our reactions to the 49ers game

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  • November 30, 2020 at 12:26 am #125065
    Herzog
    Participant

    Goff the last four games: 6 interceptions, 4 fumbles. Just throwing that out there.

    November 30, 2020 at 12:34 am #125066
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator
    Herzog wrote:

    Goff the last four games: 6 interceptions, 4 fumbles. Just throwing that out there.

    Last 4 includes a game they won when they couldn’t run and relied on passing 51 times against a top defense.

    You’re my lifelong brother, H, but, counting just the negative doesn’t give the full picture.

    It’s a real question as to whether the future is in the bad games or the good games or endless oscillation between the 2.

    Though actually it’s 3 bad games out of 11 (since I don’t put the Bills loss on the offense). Not that even just 3 is acceptable.

    But I’ve already responded in this thread too much. 😎

    November 30, 2020 at 12:48 am #125067
    Avatar photojoemad
    Participant

    I’d take Bradford over Bulger….

    I can’t believe the shit Goff is getting today… this thread is like a Rams Facebook page…

    Will to win:

    CJ Anderson 44 yards in NFC Championship, GURLEY WITH 10!!!!

    Fetal position Everett over Goff??? and I liked Jim.

    HOLY SHIT!

    November 30, 2020 at 12:49 am #125068
    Herzog
    Participant

    Fair enough…. I feel like he’s trending down, but let’s see what happens next week. I hope I’m wrong.

    November 30, 2020 at 10:00 am #125082
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator

    I don’t really blame QBs for strip sack fumbles. You have to expose the ball in order to throw it, and if your arm gets hit when you are cocking to throw, that’s just a good play by the defense. I do blame Goff for the fumble when running, though. If he’s going to tuck and run, he’s got to secure the ball.

    I completely forgot about Bradford. I liked Bradford, but it’s really hard to rank him since he played on some of the worst teams I’ve ever rooted for, and suffered some injuries. I’d like to see what Bradford could have done on this team. I’d guess he would be better than Goff, but who knows?

    I will grant that Everett’s phantom sack is the most ignominious moment in Rams’ history, but he could make every throw.

    November 30, 2020 at 10:24 am #125083
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator
    Zooey wrote:

    . I’d guess he would be better than Goff, but who knows?

    Well good, here’s a chance for a completely NEW board war! 😉

    IMO but…Bradford just never had the same degree of sheer qb talent Goff does.

    …

    November 30, 2020 at 10:44 am #125084
    Avatar photojoemad
    Participant

    Everett could make every throw? The floater to a wide open flipper Anderson in the NFC Championship that had more hang time than a Ray Guy punt that Lott batted away… turning point in that game….. THE WILL TO WIN!!!

    He was so good that he couldn’t beat out TJ Rubley…..

    BTW, I can’t believe even Chris Miller’s name was dropped on here…should’ve kept Chandlier over Miller….

    November 30, 2020 at 11:53 pm #125103
    Avatar photoRamsMaineiac
    Keymaster
    Zooey wrote:

    In my life:

    1. Warner
    2. Bulger
    3. Everett
    4. Goff

    So from another angle, better than Sam Bradford, Tony Banks, and Miller in the waning years of his career. Hardly high praise.

    That is exactly how I am feeling about the 5th highest paid player in the NFL in 2020. Very disappointed. He has become a liability to this team and I for one am done hoping for a upside. In four years He has not progressed or improved in a manner than warrants making him a cornerstone of this team. He is too hot and cold and inconsistency is really a terrible trait for a QB. This reminds me a bit of Ferragamo in that regard. Personally, I am ready to let him go in 2022, when the cap hit is palatable, and roll the dice with someone new.

    December 1, 2020 at 12:18 am #125105
    Avatar photowv
    Participant

    The fumble by Goff at the end of his run was dreadful. Just dreadful. I totally understand McVay’s reaction after the game.

    I dont like to pile on Goff, but that play alone gives him an “F” for that game.
    That was one of the worst plays I’ve seen a Ram QB make. Ever.
    I still cant believe that one.

