Recent Forum Topics › Forums › The Public House › Giuliani admits "Spygate" is PR to ward off impeachment
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Cal.
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May 28, 2018 at 11:49 am #86695
nittany ramModeratorTrump finally hired someone who (perhaps unwittingly so) will tell the truth on occasion.
Unfortunately for Trump, the truth usually hurts him.
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/05/giuliani-admits-spygate-is-pr-about-impeachment.html
Giuliani Admits ‘Spygate’ Is PR in Anticipation of Impeachment
By
Chas Danner
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CommentPretty much. Photo: Screencap/CNN/State of the Union
Trump lawyer Rudy Giuliani confirmed on Sunday that the president and his allies’ attempts to discredit the Mueller investigation — including the most recent so-called Spygate controversy — are part of a public relations campaign aimed at staving off impeachment. “It is for public opinion,” the former New York mayor admitted during an appearance on CNN’s State of the Union. And while trying to shape public opinion is the rarely acknowledged goal of any presidential administration, what Giuliani said next was unique to Trump’s: “Because eventually the decision here is going to be impeach or not impeach.”Giuliani’s comment came amid pressure from host Dana Bash to acknowledge that he and Trump were using a “very specific, very political strategy to undermine [the Mueller] investigation,” highlighting how a recent poll revealed a 15 percent drop in the number of Republicans who wanted Trump to testify in the probe. Bash and Giuliani had already talked about the unfounded Spygate allegation by Trump and his allies that the FBI had installed a spy in the Trump campaign to set up for collusion charges. (The FBI had actually warned Trump that Russia was trying to infiltrate his campaign.)
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Asked to confirm that these efforts to discredit the Mueller probe were just a political tactic, Giuliani first demurred, insisting that he and Trump have just been calling attention to the suspicions, not creating them. Then Bash specifically cited the Spygate claims and how no evidence had been offered to support them, and noted to Giuliani that he was both an experienced politician and a lawyer who clearly understood that the Trump team could feel free to attack the Russia investigation, since Mueller and his team would not be able to publicly defend themselves.
Appearing somewhat flummoxed, Giuliani tried to explain that he was only able to go on the attack because “they’re giving us the material,” meaning the missteps or alleged misconduct of federal law enforcement officials — though actually referring to Trump’s allies in Congress and in the conservative media. Then, surprisingly, he veered toward transparency:
Of course we have to [be aggressive in these attacks] to defend the president. We’re defending … um — to a large extent remember, Dana, we’re defending here … It is for public opinion. Because eventually the decision here is going to be impeach or not impeach. Members of Congress, Democrats and Republicans, are going to be informed a lot by their constituents. And so our jury is — as it should be — is the American people. And the American people, yes, are … Republicans, largely, independents, pretty substantially, and even some Democrats now question the legitimacy of [the Mueller investigation].
“Democrats, I suggest, from their own self interest: this is not a good issue to go into the congressional elections with,” he added, again confirming that the attacks on the Mueller investigation were not a legal strategy, but a political one. He went on to recite more talking points about how disreputable and partisan Mueller’s team was. Giuliani also tried to both not attack Mueller personally, while still insisting that the special counsel, who is a Republican, was an agent of the opposition party. Earlier in the interview, he said that he and the other members of Trump’s legal team (who don’t appear on television every day) have concluded that the investigation is “rigged.”
The whole interview was a ranging, befuddled affair, as most of Giuliani’s media appearances now tend to be regardless of how much oversharing he does.
Before acknowledging the PR angle, Giuliani clearly tried to reference Spygate as much as possible, using the word six times, and acting as though he was astonished by the allegations. He also tried to repeat Trump’s lie that former Director of National Intelligence James Clapper has admitted the FBI placed a spy in the Trump campaign — which Bash corrected him on.
Other times, the former U.S. attorney acknowledged he didn’t really know who was guilty and who was not. At one point, Giuliani said he “can’t be confident” there was no collusion between members of the Trump campaign and Russia, but claimed that the allegations came as a surprise to him and the president and others at the top of the campaign:
You go out to the outer orbit [of the campaign], how do I know what is going on? But I don’t think that would matter. You can’t — if there is collusion with a guy 50 rungs down on the campaign — not that I’m saying it happened, but, if it did, I don’t know — I don’t know what that means.
He also suggested the Justice Department’s indictment of 13 Russian nationals for meddling in the 2016 presidential election was “phony” and was only meant to impress the media. Asked by Bash if he considered the Mueller investigation to be legitimate, Giuliani made it sound as though he, too, had been convinced by all the attacks on the probe. “Not anymore,” he claimed.
TAGS: RUDY GIULIANI RUSSIA INVESTIGATION PRESIDENT TRUMP ROBERT MUELLER POLITICS
May 29, 2018 at 9:08 am #86725
Ramsey GlissadevilParticipantI don’t see any proof of Russia collusion except for the Uranium One collusion. What do I see? Over a year of investigation and zero evidence that Trump did anything wrong. I didn’t trust Trump a year ago, but now I’m coming around. It felt good get a raise at work, pay less taxes, and now Trump is denuclearizing North Korea.
