiffany. I’m thinking, y’know, eight-year-old white girl, middle of the ghetto, bunch of monsters, this time of night with quantum physics books? She about to start some shit, Zed. She’s about eight years old, those books are WAY too advanced for her. If you ask me, I’d say she’s up to something.

ZN I’m not saying hold him accountable for the injuries , I do think he bears some responsibility for the “meltdown” though . I’m talking about all kinds of stuff, GRob’s head is swimming his rookie year and Fisher does the musical chairs with him. Starting 2 rookies and the still raw GRob and what the hell lets change to the zone blocking scheme that nobody’s run before. The penalties the penalties the penalties .Showing up in Wash.,Balt and S.F. with that team the one that looks like it doesn’t have a coach. MN,Balt, Wash, S.F. winnable games that weren’t won. The Bears game, that was ridiculous. Then there’s that Fisher thing where he brings in Cook and Britt from the after the contender day’s at Ten.Never did like Sherman as WR coach one constant is they never seem to run to the sticks and can’t catch it anyway especially when its 3rd down. Slants were rare as hen’s teeth but on the rare occasion they threw one it was unstoppable. Dedicating to run the spread in 13 and bailing a couple weeks in even though they were scoring enough points to have gone undefeated with ’15’s D. My view is it’s been misstep after misstep. He did build a contender but that team followed the same graph as the GSOT and was a lot less fun to watch. IOW the contender is singular not plural or multiple. My questions were serious though what is his job what is he accountable for what would warrant his firing?

i don’t know. i’d give serious thought to hiring lovie or coughlin if either were interested.

• This reply was modified 8 years, 10 months ago by InvaderRam.

I would go after Hue Jackson. I feel We need to get an Offensive coach. Someone that can utilize the talent we have. Foles is not that bad, look at his time in Philly, especially a few years ago. He needs proper coaching, and Fisher is not it.

zn wrote:

JackPMiller wrote:

Foles is not that bad

Yes Foles is that bad.

And the coaching is certainly not so bad that it would turn a good qb into a one THAT bad by itself. In fact, that would be historical level bad coaching, worse even than the Linehan years.

Foles melted down. It was visible. It was openly there to see. Had nothing to do with coaching.

I agree with that. Foles was just awful. Has he looked better before? Yes.

Not this year.

Yeah, draft another QB. I hope the Answer is Mannion, but draft a QB.

As for Foles, he is a nice guy. Good luck, Nick, in whatever you do next.