    Goff can still have a good year. The NFC does not have a dominant team.

    w
    v

    December 1, 2020 at 12:43 am #125107
    Avatar photoRamsMaineiac
    Keymaster

    Also, on the Game Winning drive front I am not sure its a measurable/meaningful stat, because the context of does your team get behind in the first place is important. For example, Kurt Warner only had 4 in 50 starts with the Rams (8%), but I would take him in the clutch over Goff every time. Bulger had 16 out of 95 starts (17%).

    In the division:
    Goff has 8 GWDs in 65 starts (12%)
    Russell Wilson has 30 in 138 starts (22%)
    Jimmy Garappolo has 7 in 32 starts (22%)
    Kyler Murray has 5 in 27 starts (19%)

    Heck, former Rams back up Blake Bortles has 8 in 73 starts (11%)

    QBs with a similar number of starts include:
    Mariota has 15 in 61 starts (25%)
    Dak Prescott has 15 in 69 starts (22%)
    Nick Foles has 12 in 55 starts (22%)
    Deshaun Watson has 10 in 48 starts (21%)
    Baker Mayfield has 7 in 40 starts (18%)
    Jameis Winston has 11 in 70 starts (16%)
    Mitchell Trubisky has 7 in 45 starts (16%)
    Wentz has 10 in 66 starts (15%)
    Patrick Mahomes has 6 in 42 starts (14%)

    Current active leaders
    Drew Brees has 53 in 283 starts (19%)
    Tom Brady has 47 in 295 starts (16%)

    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/leaders/gwd_active.htm

    I guess my point is, Being clutch is more of a gut feel and I don’t think Goff is known as a QB who is know for his grit and determination to carry a team in adversity.

    December 1, 2020 at 1:58 am #125110
    Herzog
    Participant

    Woolford time!

    December 1, 2020 at 3:12 am #125112
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator
    RamsMaineiac wrote:

    Also, on the Game Winning drive front I am not sure its a measurable/meaningful stat, because the context of does your team get behind in the first place is important.

    Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in. 😎

    Rich, I don’t agree with your take on close games and what the ability to win them means. Good teams play other good teams and many decisive games are close near the end. For example, the 99 GSOT Rams did not pull ahead in the championship game against Tampa until the Proehl TD in the last 4-something minutes, and the superbowl winning TD to Bruce came after the 2 minute warning. And the GSOT Rams set a record for scoring, so sometimes even a prolific offense ends up in a close game.

    To be a qb in a team trying to finalize a win in a close game or to come from behind, the qb has to play effectively under time duress and more often than not with the wide-open expectation that they have to pass to win. If a qb is effective under those conditions it says a lot about him. If a team believes in the qb under those conditions it also says a lot about him.

    And often it’s the case that the defense is allowing the other team to score so the game is close because the offense has to keep answering. So it matters that in the 2nd SF game in 2019, the Rams offense had to come from behind to tie the game late in the 4th (and then the defense blew the game on consecutive third and longs).

    Just watching those games you saw a focused qb who was always capable of developing into something more in time.

    I looked at GWD/comeback wins over the last 2 1/2 years, and Goff has 8 in those 46 games. But all the number of them does is tell you that he did them. You actually have to remember the games themselves to decide what qualities Goff demonstrated in those situations.

    But the sheer number doesn’t matter as much, other than what it generally indicates about the qb IF that is you remember the specific games and what the qb did in them. As opposed to just the sheer number taken in itself, the real stat, which we don’t have, tells you the percentage of wins a qb has in that situation. But no one provides that stat. (For example, and this surprises a lot of people, Rodgers has not won a high percentage of close games in comeback situations.)

    Either way the upshot is that I am still a Goff advocate in general and unless what happened Sunday is a trend over the next games, I will just say that all qbs have bad games in their 5th year, or at least I have not found any who didn’t.

    I also don’t put all of last Sunday on Goff. For that matter I don’t put any of the 3 bad games in 2020 entirely on Goff. In all 3 cases, there was the eerie 2018 superbowl effect of watching the team be outcoached, or struggle against a defensive gameplan the playcalling couldn’t crack. But that doesn’t have me giving up on McVay, either. I think he too will develop when it comes to that.