I value policy over personality. I get the fact many folks don’t like Trump’s personality. Compared to Obama and Bush, I like Trump’s policy and effect on the economy.
May 29, 2018 at 10:07 am #86735
Billy_TParticipantI don’t see any proof of Russia collusion except for the Uranium One collusion. What do I see? Over a year of investigation and zero evidence that Trump did anything wrong. I didn’t trust Trump a year ago, but now I’m coming around. It felt good get a raise at work, pay less taxes, and now Trump is denuclearizing North Korea.
I value policy over personality. I get the fact many folks don’t like Trump’s personality. Compared to Obama and Bush, I like Trump’s policy and effect on the economy.
Here’s the collusion: The Trump Tower meeting with the Russians. Donny Jr, Jared, Paul Manafort. We have the email trail leading up to this. The Russia government offered dirt on Clinton. The Trump campaign accepted the invitation. That’s collusion. And they did it at least twice.
We also now know of numerous similar meeting with other governments, like Israel, the Ukraine, China, Qatar and Saudi Arabia, the Arab Emirates . . . all nations eager to do business with the Trump campaign and help him win the election.
That’s illegal under our campaign finance laws.
And they got their Quid Pro Quo later, with changes to our sanctions policies, help for the Saudis and Emirates against Qatar, help with China on ZTE, help with Israel and Jerusalem, along with massive arms shipments to the Middle East . . . etc. etc.
Trump lied over the weekend when he said that the “crooked” FBI and Justice didn’t warn him. They did. They warned both campaigns back in 2016, and the meetings with the Russians continued, without Trump or his associates telling the FBI. In fact, they kept denying that the meetings ever happened, until they were smoked out and had to admit it.
No innocent person or persons act like that.
May 29, 2018 at 10:10 am #86736Billy_TParticipantBtw, Ramsey,
And I say this as someone who can’t stand the Clintons and didn’t vote for her . . . the Uranium One thing is a phony scandal, investigated to death already by a GOP Congress. They found nothing. Clinton was at the head of one of nine federal departments that signed off on the deal, and there’s no actual evidence that she was involved with the negotiations, and none of the uranium left America for Russia. It can’t under the terms of the deal.
In short, it’s pure distraction and a classic case of seriously weak “whataboutism.”
May 29, 2018 at 10:44 am #86743Ramsey GlissadevilParticipantBTW Billy, Do you believe that there are stark differences between democrat and republican congressmen and women? I don’t. The Bushes, are the same as the Clintons and Obama. Many Americans deceive themselves into thinking Republican vs Democrat. Clinton and Bush partied together! They don’t like Trump because he’s an outsider who wants to stop the Globalist Gravy Train. That’s why they hate him. The lame stream media are run by the CIA.
I’ve researched Uranium One. Hillary, FBI, CIA, Obama, and others are tied to it directly. I don’t care what a bunch of Republican crooks in congress said. Why would you take the word of corrupt Republican congressmen? Or democrat congressmen? If you want, I can connect you with over 100 hours of Uranium One information. Just ask if you’re interested.
May 29, 2018 at 10:44 am #86744nittany ramModeratorEconomic growth through the first quarter of 2018.
Why do so many people think Trump is having such a positive effect on the economy?
https://www.bea.gov/newsreleases/national/gdp/gdp_glance.htm
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This reply was modified 5 years, 11 months ago by nittany ram.
May 29, 2018 at 12:25 pm #86748Billy_TParticipantBTW Billy, Do you believe that there are stark differences between democrat and republican congressmen and women? I don’t. The Bushes, are the same as the Clintons and Obama. Many Americans deceive themselves into thinking Republican vs Democrat. Clinton and Bush partied together! They don’t like Trump because he’s an outsider who wants to stop the Globalist Gravy Train. That’s why they hate him. The lame stream media are run by the CIA.
I’ve researched Uranium One. Hillary, FBI, CIA, Obama, and others are tied to it directly. I don’t care what a bunch of Republican crooks in congress said. Why would you take the word of corrupt Republican congressmen? Or democrat congressmen? If you want, I can connect you with over 100 hours of Uranium One information. Just ask if you’re interested.
Ramsey,
Please be honest. Are you the poster formerly known as BNW?
As for your questions. I wish there were stark differences on all issues between the two major parties. I wish we had wide choices, lots of options, and all kinds of alternatives. Like the ability to say no to capitalism altogether, to endless wars, to empire, the surveillance state, the carceral state, the war on drugs, etc. etc. But we don’t. On the big issues, we have degrees of difference when we need real options. We have the center-right Dems and the further right Republicans. Thanks to Trump, we have the solidifying of a far-right GOP fringe. As in, white supremacists, neo-Nazis and neo-Fascists. Trump never would have won the election without them.