    …

    ….

    December 1, 2020 at 10:25 am #125118
    Avatar photoRamsMaineiac
    Keymaster

    I was imprecise in what I thought was meaningless. The ability to pull off comebacks is ultimately important, and the QB plays a key role in that ability. What I think is meaningless is the statistic of # of game winning drives, as a pure number or % frequency. Certain QBs are just presented with fewer opportunities to come from behind. My position is Goff is not a good QB when behind and the QB needs to step up—I believe his performance is pretty below average when faced with adversity.

    2020 When Behind by 1-8 Points
    1. Deshaun Watson (Houston Texans), 134.4 QBR, 9 TDs, 0 INT
    2. Baker Mayfield (Cleveland Browns), 132.6 QBR, 10 TDs, 1 INT
    3. Russell Wilson (Seattle Seahawks), 127.3 QBR, 9 TDs, 2 INT
    4. Taysom Hill (New Orleans Saints), 121.6 QBR, 6 TDs, 1 INT
    5. Gardner Minshew (Jacksonville Jaguars), 115.6 QBR, 8 TDs, 2 INT
    6. Patrick Mahomes (Kansas City Chiefs), 111.5 QBR, 8 TDs, 1 INT
    7. Matthew Stafford (Detroit Lions), 105 QBR, 3 TDs, 0 INT
    8. Derek Carr (Las Vegas Raiders), 103.4 QBR, 5 TDs, 2 INT
    9. Tom Brady (Tampa Bay Buccaneers), 103.1 QBR, 9 TDs, 1 INT
    10. Ben Roethlisberger (Pittsburgh Steelers), 102.7 QBR, 8 TDs, 1 INT
    11. Aaron Rodgers (Green Bay Packers), 102.6 QBR, 4 TDs, 0 INT
    12. Justin Herbert (Los Angeles Chargers), 102.1 QBR, 8 TDs, 4 INT
    13. Philip Rivers (Indianapolis Colts), 100.9 QBR, 5 TDs, 3 INT
    14. Kirk Cousins (Minnesota Vikings), 100.3 QBR, 6 TDs, 3 INT
    15. Josh Allen (Buffalo Bills), 98.9 QBR, 5 TDs, 1 INT
    16. Dak Prescott (Dallas Cowboys), 96.4 QBR, 4 TDs, 3 INT
    17. Jimmy Garoppolo (San Francisco 49ers), 93.9 QBR, 1 TDs, 0 INT
    18. Lamar Jackson (Baltimore Ravens), 92.7 QBR, 2 TDs, 1 INT
    19. Kyler Murray (Arizona Cardinals), 90.5 QBR, 4 TDs, 1 INT
    20. Mitchell Trubisky (Chicago Bears), 89.8 QBR, 1 TDs, 0 INT
    21. Teddy Bridgewater (Carolina Panthers), 87.2 QBR, 4 TDs, 4 INT
    22. Carson Wentz (Philadelphia Eagles), 84.6 QBR, 6 TDs, 3 INT
    23. Ryan Tannehill (Tennessee Titans), 80.6 QBR, 3 TDs, 3 INT
    24. Jared Goff (Los Angeles Rams), 79.2 QBR, 2 TDs, 3 INT
    25. Cam Newton (New England Patriots), 76.4 QBR, 1 TDs, 3 INT
    26. Daniel Jones (New York Giants), 74.6 QBR, 3 TDs, 4 INT
    27. Ryan Fitzpatrick (Miami Dolphins), 74.4 QBR, 1 TDs, 3 INT
    28. Sam Darnold (New York Jets), 65.3 QBR, 1 TDs, 1 INT
    29. Matt Ryan (Atlanta Falcons), 60.1 QBR, 0 TDs, 4 INT
    30. Drew Lock (Denver Broncos), 57.8 QBR, 1 TDs, 3 INT
    31. Alex Smith (Washington Football Team), 54.5 QBR, 1 TDs, 3 INT
    32. Brandon Allen (Cincinnati Bengals), 25.9 QBR, 0 TDs, 1 INT

    I recognize that no one is saying Goff is having good year in the clutch in 2020, but I don’t think he was much better last year and I could not find career based situational stats.

    December 1, 2020 at 10:28 am #125120
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator
    RamsMaineiac wrote:

    So from another angle, better than Sam Bradford, Tony Banks, and Miller in the waning years of his career. Hardly high praise….

    I guess my point is, Being clutch is more of a gut feel and I don’t think Goff is known as a QB who is know for his grit and determination to carry a team in adversity.

    I will say that I think there is a spacious gap between Goff at 4 (in my book) and whoever occupies the 5 spot. The best QBs after that #4 were broken in some way, over the hill, or on very bad teams, and are tough to rate.

    That last comment – grit, determination, carry the team in adversity – that’s the quality I was talking about with the will to win. It isn’t just a question of whether a QB can put the team ahead in the final minutes of the game. It’s that “Fuck this, we will not lose this game” thing that Patton brought to the field when he quarterbacked the Third Army at the Ardennes Bowl. I don’t see that in Goff. Of course, you don’t NEED that to win. It’s not often that quality is called for. I’m not blasting Goff. I’m just trying to understand what he is, and what he isn’t. And I think he’s a top 10 – 15 QB. That’s better than probably 90% of the guys who have taken a snap for the Rams post-Hadl.

    December 1, 2020 at 3:18 pm #125127
    Avatar photojoemad
    Participant

    “Fuck this, we will not lose this game” thing that Patton brought to the field when he quarterbacked the Third Army at the Ardennes Bowl. I don’t see that in Goff

    you didn’t see that vs KC, or in NO or with a 6-3 record vs Russel Wilson? Time consuming drives to seal games are also important in games where he hasn’t been in position to come-from-behind…. Goff is a decent closer.

    Grit, = getting back up when you’re knocked down to your knees….

    Goff has gotten back up every time. I mean I’m not sure many QBs would have a 43-29 WL record after getting his ass pounded with an 0-7 start under a Fisher regime, including getting a violent concussion from Richard Sherman in Goff’s first start in Seattle as a rookie.

    I’ve never seen Goff quit.

    SUre, it’s been frustrating to see the RAMS lose to SF, 4 straight, but those 4 losses should not be pinned on Goff.

    Quick note on Everett, and I liked him alot… but there’s a reason why that NFC Championship game in 89 was played in SF… he didn’t have the grit to win in the entire month of November, behind the best offense line that the Rams ever had….

    December 1, 2020 at 4:52 pm #125128
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator
    joemad wrote:

    you didn’t see that vs KC, or in NO or with a 6-3 record vs Russel Wilson? Time consuming drives to seal games are also important in games where he hasn’t been in position to come-from-behind…. Goff is a decent closer.

    Grit, = getting back up when you’re knocked down to your knees….

    Goff has gotten back up every time. I mean I’m not sure many QBs would have a 43-29 WL record after getting his ass pounded with an 0-7 start under a Fisher regime, including getting a violent concussion from Richard Sherman in Goff’s first start in Seattle as a rookie.

    I’ve never seen Goff quit.

    Sure, it’s been frustrating to see the RAMS lose to SF, 4 straight, but those 4 losses should not be pinned on Goff.

    Quick note on Everett, and I liked him alot… but there’s a reason why that NFC Championship game in 89 was played in SF… he didn’t have the grit to win in the entire month of November, behind the best offense line that the Rams ever had….

    I would never call Goff a quitter.

    Absolutely not.

    You know, when my first impression of Goff is that he is a lot like his idol, Joe Montana. He doesn’t get High; he doesn’t get Low. Even keel, all the time. Something almost…vacant…about his personality.

    Montana had the luxury of playing with Blue Chip players on offense all around, a Blue Chip defense, and coaches who went to the HOF on the first available date. Montana was lucky, seems to me. I mean…he was Good. But Montana is not the reason for those dynasties. IMO. This is actually interesting, now that we arrived at this spot. Because I will bet that Montana and Goff have a similar YPA.