Also, Trump was never an outsider. Not in the slightest. He was never going to “drain the swamp.” He IS the swamp, and he’s brought in more direct cases of Pay to Play, Self-Dealing and Grifting than any politician since Boss Tweed, and a host of billionaires for his cabinet.
As for Clinton and Bush partying together. Trump used to be a Dem and gave money to the Clintons and pols like Schumer — all the time. His children and Chelsea were friends before the election. And, Trump has signed off on all the bills brought to him by Ryan/McConnell, including the judges they wanted, the tax cuts for the rich they (and Trump) wanted, the massive deregulation they all wanted, etc. etc.
How has Trump gone against the GOP mainstream? He hasn’t. He threatened trade wars here and there, only to back off and do carveouts for various nations and industries.
As for going up against the so-called “deep state.” Think about it. He hasn’t once tried to help anyone outside his own campaign or himself, if they’ve been ensnared in the CIA/FBI/NSA web. It’s only been about him and his own legal troubles, which are beyond serious.
Let me know when he becomes an actual civil libertarian for all Americans, and I’ll happily reassess my views on at least that issue.
May 29, 2018 at 12:29 pm #86749Billy_TParticipantEconomic growth through the first quarter of 2018.
Why do so many people think Trump is having such a positive effect on the economy?
https://www.bea.gov/newsreleases/national/gdp/gdp_glance.htm
As mediocre as things were under Obama, as far as the “recovery” went . . . they’re actually slightly worse under Trump.
Lower new jobs numbers and income gains, per month, if we compare Trump so far with Obama’s last six to seven years.
And there’s this recent study too: It’s not good for nearly half of the country:
http://money.cnn.com/2018/05/17/news/economy/us-middle-class-basics-study/index.html
Almost half of US families can’t afford basics like rent and food
by Tami Luhby @Luhby May 18, 2018: 8:42 AM ETMay 29, 2018 at 2:22 pm #86755CalParticipantI subjected myself to watching about half of that interview with Giuliani and was amazed at how much the interviewer sucked.
If the media didn’t suck so bad, Trump would be getting his butt kicked by the Mueller investigation more than he already is.
Giuliani said something about the Mueller investigation being illegitimate because Comey leaked classified info to create a special counsel. And, of course, there were no follow up questions about whether Comey would be arrested if he really did something illegal.
There were no follow up questions about what happened to Trump’s belief in transparency.
There were no follow up questions about what vital information was released in the Comey memo.
I don’t watch much news, but I’ve not heard anyone question the Trump people about when this informant/spy started talking to Page, Papadopolous, etc.
The democrats, in general, don’t do a good job of holding Trump accountable. They should mention almost every time they’re on tv that Trump was off with a porn star with a 4 month old baby at home.
May 29, 2018 at 2:32 pm #86756CalParticipantEconomic growth through the first quarter of 2018.
Why do so many people think Trump is having such a positive effect on the economy?
Well the economy is continuing to improve. There were more jobs added in Trump’s first year than any year when Obama was president. (I’m looking at the Q4 data from the first table from this link:
https://data.bls.gov/pdq/SurveyOutputServlet )Wages are still growing slowly, but steadily. Maybe a bit behind Obama, but pretty much in the same ballpark.
The economy’s growth is part of Trump’s con. He’s basically using millions, if not billions, from the public coffers with his tax cut and pouring that into the economy. So it makes sense to see some improvement and benefit. At least, for a short time.
May 29, 2018 at 2:43 pm #86758Billy_TParticipantEconomic growth through the first quarter of 2018.
Why do so many people think Trump is having such a positive effect on the economy?
Well the economy is continuing to improve. There were more jobs added in Trump’s first year than any year when Obama was president. (I’m looking at the Q4 data from the first table from this link:
https://data.bls.gov/pdq/SurveyOutputServlet )Wages are still growing slowly, but steadily. Maybe a bit behind Obama, but pretty much in the same ballpark.
The economy’s growth is part of Trump’s con. He’s basically using millions, if not billions, from the public coffers with his tax cut and pouring that into the economy. So it makes sense to see some improvement and benefit. At least, for a short time.
Cal,
Do you have a working link for that jobs tally? Having troubles with it.
Last time I checked the graphs, Obama, in his last six or seven years, averaged more jobs per month than Trump has so far.
I think some of his supporters actually started counting new jobs toward Trump’s totals after the election, instead of after he actually took office.
It’s not a big deal. But I’m pretty sure Trump is lagging behind Obama in both jobs and income gains. Nittany shows it’s not so great via GDP, either.
And the United Way (ALICE project) shows that under both presidents, far too many Americans struggle(d).
May 29, 2018 at 9:01 pm #86776CalParticipantTry this link. You’ll have to check a couple of boxes and hit the “retrieve data” button.
https://www.bls.gov/webapps/legacy/cpswktab1.htm
Finding the link, I noticed the data is based on “full time jobs”. That may explain the difference between what I saw in the data and the info you’ve seen.
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