    ++++ Okay…I just looked it up.

    Career YPA Montana (tied for 30th all time) 7.5/yds.
    Career YPA Goff (tied for 24th all time) 7.6/yds.

    Here’s some perspective on that:

    As for Everett, seems to me…as best as I can recall… that the Rams’ defense in those years was smoke and mirrors. They had, like, 1 or 2 blue chip players, 3 red chips, and a bunch of whatever. As I recall, they won with schemes. Like the famous playoff game against Philly. Everett played with Greg Bell, and Gaston Green, and Cleveland Gary. He and Dickerson overlapped about 7 or 8 games. Without Everett…with ANY of the Rams QBs from James Harris on…I don’t think the Rams make that playoff game against the 49ers in the first place. But those teams were Jim Everett, Henry Ellard, a stout OL, Kevin Greene, and nobody. Leroy Irvin, maybe. I might be forgetting a player or two.

    I guess I just see Everett and Goff as a tossup at this point.

    I will say this:

    Goff is pretty accurate – with occasional WTF throws (1-2 per game).

    Goff is steady. He is not impervious to pressure – it affects him – but he does not fold under it, either.

    Goff is resilient.

    He rolls out well, and throws well doing so, but is not a scrambler.

    He is mobile (not a statue), but he won’t punish a team for leaving a lane open.

    His deep ball is okay, but not a threat. He does not have a cannon for an arm.

    His pocket awareness is so-so. He does not get happy feet, or take phantom sacks, but he does not have a 6th sense, either, and will get strip sacked more than one would want.

    His clock awareness is ordinary.

    His improv skills are unremarkable.

    Don’t know about his audible skills, or even if that is a thing in the current offense.

    I mean…that’s how I see Goff right now.

    You rate him higher. Why?

    December 1, 2020 at 5:10 pm #125129
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator
    RamsMaineiac wrote:

    What I think is meaningless is the statistic of # of game winning drives, as a pure number or % frequency. Certain QBs are just presented with fewer opportunities to come from behind

    Oh I agree on just the number. That’s not a valid comparative stat. If Goff has 8 and Wilson has 11, those numbers in themselves don’t tell you much.

    In terms of percentage, yes that does tell you something. If Rodgers is in comeback situations 10 times and they only win 2, that very likely means he does not have the traits you value in that situation. Whereas if Wilson is in that situation 10 times and wins 7, that very likely means he does have the traits that are displayed in that situation.

    However nobody does percentage of wins in that situation as a stat. So it’s hard to do a valid comparison. That would mean going through every qb’s gamelogs for a few years. And, no one is going to do that.

    What we do when we hear about Goff’s comebacks is recall the situations. So for example winning on the road in New Orleans after coming back from 3 points down to tie in the final 15 seconds, and then to win in overtime…an ordinary game manager scrub can’t do that.

    Same thing displayed in the comeback from a tie win against Tampa 2 weeks ago. So whatever he displayed in New Orleans is still there.

    I like to think that knowing things like that can balance the discussion. Which is especially important when the qb lost a game that has everyone angry. My first impulse when everyone is angry at a player, is to drift to balance. Doesn’t mean the person drifting toward balance is right, but, I think it contributes to fuller discussion.

    …

    December 1, 2020 at 5:15 pm #125130
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator
    Zooey wrote:

    I mean…that’s how I see Goff right now.

    You rate him higher. Why?

    I am proud of this board and how we discuss this!

    Yay huddle.

    December 1, 2020 at 9:48 pm #125135
    Avatar photojoemad
    Participant

    His improv skills are unremarkable.

    Don’t know about his audible skills, or even if that is a thing in the current offense.

    I mean…that’s how I see Goff right now.

    You rate him higher. Why?

    I’m in alignment with most everything you said:

    Goff has also reminds me of Joe Montana…in addition, this McVay regime reminds me of the 49er Walsh regime in many ways… in team culture, game prep, playbook, play script etc… Walsh teams were able to go on the road and win consistently… win games in hostile places. McVay’s road and east coast record is similar to Walsh, which is remarkable….I think Goff’s and Montana’s “even keel” help with that.

    In fairness to Joe Montana, yes, he had blue chippers, but early on…… He had nobodies on offense… on defense, he did have over-the-hill Hacksaw and Fred Dean 6 weeks into the season and a great secondary, but that secondary was all rookies that the Walsh culture built into blue chippers…

    Clock awareness…. especially the play clock just kills me with Goff… But I will say this regarding an unsung play during the Monday Night game in Tampa to set up Gay’s FG right before half… Right after the Robert Woods catch, the Rams had to spike the ball to set up that kick….it was a thing of beauty, I think that goes back to McVay’s culture and Goff being even keel……. it was one of the coolest plays i’ve seen this season to set up that spike with 1 second to spare…That FG became the difference in the game.

    That’s where this quote comes to play:

    He doesn’t get High; he doesn’t get Low. Even keel, all the time. Something almost…vacant…about his personality…..His improv skills are unremarkable……..

    Neither did Bart Starr, nor Tom Brady, and Joe Montana…I don’t think that improv skills equate to consistent winning in the NFL, with the exception of maybe Russel Wilson, who is 3 – 6 vs the Rams…should be 2-7 if Zuerline nails the kick last year.

    That’s what I see in Goff over Everett, a smart accurate QB with guts while remaining calm….he won me over after that dismal rookie season…i’m not sure many QBs would over come a career start like that, with the exception of the Manning sisters…

    Also consider that Everett inherited a team that Jeff Kemp, Steve Dils, Dieter Brock and an over the hill Steve Bartkowski won with …he had Flipper, Ellard, Dickerson, and one of the best offensive lines that the Rams ever had…those Anaheinm teams of the 80s had a ton of probowlers on the O-Line that all sported Rolex watches from E.D……BTW, the Rams had to win the final game of the 86 season against SF to make the playoffs……. Everett got picked 3 fucking times….. They lost 4 straight in 89, at that’s not including that MNF game against SF where Everett fumbled the snap on the goal line to lose…fucking choker.

    They had the secondary of defense….Gary Green, Nolan Cromwell, Jerry Gray and Johnnie Johnson and the coke dealer guy… i forget his name in the secondary.

    In 87 when Dickerson was a baby and demanded a trade…Everett couldn’t win…Everett couldn’t win with Knox, nor Mora in NO…. Goff had Gurley, but not in crunch time of 2018 and 2019…

    I like the even keel of Goff over the muscle of Everett, and I was a huge Everett fan….

    Like Montana, Goff came to team that was a perennial loser and he helped them consistently win. I don’t think Everett could ever do that.

    December 1, 2020 at 10:05 pm #125136
    Avatar photocanadaram
    Participant
    RamsMaineiac wrote:

    He has become a liability to this team and I for one am done hoping for a upside. In four years He has not progressed or improved in a manner than warrants making him a cornerstone of this team. He is too hot and cold and inconsistency is really a terrible trait for a QB

    This is exactly how I feel. Although, I would express my opinion on Goff so incoherently that nobody would understand what I was trying to say. So, thank you.

    December 2, 2020 at 1:17 am #125143
    TSRF
    Participant

    So as I’m driving home from Boston today, they have a 10 Questions feature on 98.5 the Sports Hub. One of the questions was a redo of the 2016 draft. Lance Burkhart was the NFL expert and then there were 2 or 3 talking heads. They all picked Wentz over Goff. On a bright note, they all picked Ramsey above either QB!

    December 2, 2020 at 6:15 am #125147
    Avatar photocanadaram
    Participant
    TSRF wrote:

    So as I’m driving home from Boston today, they have a 10 Questions feature on 98.5 the Sports Hub. One of the questions was a redo of the 2016 draft. Lance Burkhart was the NFL expert and then there were 2 or 3 talking heads. They all picked Wentz over Goff.

    Up until last year I would have agreed with them. This year it’s a wash. I’m not particularly fond of either QB.

    December 2, 2020 at 2:59 pm #125155
    Herzog
    Participant

    Joe Montana WAS AMAZING. Goff ain’t no Montana. Back then, you could hit A QB on almost every play.

    December 2, 2020 at 3:33 pm #125156
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator
    joemad wrote:

    Also consider that Everett inherited a team that Jeff Kemp, Steve Dils, Dieter Brock and an over the hill Steve Bartkowski won with …he had Flipper, Ellard, Dickerson, and one of the best offensive lines that the Rams ever had

    Dickerson and Everett overlapped barely more than half a season, while Everett was an infant.

    The difference between a team with Dickerson, and a team with Gaston Green is spacious.

    In any event, as I said, I got Everett and Goff as more-or-less a toss-up, anyway. If you put Goff above Everett, I will not track you across the internet and harass you every step of the way for the rest of our lives.

    December 3, 2020 at 10:22 pm #125207
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator
    Zooey wrote:

    Career YPA Montana (tied for 30th all time) 7.5/yds.
    Career YPA Goff (tied for 24th all time) 7.6/yds.

    Here’s some perspective on that:

    just looking at ypa. and i think comparing across eras is difficult. it’s more informative to me to see how each player compares to his contemporaries.

    here are montana’s rankings among his contemporaries just looking at ypa.

    1979 – not even ranked in the top 30
    1980 – 22nd
    1981 – 9th
    1982 – 8th
    1983 – 8th
    1984 – 2nd
    1985 – 7th
    1986 – 12th
    1987 – 6th
    1988 – 8th
    1989 – 1st
    1990 – 6th
    1991 – injured
    1992 – not enough attemps to qualify

    jared goff
    2016 – not even ranked in the top 30
    2017 – 3rd
    2018 – 4th
    2019 – 14th
    2020 – 13th

    and then looking at aaron rodgers from 2008 until today.
    2008 – 9th
    2009 – 6th
    2010 – 2nd
    2011 – 1st
    2012 – 5th
    2013 – 2nd
    2014 – 2nd
    2015 – 30th
    2016 – 13th
    2017 – 18th
    2018 – 17th
    2019 – 8th
    2020 – 6th

    so…

    dunno…

    maybe the rams need a deep threat? defenses don’t respect the rams’ deep threat right now. they did when cooks was a ram…

    • This reply was modified 4 years ago by Avatar photoInvaderRam.
    December 3, 2020 at 10:42 pm #125212
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator
    canadaram wrote:
    RamsMaineiac wrote:

    He has become a liability to this team and I for one am done hoping for a upside. In four years He has not progressed or improved in a manner than warrants making him a cornerstone of this team. He is too hot and cold and inconsistency is really a terrible trait for a QB

    This is exactly how I feel. Although, I would express my opinion on Goff so incoherently that nobody would understand what I was trying to say. So, thank you.

    i don’t know. it’s easy to say let goff go and find another qb…

    it’s hard to find a good qb let alone a great qb.

    it’s so hard. right now goff is good. ok. he’s not great. but do you guys remember when the rams didn’t have a healthy good quarterback?

    his mental makeup is good. he’s tough. what he went through at cal. what he went through his rookie year. his mental makeup is solid. AT WORST.

    so a tough smart quarterback who stays healthy and has above average arm talent?

    i’ll continue to maintain that he’s a 10-15 qb. that’s still very hard to replace. my inclination would be to keep him. you can win a superbowl with him.

    get rid of him. and you get the rams from 2007-2015.

    December 4, 2020 at 5:22 pm #125228
    Avatar photoZooey
    Moderator
    InvaderRam wrote:

    i’ll continue to maintain that he’s a 10-15 qb. that’s still very hard to replace. my inclination would be to keep him. you can win a superbowl with him.

    get rid of him. and you get the rams from 2007-2015.

    I agree with that, and I agree they miss Cooks’ deep threat.

    December 4, 2020 at 6:13 pm #125230
    Avatar photozn
    Moderator

    alyoshamucci

    Game 11 Niners …

    I didn’t even do our last game against them … this one was better.

    Sorry about the wait … had some chaos this week.

    I generally take a while to get out of frustration from a loss, and get my emotion out of the way.

    So let me start by saying something as a student of psychology. When a team has your number, it affects everything you do … The Niners have our number. We have the Seahawks number. They beat us without Kittle and with a backup QB. Decimated by injury, didn’t matter.
    What McVay and Goff have to do now, is understand this psychological factor and stop pretending it doesn’t exist. We get their A plus game every time. Every game against them we’re getting playoff level competition and we need to prepare like it’s the playoffs. We have to overcome this sooner rather than later … or this will be a rock in our shoe every year.

    The Great

    1) Aaron Donald. I really just took a few meditative moments this week and enjoyed the gratitude I have for having the best football player I’ve ever seen on our team.

    The Good

    2) Akers getting his second breakaway of the year. Easing in rookies is a good thing in a complex system, I think it’s time to get him into the lead dog role.

    3) I also took a moment to be happy with the fact that the core of our offense is locked up for the forseeable future. They show up every week. Really can’t think of either one having an off game.

    4) Noteboom still handling OLT pretty well. I was confident that he’d be serviceable in pass pro and I’m watching college kids for someone in case he can’t take the next step in the run game.

    5) SJD is solid … just make a play here and there and it matters.

    6) I thought Nick Scott was playing pretty well … quick fills.

    7) Kenny Young got the type of TFL I was used to him getting at UCLA.

    8) Solid overall run D.

    9) Troy Hill having himself a nice day …

    10) Troy Reeder with a capable 12 tackles.

    11) Satisfied with Matt gay for now … glad Hekker put a word in …

    The Bad

    12) Why is Tyler Higbee trying to block Arik Armstead? Why didn’t anyone see that and think “maybe we should get into another play?”

    13) Overall TE presence in the passing game. It’s something that’s missing from last year and it seems like we need it back. I don’t know where Higbee’s mojo went but getting it back should be a top priority for the offensive staff.

    15) Why is Kerry Hyder sacking my QB?

    16) Maybe someone else can answer this … Woods and Kupp got 17 targets and 9 receptions … a little over 50% telling me that those guys were being more well covered. Why aren’t we designing plays to Reynolds more? The TEs?

    16) Goff’s accuracy … he looked like a different QB than the guy in Tampa. This harkens back to the being psyched out by the Niners thing I suggest is at play.

    17) Malcolm Brown fumbling? Dude … as a veteran back that’s the one things he should never do.

    18) Van Jefferson missing downs=ing the ball at the 1.

    The Ugly

    19) Losing to Nick Mullens.

    20) Getting swept by the 9ers.

    21) Jared. Dude. YOU ARE NOT A MOBILE QB. YOU DO NOT HAVE STRONG HANDS. I don’t know what he thinks when he’s running toward the sideline not looking downfield for a 0 yard gain? Is he hoping for a late hit penalty? Why is he exhausting himself and risking injury for 0 yards? that’s not a part of his game, can someone let him know?
    I know people are tearing him apart this week … and Im glad he’ll see the criticism. I think he’s our QB going forward for many years, but he HAS to stop thinking he’s a different QB than he is. His hands are not super strong and he’s prone to fumbling when hit. He’s also slow. Ball security has to get better.

    22) Pick 6 against us by a D linemen.

    23) Allowing that slant to Deebo. Why is Ramsey not on the only player hurting us? Guy had 12 targets and 10 catches before that play. He is their only offense and we allow him a layup for the win? Ugly.

    December 4, 2020 at 6:35 pm #125231
    Avatar photoInvaderRam
    Moderator
    zn wrote:

    The Great

    1) Aaron Donald. I really just took a few meditative moments this week and enjoyed the gratitude I have for having the best football player I’ve ever seen on our team.

    his talent really is transcendent.

    he’s only halfway there, but his trajectory certainly points to being an all-time great.

    i never saw deacon jones play. never saw merlin olsen play. but i imagine watching them was like what watching donald is now. just gotta savor every moment.

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